The Spreading (And Potentially Deadly) Coronavirus Epidemic....

[jonebone | 1,307]

Well, China definitely was burning bodies and the "hospital" they constructed so quickly was more like a prison with extremely tiny cell windows.  If you went in there you were locked away for at least 2 or 3 weeks and they have photo proof of those cell conditions on the net.  I'm sure China numbers were worse than reported and most people seem to understand that at least.

The rest of the story sounds embellished though. 

[Lambda | 130]

38 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

This timeline just doesn't hold water, when you consider how many people transit the impacted areas of China and that we are JUST NOW getting confirmed cases and deaths in western countries.

I definitely don't believe the stats published by China, but I think it is extremely unlikely that people "in the know" were fleeing this particular viral outbreak as early as December.

I felt the same way when I first heard this. I tend to agree, even now, but there are a few things that I’ve considered which make the idea more plausible:

1) The distributor could have misspoken in terms of translation... meaning: the client may have thought he said Dec 5, when the distributor actually meant Dec 15. This is a definite possibility.

2) Dr. LI only recognized the issues with the patients who were dying at about Christmas, Dec 25. Given the two week incubation, that puts the initial infection back to Dec10,11. There we’re undoubtedly many infections already running rampant at that time, and there would have to be in order for a doctor to recognize a trend and see that something was out of the ordinary.

3) In the early days of the outbreak, (November? Late October?), the infection was already being witnessed, however everybody was classifying it wrong. There are a slew of reports of individuals dying in the region, and the cause of death was all attributed simply to pneumonia. (Also consider that many patients simply get a “cold” or go completely asymptomatic while further transmitting the bug). This also makes perfect sense on the timeline of Dr Lis recognition of the disease. It’s popping up for over a month or longer and pneumonia seems to have an unusually high frequency in deadly cases. Upon looking into it, Dr LI recognizes the infection as a coronavirus, but mistakes it for SARS, and finally issues a warning to close friends on Dec 30.

4) As stated in what was told to me by my client, the distributor was a worth a lot of money. When I say multi-millionaire, we’re talking 3-400 million dollars, not something like 5 million. He also had some friends in higher places, he knew many people in government, and knew insiders that were fleeing as well. I have to consider the possibility that maybe he got good information very early on and decided to act on it. This would also beg the question as to whether Dr Li was truly the first one to recognize the bug.... or if he was simply the first one to speak up. I have to consider the fact that maybe someone DID know about this beforehand and Dr Li was simply the first to put out a warning... he made a warning in a private chat, and to only a few people on Dec30... by Jan 3 he was in police custody for questioning and “punishment”... and then dies shortly after.

 

all in all, like I said, I’m not sure what to believe. I happen to agree with you. The timeline gets harder to swallow with the Dec 5 date, but it’s not impossible, and I have to consider that there are probably a slew of facts that everyone is entirely in the dark about... and it may remain that way forever, unfortunately.

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

38 minutes ago, Lambda said:

I felt the same way when I first heard this. I tend to agree, even now, but there are a few things that I’ve considered which make the idea more plausible:

1) The distributor could have misspoken in terms of translation... meaning: the client may have thought he said Dec 5, when the distributor actually meant Dec 15. This is a definite possibility.

2) Dr. LI only recognized the issues with the patients who were dying at about Christmas, Dec 25. Given the two week incubation, that puts the initial infection back to Dec10,11. There we’re undoubtedly many infections already running rampant at that time, and there would have to be in order for a doctor to recognize a trend and see that something was out of the ordinary.

3) In the early days of the outbreak, (November? Late October?), the infection was already being witnessed, however everybody was classifying it wrong. There are a slew of reports of individuals dying in the region, and the cause of death was all attributed simply to pneumonia. (Also consider that many patients simply get a “cold” or go completely asymptomatic while further transmitting the bug). This also makes perfect sense on the timeline of Dr Lis recognition of the disease. It’s popping up for over a month or longer and pneumonia seems to have an unusually high frequency in deadly cases. Upon looking into it, Dr LI recognizes the infection as a coronavirus, but mistakes it for SARS, and finally issues a warning to close friends on Dec 30.

4) As stated in what was told to me by my client, the distributor was a worth a lot of money. When I say multi-millionaire, we’re talking 3-400 million dollars, not something like 5 million. He also had some friends in higher places, he knew many people in government, and knew insiders that were fleeing as well. I have to consider the possibility that maybe he got good information very early on and decided to act on it. This would also beg the question as to whether Dr Li was truly the first one to recognize the bug.... or if he was simply the first one to speak up. I have to consider the fact that maybe someone DID know about this beforehand and Dr Li was simply the first to put out a warning... he made a warning in a private chat, and to only a few people on Dec30... by Jan 3 he was in police custody for questioning and “punishment”... and then dies shortly after.

 

all in all, like I said, I’m not sure what to believe. I happen to agree with you. The timeline gets harder to swallow with the Dec 5 date, but it’s not impossible, and I have to consider that there are probably a slew of facts that everyone is entirely in the dark about... and it may remain that way forever, unfortunately.

 

My point is, you can't have an outbreak so severe that China has built a special crematory to handle the bodies on a timeline where that build-up happened so far before cases became apparent in the west.

It just doesn't line up.

 

I would be totally willing to believe that China had thugs welding doors shut from day 1.

Tooling up a crematorium on that timeline is extreme even by China's standards, unless they were already planning to incinerate their muslim-minority population as a separate crime against humanity and just happened to shift focus to severely ill elderly at the last minute.

But I don't think that would ever be their plan for their detained minorities, since they are known to be harvesting their organs for transplants.

 

EDIT:  they definitely spooled up their cremations, big time, I just have a hard time believing it was anything close to the timeline you're hearing about 3rd hand.

Edited March 9, 2020 by arch_8ngel

[Lambda | 130]

54 minutes ago, jonebone said:

Well, China definitely was burning bodies and the "hospital" they constructed so quickly was more like a prison with extremely tiny cell windows.  If you went in there you were locked away for at least 2 or 3 weeks and they have photo proof of those cell conditions on the net.  I'm sure China numbers were worse than reported and most people seem to understand that at least.

The rest of the story sounds embellished though. 

I tend to agree 100%. I had to take all of this with a massive grain of salt when I heard it, and as stated, it almost sounds like some sort of movie plot. 
I did a little digging and found this:

Not that YouTube should trusted for news, but the company MTD seems to have a reasonably reliable reputation after looking into them?

I genuinely have no clue what to believe out of China. All I know is that fear tends to spread faster than the virus itself haha. Gotta keep a level head about these things.

 

[Startyde | 175]

This is the most horrific thing I've read in a long while. 

[kuriatsu | 65]

lambda, that sounds like some creepy pasta stuff that is unrivaled by even that majoras mask thing or the glitchy charizard.

Its downright chilling, I WANT to think that, that type of thing couldn't happen, but.....its definitely possible...

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

13 minutes ago, Lambda said:

I tend to agree 100%. I had to take all of this with a massive grain of salt when I heard it, and as stated, it almost sounds like some sort of movie plot. 
I did a little digging and found this:

Not that YouTube should trusted for news, but the company MTD seems to have a reasonably reliable reputation after looking into them?

I genuinely have no clue what to believe out of China. All I know is that fear tends to spread faster than the virus itself haha. Gotta keep a level head about these things.

 

Do a search on "NTD News" -- they are a "Falun Gong" group, which China considers to be cultists and anti-china propaganda.

It would be hard to take anything they say to the negative about China at face value.

(would obviously be AT LEAST AS SKEPTICAL of any official news from China -- not saying to "trust china" with the above, just pointing out that you would have a hard time finding a more extreme anti-chinese-government biased source)

Edited March 9, 2020 by arch_8ngel

[Lambda | 130]

25 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

 

My point is, you can't have an outbreak so severe that China has built a special crematory to handle the bodies on a timeline where that build-up happened so far before cases became apparent in the west.

It just doesn't line up.

 

I would be totally willing to believe that China had thugs welding doors shut from day 1.

Tooling up a crematorium on that timeline is extreme even by China's standards, unless they were already planning to incinerate their muslim-minority population as a separate crime against humanity and just happened to shift focus to severely ill elderly at the last minute.

But I don't think that would ever be their plan for their detained minorities, since they are known to be harvesting their organs for transplants.

Yes 100% agreed. This portion may have been stated oddly, so I’ll clarify. The factory always existed. There was some sort of annex added to it over summer of 19, which was what originally prompted my client to ask about it during his last visit. When he got a bit of a response from his distributor, he mentioned that the purpose of the factory has changed multiple times, but it’s completely controlled by the state. He asked about the factory because his product is made in a factory and I guess it sparked his interest? Not sure to be honest.

 

I recently heard about the Muslim camps. That’s some crazy stuff... I know state control matters more to China than their own people. Ugh I don’t even wanna think about organ harvesting... that’s some sickening stuff. 

This whole situation needs to end so we can all get back to life as usual without all the fear mongering. News isn’t even news anymore... even the business channels... it’s all just updates on COVID-19 stats.

[Lambda | 130]

23 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

Do a search on "NTD News" -- they are a "Falun Gong" group, which China considers to be cultists and anti-china propaganda.

It would be hard to take anything they say to the negative about China at face value.

(would obviously be AT LEAST AS SKEPTICAL of any official news from China -- not saying to "trust china" with the above, just pointing out that you would have a hard time finding a more extreme anti-chinese-government biased source)

Ahh okay, when I searched it, New Tang Dynasty was what came up, so I’m guessing they’re different to an extent? They came up as relatively factual... on at the same token I could totally see China denouncing an Anti-Commie newsgroup as a cult.

 (I definitely don’t trust a YouTube video for factual news either way haha... there would have to be some far more verified sources for me to even consider this being real, but it’s a spooky narrative nonetheless).
Legitimately hope this is all bullshit.

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

1 minute ago, Lambda said:

Ahh okay, when I searched it, New Tang Dynasty was what came up, so I’m guessing they’re different to an extent? They came up as relatively factual... on at the same token I could totally see China denouncing an Anti-Commie newsgroup as a cult.

 (I definitely don’t trust a YouTube video for factual news either way haha... there would have to be some far more verified sources for me to even consider this being real, but it’s a spooky narrative nonetheless).
Legitimately hope this is all bullshit.

New Tang Dynasty is what the acronym means, but read more about what that group actually is.

Yes they are "generally factual", but they have a HEAVY BIAS against China/Chinese-government.

If they are the sole source for major news like this, it doesn't really make sense that other sources wouldn't have picked up a legitimate story of that magnitude.

[Lambda | 130]

31 minutes ago, kuriatsu said:

lambda, that sounds like some creepy pasta stuff that is unrivaled by even that majoras mask thing or the glitchy charizard.

Its downright chilling, I WANT to think that, that type of thing couldn't happen, but.....its definitely possible...

You and me both... I wanted to cut him off halfway thru the phone call and tell him I didn’t even want to hear anymore. I don’t want to believe any of this... I like believing that people are better than what this guy explained to me.

[Lambda | 130]

3 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

New Tang Dynasty is what the acronym means, but read more about what that group actually is.

Yes they are "generally factual", but they have a HEAVY BIAS against China/Chinese-government.

If they are the sole source for major news like this, it doesn't really make sense that other sources wouldn't have picked up a legitimate story of that magnitude.

100% agreed. 
 

I can’t get that idea about organ harvesting out of my head now... ugh. Did they get a whistleblower to alert people to the practice or something? Ugh that’s so God-awful. I saw a report on the camps, but I hadn’t heard anything about that.

Yet another story I want to believe isn’t true

[phart010 | 1,707]

17 hours ago, GPX said:

Vintage TP? You mean modern TP?

Yea people are only hoarding modern TP because they think it will be worth something someday. But it won’t be cuz it’s too common. 

Everyone was just using vintage TP to wipe with them tossed it out, nobody thought to keep it. That’s why it’s so hard to come by and everyone wants it so bad 

[GPX | 1,369]

1 hour ago, Lambda said:

I tend to agree 100%. I had to take all of this with a massive grain of salt when I heard it, and as stated, it almost sounds like some sort of movie plot. 
I did a little digging and found this:

Not that YouTube should trusted for news, but the company MTD seems to have a reasonably reliable reputation after looking into them?

I genuinely have no clue what to believe out of China. All I know is that fear tends to spread faster than the virus itself haha. Gotta keep a level head about these things.

 

If someone was to be carried off in a body bag while still alive/moving, I truly doubt any ordinary public person would be able to see this. There are many other possibilities to this video:

- the lady could have been hallucinating when she was in hospital.

- she could be lying 

- if true, why didn’t they just whack the person unconscious in the bag or top him up with sedatives first before carrying him away?

- if true, the person could have been carried off in an isolation room rather than to be cremated.

- if true, the person may well be unconscious but could make involuntary jerks or perhaps even a seizure.

———————————

I did mention this in an earlier post regarding infections in general. 2 things to look for:

1. Rate of transmission/spread

2. When infected, the rate of mortality and/or significant morbidity.

A lot of those worried about number 1 (in the above) are not focusing on number 2. Right about now, the corona virus is seemingly a parallel to the significance of a severe form of flu or a pneumonia. It is threatening for those over 65 but manageable for most cases under 65. 

[Lambda | 130]

45 minutes ago, GPX said:

If someone was to be carried off in a body bag while still alive/moving, I truly doubt any ordinary public person would be able to see this. There are many other possibilities to this video:

- the lady could have been hallucinating when she was in hospital.

- she could be lying 

- if true, why didn’t they just whack the person unconscious in the bag or top him up with sedatives first before carrying him away?

- if true, the person could have been carried off in an isolation room rather than to be cremated.

- if true, the person may well be unconscious but could make involuntary jerks or perhaps even a seizure.

———————————

I did mention this in an earlier post regarding infections in general. 2 things to look for:

1. Rate of transmission/spread

2. When infected, the rate of mortality and/or significant morbidity.

A lot of those worried about number 1 (in the above) are not focusing on number 2. Right about now, the corona virus is seemingly a parallel to the significance of a severe form of flu or a pneumonia. It is threatening for those over 65 but manageable for most cases under 65. 

Agreed.

I believe a lot of the video is basic stock footage from China, besides the car ride dialogue... which id still want a translator to confirm was what was actually being said... and even that could be staged.

According to my brother (PharmD), coronavirus family usually has 1 of the 2 items you mentioned above. Highly transmissible or high mortality... but rarely both at the same time. The R-0 of this thing isn’t even close to being fully realized yet. There’s still a lot of data that needs to be seen and verified. I forget his name so I can’t source it but a local news station did an interview with a well known virologist and he stated that he wouldn’t be surprised if in a year or two we learn that mortality is <1%. 
 

I don’t take the video seriously, but it definitely begs the question as to why people are making these accusations... unless smearing China is really just the goal. 
Just gotta take it all with a grain of salt. Definitely can’t believe everything you see on the net.

[MrWunderful | 2,927]

I wouldnt mind a few weeks off, to just chill around the house and get some stuff done

 

Seriously though, I am keeping things cleaner now. Hopefully this UV blue light phone cleaner thing I bought before all this went down actually works! (Using alcohol wipes too)

[Lambda | 130]

1 hour ago, MrWunderful said:

Seriously though, I am keeping things cleaner now. Hopefully this UV blue light phone cleaner thing I bought before all this went down actually works! (Using alcohol wipes too)

I’ve been using alcohol pads on my phone as well. My company actually just put out a great article that I’ll link to here when I grab the link. Talks about exactly that... and how an insurance co (Insurance2Go) did a study and found your phone 3X! Dirtier than a public toilet seat! I’ll post it as soon as I find it.

btw... I’m not sure if you remember me, but I was the guy who bought your Star Keeper back on NA

Edited March 10, 2020 by Lambda

[MrWunderful | 2,927]

8 minutes ago, Lambda said:

I’ve been using alcohol pads on my phone as well. My company actually just put out a great article that I’ll link to here when I grab the link. Talks about exactly that... and how an insurance co (Insurance2Go) did a study and found your phone 3X! Dirtier than a public toilet seat! I’ll post it as soon as I find it.

btw... I’m not sure if you remember me, but I was the guy who bought your Star Keeper back on NA

Nice! Hope you are enjoying it. 

[Tulpa | 3,492]

Hand sanitizer is worth its weight in gold here. It won't be until March 17th until we get more.

 

Fortunately, I have a healthy supply of Lysol cleaner, so we will be drenching everything the public touches with that stuff.

[Lambda | 130]

1 hour ago, MrWunderful said:

Nice! Hope you are enjoying it. 

Without a doubt!! Been playing it for a while now!

[Lambda | 130]

49 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

Hand sanitizer is worth its weight in gold here. It won't be until March 17th until we get more.

 

Fortunately, I have a healthy supply of Lysol cleaner, so we will be drenching everything the public touches with that stuff.

Haha if alcohol wipes become scarce, chlorine is equally as effective and presumably less expensive since a majority of the public hasn’t realized that yet (haven’t seen price gouging on chlorine yet )

[fcgamer | 4,723]

I've heard some stories similar to the ones posted above, some may have been from the same witness sources, I don't know.

Patients being burned alive:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3881683

Welding Houses:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3874495

Deaths?:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3875039

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3874013

Skewing numbers:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3883982

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3878664

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3874490

Conditions of Nurses in Wuhan:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3882098

Hospital conditions:

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3876720

https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3870468

 

And the list goes on. This source is likely to be biased, but it's a starting point perhaps, from which one can choose to dig deeper if he or she desires. 

[Teh_Lurv | 254]

It's growing increasingly likely E3 will be cancelled this year. With big devs gradually moving away from E3, this might be the death knell for the expo:

 

 

Edited March 11, 2020 by Teh_Lurv

[fcgamer | 4,723]

Very sad always wanted to make it there at least once.

[NZCollector | 107]

52 minutes ago, Teh_Lurv said:

It's growing increasingly likely E3 will be cancelled this year. With big devs gradually moving away from E3, this might be the death knell for the expo:

 

 

It sucks for sure, but I personally stopped caring about E3 as an expo after they released the private information of hundreds of media attendants last year. Accident or not, it's baffling that such a flaw in their security was possible.