The President of the US has been impeached

[Quest4Nes | 376]

yes we get. Hes orange, overweight and old. Yawn. Orange Man Bad. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Quest4Nes

[Lincoln | 230]

27 minutes ago, Quest4Nes said:

yes we get. Hes orange, overweight and old. Yawn. Orange Man Bad. 

well as long as you bring it up, there's a lot to read into those things.

the very obviously terrible tanner speaks to poor judgment, or a pathological need to hide his real self.

age isn't really an issue, except he shows signs of dementia. the inability to properly apply the tanner is probably a sign of that too.

and it's not just that he's overweight, but he lies about it, along with his height and a number of other things that people can make educated guesses on.

all this in the man who represents us to the world and people here as some kind of savior as he turns the screws into them to enrich himself and his cronies.

[Quest4Nes | 376]

could you be anymore tribalistic?  You missed your calling. You need to be on CNN

[Lincoln | 230]

4 minutes ago, Quest4Nes said:

could you be anymore tribalistic?  You missed your calling. You need to be on CNN

one of us is making observations and drawing conclusions and the other is name calling. maybe do some self reflection on your inability to think critically about this.

[Quest4Nes | 376]

Yeah because all Ive seen from you is that critical thinking. Not a talking point cliche at all.

 

Dude , you take this stuff way too personal/seriously. Just enjoy the ride. This presidency has been a trip. Way more fun when you just sit back and laugh instead of getting all mad about stuff. I was very skeptical at first, but man dude is a stand up comedian. His press conferences generally have me laughing pretty good. Nothing is that bad. Its ok to disagree with policy, but everything isnt the end of the world or so hyperbole extreme like you make it out to be.

Edited February 9, 2020 by Quest4Nes

[fcgamer | 4,729]

Trump is awesome, nothing more to say.

[Californication | 1,477]

6 hours ago, Rooster said:

W also had to deal with 9/11 and Trump hasn't had any similar emergencies to deal with yet.

If you mean that 9/11 was a crises and W. used American's fear at the time to get us into Iraq when there were not real grounds, I definetly agree.

God knows they tried to manufacture a war with Venezuela and Iran and just haven't been able to get the public on board. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Californication

[Estil | 1,265]

7 hours ago, fcgamer said:

Trump is awesome, nothing more to say.

Wow, there's actually a pro-Trump person here?  I'm impressed.  Because so far I've seen at least 5-6 here who most definitely can't stand the guy.  It certainly would be nice to have a more fair and balanced about that sort of thing here...but then again this is a gaming place, not a political place.  I don't think I exactly qualify as a pro-Trumper but I would most definitely rather give him the benefit of the doubt than the radical left, especially the ones that beat up/break stuff and punch/slug people just for wearing MAGA caps while hypocritically shouting "Love Trumps hate!!"  I find it especially telling that you hear anti-Trump/celebs/activists/politicians and such scream "Orange Man bad!!" and such yet they hardly ever talk specific policy.  Then again seeing the mostly super liberal/anti-Trump Hollywood/celebs losing their minds is almost worth the Trump presidency by itself!   Certainly much better than their sickening/gagging fanboyism of Obama back in his day and especially the Hillary fanboyism coming from the media back in 2016.  

That is, what is it about the specific issues that Trump is doing and if he's wrong, what would be the right course of action for that issue instead?  I had already talked about illegal immigration over at the old NA forum and it seemed be to a much fairer and balanced discussion as opposed to here where seemingly nearly everyone on this thread/topic so far is big time anti-Trump.  As for Trump's other signature issue, the economy, I did find the economic part of his SOTU a little "too good to be true" (and if the economy is indeed going swell (which would be of course super nice), I sure wouldn't want to jinx it!!).  Admittedly the economy as well as gov't health care (remember Obamacare was his signature issue by far) are a couple of issues that are waaaaaay too complicated for me to make heads or tails about one way or the other...but then again apparently even the very best and brightest of those fields all these many decades haven't come close to the ideal solution for either part so you know, what chance would a regular guy like myself have?

 

As for a few issues that you do currently hear about sometimes on the news and such, I think I could make at least a convincing case/argument for, how about (someone can make separate topics/discussions for any of these if they'd like):

1. Why freedom of speech is so absolutely critical and important, especially at colleges/universities.  And to think I thought traditionally it was the left who was all about free speech (in fact wasn't Berkeley in the late 60s considered the cradle of modern American liberalism and their flavor of free speech/activism?) and often lamented about why conservatives were so gung ho about the 2nd Amendment but not nearly as much so about the 1st?  Now all of a sudden free speech is a right wing thing??  Talk about the most perfect example of a complete 180 flip I've seen of any issue!!

2. Illegal immigration enforcement, which I had already touched on at the old NA place.

3. The $15/hr minimum wage movement.  While the min wage is indeed long overdue for an increase (with apologies to the libertarians who would ideally like no minimum wage at all, we need some min wage) $15/hr all at once is just way too much way too soon as we've already seen.

4. TG's in the military; TG's who are on regular hormones/drugs/whatever it is they need to transition properly (sorry I don't know exactly how that all works) as well as anyone else who must be on some kind of regular scheduled drugs/injections/whatever (such as diabetics) I really think would be a bad idea for them to be in the military because often in combat situations (which everyone in the armed forces faces that possiblity to some degree; after all in the military you gotta go where they send you and assign you at a moment's notice) and such it's hard enough just to get basic provisions like food/water and it would not be good at all for someone to be suddenly cut off on any of the above and end up getting their physical/mental well being in serious jeopardy and a threat to themselves and the others.  So while many no doubt expect those who oppose TG's in the military to only being doing it just to be mean and transphobic, I really honest to goodness think it'd put them in danger if they were in the military for the above reasons (sorry if I'm not explaining it quite right).

5. Gov't student loan forgiveness; as a former college student myself (thankfully I didn't have too much debt) the idea certainly sounds quite nice and I hope there is a way it can be done in some form.  But how in the world can the gov't afford it (especially to the extent some of the D contenders would like) without first bringing down the huge annual gov't deficit?

Edited February 9, 2020 by Estil

[Teh_Lurv | 254]

3 hours ago, Estil said:

5. Gov't student loan forgiveness; as a former college student myself (thankfully I didn't have too much debt) the idea certainly sounds quite nice and I hope there is a way it can be done in some form.  But how in the world can the gov't afford it (especially to the extent some of the D contenders would like) without first bringing down the huge annual gov't deficit?

There was (IMO) a very good proposal put forth by a gentleman named A. Wayne Johnson, a former Trump administration DoE official, appointee of Betsy DeVos, and at one point was the head of the Office of Federal Student Aid. He resigned late last year and publicly stated that the Federal student loan program was "fundamentally broken". Rather than to keep trying to collect what will never get repaid, he proposed mass student loan forgiveness:

Quote

Mr. Johnson proposes forgiving up to $50,000 for anyone with federal student-loan debt, about $925 billion, he said. Nearly 37 million borrowers would have their entire student-loan balances canceled under the plan, he said.

He would also advocate for a tax credit of up to $50,000 for people who already repaid student debt, which he sees as key to attracting wider support for canceling student debt.

Mr. Johnson suggested paying for the plan largely with a 1% tax on corporate earnings.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-education-official-to-resign-and-call-for-mass-student-loan-forgiveness-11571909400?shareToken=st9246d46efcc5434dbc06eaeebbee03d5

This isn't coming from a wild-eyed hippie liberal, but a former Trump/DeVos official who had been directly looking at the Federal student loan financial books.

[Link | 2,714]

3 hours ago, Estil said:

Now all of a sudden free speech is a right wing thing?? 

In a twisted way, yes. First, the 1st amendment is that the government shall not infringe the right. Not what individuals do or don’t. Second, it expressly prohibits creating danger, which the blood & soil types willfully disregard.

3 hours ago, Estil said:

I really honest to goodness think it'd put them in danger if they were in the military for the above reasons

They and their doctors can decide if it’s safe for them. 

3 hours ago, Estil said:

how in the world can the gov't afford it (especially to the extent some of the D contenders would like) without first bringing down the huge annual gov't deficit?

A change in priorities. That you don’t get this tells me you are not looking in the right places to understand there is actually much discussion of “specific policy” and what and how it is, far beyond “screaming ‘Orange Man bad!!’”

 

[Link | 2,714]

14 hours ago, Quest4Nes said:

yes we get. Hes orange, overweight and old. Yawn. Orange Man Bad. 

So should we “sit back and laugh” at him or not?

[Kguillemette | 1,545]

45 minutes ago, Link said:

In a twisted way, yes. First, the 1st amendment is that the government shall not infringe the right. Not what individuals do or don’t. Second, it expressly prohibits creating danger, which the blood & soil types willfully disregard.

They and their doctors can decide if it’s safe for them. 

A change in priorities. That you don’t get this tells me you are not looking in the right places to understand there is actually much discussion of “specific policy” and what and how it is, far beyond “screaming ‘Orange Man bad!!’”

 

What change in priorities do you suggest, then? 

[Link | 2,714]

3 minutes ago, Kguillemette said:

What change in priorities do you suggest, then? 

Scale back the military budget. Decrease waste. Eliminate many tax loopholes. Increase marginal rates. 

[Tulpa | 3,516]

59 minutes ago, Link said:

So should we “sit back and laugh” at him or not?

Only when he's "owning the libs", apparently.

Otherwise, it's not respecting the office, because Obama was never criticized for wearing a tan suit or anything.

 

[Tulpa | 3,516]

4 hours ago, Estil said:

 liberal/anti-Trump Hollywood/celebs losing their minds is almost worth the Trump presidency by itself!   Certainly much better than their sickening/gagging fanboyism of Obama back in his day and especially the Hillary fanboyism coming from the media back in 2016.  

 

You don't think Trump is getting the fanboy treatment? What with people wanting his children to take over the presidency like we're returning to a goddamn monarchy. We fought a war to get away from that shit.

Also, if the main reason you want Trump is so he can inflict pain on people you disagree with, I would venture that it's not exactly the most healthy of mindsets. Maybe perhaps reevaluate what is actually important to you.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,549]

4 hours ago, Estil said:

5. Gov't student loan forgiveness; as a former college student myself (thankfully I didn't have too much debt) the idea certainly sounds quite nice and I hope there is a way it can be done in some form.  But how in the world can the gov't afford it (especially to the extent some of the D contenders would like) without first bringing down the huge annual gov't deficit?

Well we could always get rid of scary evil liberal socialist programs.  Like... disability.

[coffeewithmrsaturn | 100]

On 2/6/2020 at 12:58 PM, Tanooki said:

...Trump sucks, Pelosi is equally human garbage...

Thankfully, other people have already addressed your post, so I'll just add that false equivalency turning into cynicism is exactly what Republicans want, and it perpetuates the status quo of politics.

[coffeewithmrsaturn | 100]

12 hours ago, Quest4Nes said:

"Dude , you take this stuff way too personal/seriously. Just enjoy the ride. This presidency has been a trip. Way more fun when you just sit back and laugh instead of getting all mad about stuff."

No offense intended, but this was very unsettling to read.  I mean, so many of his policies do affect people personally and seriously, and the direction of our country and precedents set by this president/senate are gravely serious.

[Kguillemette | 1,545]

27 minutes ago, Link said:

Scale back the military budget. Decrease waste. Eliminate many tax loopholes. Increase marginal rates. 

You won't sell many on decreasing military budgets. People enjoy the security a strong military brings.

 

Increase marginal rates, you mean raise taxes? Thats another tough sell.

 

Finally, isn't closing tax loopholes a big part of the tax cut from a couple years ago? Lower the corporate tax rate while closing loopholes? At least that's how it was sold.

 

[Link | 2,714]

5 minutes ago, Kguillemette said:

You won't sell many on decreasing military budgets. People enjoy the security a strong military brings.

I don’t give a shit. It’s bloated and it’s a hole for crony and lobbyist contractors. It’s ridiculous and there is no good reason for it to be as excessive as it is. I’m disappointed that people are so one-note on this. 

8 minutes ago, Kguillemette said:

Increase marginal rates, you mean raise taxes? Thats another tough sell.

And this. The highest marginal rate during and post WWII was 90%. (And that was a true economic boom period, unlike what we have going right now where rich get richer but poor and lower middle get poorer, majority of new jobs are low quality and low pay, etc)

If that is a big scary number to anyone, they fundamentally do not know what it means. It is not 90% of anyone’s income or worth, and it is a drop in the bucket for those affected, which is very, very few people.

28 minutes ago, Kguillemette said:

Finally, isn't closing tax loopholes a big part of the tax cut from a couple years ago? Lower the corporate tax rate while closing loopholes? At least that's how it was sold.

Yes, that is how they sold it. Turns out they only did the first part. They also said most people would be able to file their taxes on a postcard. 

[Tulpa | 3,516]

8 minutes ago, Link said:

 

And this. The highest marginal rate during and post WWII was 90%. (And that was a true economic boom period, unlike what we have going right now where rich get richer but poor and lower middle get poorer, majority of new jobs are low quality and low pay, etc)

If that is a big scary number to anyone, they fundamentally do not know what it means. It is not 90% of anyone’s income or worth, and it is a drop in the bucket for those affected, which is very, very few people.

 

Yeah, it's funny how some people want us to return to the 1950s, except for the tax rates. Heck they throw a conniption when the Clinton era 39% rates are floated. That's not even half of the historical high.

 

[Estil | 1,265]

1 hour ago, Tulpa said:

You don't think Trump is getting the fanboy treatment?

I meant and specifically said from the media and Hollywood, not the rank and file.

As for the shirt you cited I wouldn't take that too seriously either (who knows if any of them or even Pence for that matter is even interested in being President).  As I'll once again quote Fresh Prince from the pilot episode...

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Estil

[Tulpa | 3,516]

2 minutes ago, Estil said:

I meant and specifically said from the media and Hollywood, not the rank and file.

And Fox News and celebs like Kanye West, James Woods, Dean Cain and Chuck Woolery are fanboying just as hard.

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Tulpa

[Estil | 1,265]

I almost forgot to mention this regarding the whole lowering the deficit thing...remember how in the late 90s we actually had a surplus and how it was possible then?  Very simple.  Three magic words.

Line. Item. Veto.

And did you know that was put into place by a Republican Congress and signed into law by a Democratic President?  Yes you heard that right, Congress chose to give the President from the opposing party an upgrade to one of his signature powers (veto).  The idea being that the President/governor (at state level) can cross out pork barrel stuff and such and sign the rest of it into law.  The Supreme Court a few years later however struck it down insisting that the President's veto power is an "all or nothing" sort of deal.  So obviously we'd need a Constitutional Amendment to bring it back and frankly I don't think it'd be realistically possible to significantly cut the deficit without it.

[Link | 2,714]

6 hours ago, Estil said:

But how in the world can the gov't afford it (especially to the extent some of the D contenders would like) without first bringing down the huge annual gov't deficit?

blah blah screaming “Raise Taxes Bad!!”

 

We can guarantee higher education as a right for all and cancel all student debt for an estimated $2.2 trillion. To pay for this, we will impose a tax of a fraction of a percent on Wall Street speculators who nearly destroyed the economy a decade ago. This Wall Street speculation tax will raise $2.4 trillion over the next ten years. It works by placing a 0.5 percent tax on stock trades – 50 cents on every $100 of stock – a 0.1 percent fee on bond trades, and a 0.005 percent fee on derivative trades.

If Wall Street can be bailed out for several trillion dollars, 45 million Americans can and will be bailed out of the $1.6 trillion burden of student loan debt and we can provide free college for all. Some 40 countries throughout the world have imposed a similar tax, including Britain, South Korea, Hong Kong, Brazil, Germany, France, Switzerland and China.