SMW is not great if you compare it to SMB3... Also, SMB2 stuff

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

1 hour ago, Tulpa said:

I don't want to do that. I want to begin exactly where I left off, or close to it. Nor does the whistle allow me to have multiple saves.

The whistles are a poor crutch for a proper save method.

Ninja gaiden, battletoads, castlevania, contra….no saves is the culture of the nes. They gave you the whistle and you still cry. 

39 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Yeah, without any of the items or men you had from your previous game, and without any of the levels you had already completed on that World.  SMB3 is like a 9.8 out of 10, but with a battery it would have been one of the few 10/10's in existence...

Items and men? What are we talking about here, A mushroom and leaf you don’t actually need but can find right away in any stage you enter? You start with 5 lives and they aren’t hard to accumulate.

[Estil | 1,264]

7 hours ago, Tanooki said:

One correction on that early post. Super Mario World was not at any time ever rushed along or rushed out.  The game on paper had started as far back as 1986-87 before Super Mario 2(USA) came out.  It was in actual development, cold restarts and all, for 3 years.

Oh and you're all wrong, the correct answer here is Super Mario All-Stars+World is the best version, because neither are separated.  It's one big game, so now you're not forced to choose favorites.

You know I always did wonder how far ahead Nintendo has thought over the years.  You mean they honest to goodness started planning for SMB4 (as World was known as at first) a full year or two before SMB3 came out in Japan?  Just how far ahead did they plan in those days?

[Tulpa | 3,494]

28 minutes ago, docile tapeworm said:

Ninja gaiden, battletoads, castlevania, contra….no saves is the culture of the nes. They gave you the whistle and you still cry.

Those games are a half hour at most, Battletoads maybe 45 minutes, tops.

SMB3 complete is like two and a half.

If no saves is the culture, how did both Zeldas, Kirby, every major RPG and all the Koei games get battery saves? Anything over an hour needs a battery.

They can take their whistle and shove it where the sun don't shine. Quit making excuses and accept that SMB3 has one glaring flaw. It wasn't some genius move by the developers, it was a cheap way around saving a battery.

Edited June 26, 2022 by Tulpa

[ZeldaFreak | 3,600]

10 hours ago, Tulpa said:

Careful, you'll get the SMB3 apologists who insist that the lack of battery is "part of the experience" and not a flaw in their favorite game.

Y'know, I really thought this was a joke, and it wouldn't actually happen.

But, uh, here we are.

[Tulpa | 3,494]

Just now, ZeldaFreak said:

Y'know, I really thought this was a joke, and it wouldn't actually happen.

But, uh, here we are.

Hey, I call 'em as I see 'em.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

24 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

Those games are a half hour at most, Battletoads maybe 45 minutes, tops.

SMB3 complete is like two and a half.

If no saves is the culture, how did both Zeldas, Kirby, every major RPG and all the Koei games get battery saves? Anything over an hour needs a battery.

They can take their whistle and shove it where the sun don't shine. Quit making excuses and accept that SMB3 has one glaring flaw. It wasn't some genius move by the developers, it was a cheap way around saving a battery.

Totally agree, excepting that SMB3 is like a two and a half hour game for us now as grown men who have honed our skills and know the game front to back; when I was a little kid, it used to take my li'l buddies and I hours and hours to get to World 8 - no joke - it was an all-day affair...

[Lynda Monica | 350]

If we're going to keep comparing the two games, can most people agree that the ending sequence and "credits" to Mario 3 sucks, and the ending to Super Mario World is still satisfying and wonderful to sit through every time?

I feel like that's pretty hard to argue in Mario 3's favour.

Edited June 26, 2022 by Lynda Monica

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

1 hour ago, Tulpa said:

Those games are a half hour at most, Battletoads maybe 45 minutes, tops.

SMB3 complete is like two and a half.

If no saves is the culture, how did both Zeldas, Kirby, every major RPG and all the Koei games get battery saves? Anything over an hour needs a battery.

They can take their whistle and shove it where the sun don't shine. Quit making excuses and accept that SMB3 has one glaring flaw. It wasn't some genius move by the developers, it was a cheap way around saving a battery.

So one platformer super late in the life of the nes, rpg’s and time is your example for justifying crying about not having a save feature in smb3 a platformer from 1988. You don’t deserve to have the gyaraga as your avatar…..oh wait that’s the ship from that overrated compile parody. Do you really think they didn’t put a battery in smb3 because they were cheap? Please. It was to weed out the casuals from experiencing the true masterpiece that is smb3

48 minutes ago, ZeldaFreak said:

Y'know, I really thought this was a joke, and it wouldn't actually happen.

But, uh, here we are.

I had heard/read the whistle argument somewhere before and when tulpa hinted I couldn’t help but pull his strings a bit.

38 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Totally agree, excepting that SMB3 is like a two and a half hour game for us now as grown men who have honed our skills and know the game front to back; when I was a little kid, it used to take my li'l buddies and I hours and hours to get to World 8 - no joke - it was an all-day affair...

I’m gonna be honest. I never thought once as a kid or an adult “dang smb3 needs a save feature” and I never heard anybody complain about how long the game was until I heard it on Nintendoage. I like my shooters because they are not two hour events but the fact I’m an old fart with no time or patience shouldn’t take away any greatness that is SMB3

[Tulpa | 3,494]

1 minute ago, docile tapeworm said:

So one platformer super late in the life of the nes, rpg’s and time is your example for justifying crying about not having a save feature in smb3 a platformer from 1988. You don’t deserve to have the gyaraga as your avatar…..oh wait that’s the ship from that overrated compile parody. Do you really think they didn’t put a battery in smb3 because they were cheap? Please. It was to weed out the casuals from experiencing the true masterpiece that is smb3

Sane person: Hey, Skinny, if you play SMB3, it pops out of the Nintendo and punches you in the junk.

Skinny: Yeah, but that's part of the experience!

*SMB3 pops out of NES and punches Skinny in the happy sacks*

Skinny, in between groans: See? Part of the experience! Isn't it great!? I have to throw up now.

[Tulpa | 3,494]

BTW, Zelda? 1987. No excuse to not have a long game from 1988 without a battery.

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

1 minute ago, Tulpa said:

Sane person: Hey, Skinny, if you play SMB3, it pops out of the Nintendo and punches you in the junk.

Skinny: Yeah, but that's part of the experience!

*SMB3 pops out of NES and punches Skinny in the happy sacks*

Skinny, in between groans: See? Part of the experience! Isn't it great!? I have to throw up now.

I wonder how it would have turned out if SMB3 did have a save battery.

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

Just now, Tulpa said:

BTW, Zelda? 1987. No excuse to not have a long game from 1988 without a battery.

There’s only one reason why smb3 didn’t have a battery. It’s not technology, it’s not cost….what cold it have been?

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

19 minutes ago, docile tapeworm said:

I wonder how it would have turned out if SMB3 did have a save battery.

It would have been a 10/10 instead of a 9.8

18 minutes ago, docile tapeworm said:

There’s only one reason why smb3 didn’t have a battery. It’s not technology, it’s not cost….what cold it have been?

Two possibilities:

1 - Less likely: It didn't really occur to them since it's an "action" game, and (at the time) there is no reason for an action game to ever need saves.

2 - More likely: They knew they had a massive hit on their hands that would sell literally millions of copies (that's why they didn't release for Christmas '89, then every kid would get that and nothing else, but if you release it Feb '90, every kid gets their NES Christmas present game and begs their parents for SMB3 in February, and you just doubled your NES game sales) and the cost of all those literally millions of 25 cent CR2032's adds to your bottom line real quick...

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

59 minutes ago, Lynda Monica said:

If we're going to keep comparing the two games, can most people agree that the ending sequence and "credits" to Mario 3 sucks, and the ending to Super Mario World is still satisfying and wonderful to sit through every time?

I feel like that's pretty hard to argue in Mario 3's favour.

I actually really like the tune that plays at the end of SMB3 during the credits, so there's that.  But yeah, SMW's got a sweet ending, and a pretty killer tune as well...

[Estil | 1,264]

4 hours ago, Tulpa said:

BTW, Zelda? 1987. No excuse to not have a long game from 1988 without a battery.

The fact of the matter is though, there were relatively few NES games with battery saves:

https://forums.nesdev.org/viewtopic.php?t=17181

[fcgamer | 4,723]

4 hours ago, Lynda Monica said:

If we're going to keep comparing the two games, can most people agree that the ending sequence and "credits" to Mario 3 sucks, and the ending to Super Mario World is still satisfying and wonderful to sit through every time?

I feel like that's pretty hard to argue in Mario 3's favour.

I always liked the Mario 3 ending screen.

The Mario World ending screen always sucked though, as seeing it meant someone had played the game and beat it in the shop, so you weren't going to be getting a chance to play anything while at the toy shop.

[Tulpa | 3,494]

1 hour ago, Estil said:

The fact of the matter is though, there were relatively few NES games with battery saves:

https://forums.nesdev.org/viewtopic.php?t=17181

The fact of the matter is, SMB3 needs a battery to save Skinny's junk.

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

6 hours ago, Dr. Morbis said:

It would have been a 10/10 instead of a 9.8

Two possibilities:

1 - Less likely: It didn't really occur to them since it's an "action" game, and (at the time) there is no reason for an action game to ever need saves.

2 - More likely: They knew they had a massive hit on their hands that would sell literally millions of copies (that's why they didn't release for Christmas '89, then every kid would get that and nothing else, but if you release it Feb '90, every kid gets their NES Christmas present game and begs their parents for SMB3 in February, and you just doubled your NES game sales) and the cost of all those literally millions of 25 cent CR2032's adds to your bottom line real quick...

They werent worried about cost when they put the battery in TLOZ though, or any other game with a battery? Does the famicom version have a battery save? Was the release of the famicom version scheduled as some kind of money grab as well?

[docile tapeworm | 4,198]

1 hour ago, Tulpa said:

The fact of the matter is, SMB3 needs a battery to save Skinny's junk.

It’s not even difficult to get to any one of the 8 worlds from the start of the game though lol. 10 minutes and your there.

[Tulpa | 3,494]

5 minutes ago, docile tapeworm said:

It’s not even difficult to get to any one of the 8 worlds from the start of the game though lol. 10 minutes and your there.

Yeah, but it skips over stuff. You might not have an issue with premature ... gameplay, but some of us like to take our time. 

 

Video games are like sex, is what I'm saying.

 

[JamesRobot | 5,800]

Im pretty much with skinny.  But I get it.  Old people don't have all day to SMB3, myself included.

Here's the patch for saves: https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/2886/

[MagusSmurf | 577]

This was definitely a big debate for a long time and back in the 90's SMB3 was probably the consensus pick. Super Mario World is probably the people's choice at this point though.

In general I go with World over 3, but they're both 10/10 so for me it doesn't matter much.

[DoctorEncore | 3,691]

I really don't mind the lack of battery backup in SMB3. The game is short if you use the whistles and the early levels are quite fun.

I'm not going to sit here and say it's a better game because it DOESN'T have saves, but it's a really, really minor complaint in an otherwise near-perfect game. I'd call it a nitpick, if anything.

[AirVillain | 489]

Whoa.... a lot to unpack here. I had some answers last night but couldn't figure out the Multi-quote across multiple pages of the thread deal, so here we are. You might get 3 different posts from me, boomer style. 

Nope... copy and paste has allowed this gargantuan... 

20 hours ago, OptOut said:

Also, gotta call put a couple things in your criticism here, just to be fair

Those suits are gimmicks, they suck balls, apart from maybe the frog suit on like a handful of levels. You only get em once or twice, they don't define the SMB3 experience.

I also prefer the Mario 3 music, but this is just wrong, there's just a different vibe. SMW music is way more atmospheric, whereas Mario 3 stuff is more classic melodic stuff.

Hardcore bad take right here. Blue Yoshi FTW.

Dude, one of the main criticisms of SMW compared to SMB3 is that it's WAY easier. Now you want endless lives too? The game is easy enough! The worst thing about the save system is that you can only save after like a ghost house, a castle or a switch palace, other than that the save system is dope.

 

Again, not to pick on you too much, I do agree that Mario 3 is better. But let's be fair to Mario World here, the game is fantastic.

Yeah, the Frog and Hammer suits are gimmicks, but they're fun when you use them in the 4-6 levels where they help you. And it helps mix it up from using the Leaf/Tanooki throughout the game. Tanooki Suit aka the GOAT of Mario suits.

Hmmm, well I'll certainly give the music a bit more of a chance next time, I agree it's more atmospheric and SMB3 is full of bangers... I'm pretty sure you mean.

Haha, yeah Blue Yoshi is decent. I guess I just wish there were more places to use the different Yoshi's, so it seems kinda pointless to me. But I do agree with your later point about the little baby Yoshi's. Eating up the bad guys with a tiny baby Yoshi is hilarious and 100% one of the most fun parts of the game. 

I don't want endless lives necessarily because of how difficult it is, but I want all the lives I've EARNED. What if I want to fuck around trying to do something stupid for a few lives in one of the fun star levels or something? You can't do that. The game takes that joy away from you. 

SMW is fantastic.... just not when you compare it to SMB3. 
 

 

19 hours ago, docile tapeworm said:

@OptOut not a hardcore bad take.

i don’t care for yoshi at all. When I play smw I purposely avoid him. 
the sprite is to big. I never been a fan of big sprites for the playable character. Bosses and enemies is fine but I don’t want to lug around some huge sprite it makes the control feel sluggish (placebo? Possibly.) 

plus he just a shitty idea imo. Woo who look at me riding a dinosaur….ya. Lame.

Haha, the tone of this made me actually want to use him more. Overall, agreed. The turning sprite has always bothered me as well. 

 

18 hours ago, The Count said:

You make some valid points, but you must admit the multiple level exits, Star World, and new enemies paired with better graphics make a strong argument. I remember seeing it the first time as was wowed by the new technology compared to, in my mind, the archaic NES.

Excellent points. I like grabbing the keys and the multiple level exits for sure and the graphics are great, no doubt. I feel as though the gameplay isn't quite as tight and Mario just isn't as responsive, though, with the new graphics and updated mechanics.

 

17 hours ago, Gentlegamer said:

auto-scrolling airship levels suck

I'm genuinely curious. Why do you feel this way? Do you just hate the auto-scrolling, and don't think it fits? Too hard comparatively? Love the Frog suit but hate being forced to jump too fast?
 

 

7 hours ago, docile tapeworm said:

So one platformer super late in the life of the nes, rpg’s and time is your example for justifying crying about not having a save feature in smb3 a platformer from 1988. You don’t deserve to have the gyaraga as your avatar…..oh wait that’s the ship from that overrated compile parody. Do you really think they didn’t put a battery in smb3 because they were cheap? Please. It was to weed out the casuals from experiencing the true masterpiece that is smb3

I had heard/read the whistle argument somewhere before and when tulpa hinted I couldn’t help but pull his strings a bit.

I’m gonna be honest. I never thought once as a kid or an adult “dang smb3 needs a save feature” and I never heard anybody complain about how long the game was until I heard it on Nintendoage. I like my shooters because they are not two hour events but the fact I’m an old fart with no time or patience shouldn’t take away any greatness that is SMB3

Yeah.... I really don't understand when people say that SMB3 "Needed a save feature/battery".

I don't get it. I was literally going to say the exact same thing. I never once as a child thought it needed a save feature. You can beat it in an afternoon/weekend so you just left the system on and came back to it. 

 

 

9 hours ago, Tulpa said:

Those games are a half hour at most, Battletoads maybe 45 minutes, tops.

SMB3 complete is like two and a half.

If no saves is the culture, how did both Zeldas, Kirby, every major RPG and all the Koei games get battery saves? Anything over an hour needs a battery.

They can take their whistle and shove it where the sun don't shine. Quit making excuses and accept that SMB3 has one glaring flaw. It wasn't some genius move by the developers, it was a cheap way around saving a battery.

Please see above.

Also, 2.5 hours needs a battery? Good god man, what are we talking about here? You just gave up after an hour and stopped playing as a kid???

Shit.... we left our NES on for the weekend to get this shit done. I've never understood this argument as I never once thought the game needed a battery. 

If you want to start the game where you left off.... then just do it.

Leave your system on and come back when you're ready, later that day, or the next day. How long of breaks are you taking here??? Each world is so taxing you need to take a week long break between worlds? SMB3 is a two day play through at most. You keep all your lives, all your items, and you start EXACTLY where you left off.... it's very simple. 

Okay.... the "glaring flaw" thing is where you get me. Yes, sometimes not having a save battery can be a kick in the nuts, and that's the "culture", but not having a battery is no where close to a glaring flaw in SMB3, it's not even a flaw at all. I am deeply offended you would say SMB3 has a flaw. My insides are hurting. 

Also, as an aside, not having a save feature on some games like Contra, Battletoads, DD2, and SMB3 to some extent, is what made NES what it is today. Kids these days with their re-spawning and their save states.... if you wanted to get back to the final boss of Contra after dying you had to start that muhfucka all over again. That will teach a kid perseverance. Not coddle them like these little fortnite babies. 

[AirVillain | 489]

14 hours ago, LeatherRebel5150 said:

Ok this is one of those “tell me you haven’t played SMW very much, without telling me you haven’t played SMW much.”

You don’t need to start with 5 lives later in the game, for two reasons. 

 

First: There us a “level” specifically dedicated to stocking you up with power ups/yoshi/extra lives. It’s literally one screen with 5 “?” boxes and thats it. You leave the screen and your back to the hub world. Can rinse and repeat for as many 1 up mushrooms as you care to get. Granted this is a secret level. So lets assume the player never found or knew this secret. Then we have…

Option 2: For any stage already beaten, you can hit Start + Select to exit the level at any point. So during late game you can just travel back to one of the first levels rack up some 1 ups and exit the level without beating it. Rinse and repeat. Or just finish those levels over and over either way works.

So the save system IS much better. Theres no reason to start with 5 lives or whatever, if you choose not to. Its a little tedious, but its also infinitely better than no saves of any kind AT ALL in SMB3

I forgot to answer this comment. 

First off... I'm offended by your tone.  As I have played enough SMW to know those "tips" you mentioned. 

I know about the stock up level, which I thought would be obvious... but the grinding is annoying and would be completely alleviated with a proper save system. It's more than a little tedious, and it's not "infinitely better" than no saves at all in SMB3 because saves are not necessary for that game. 

SMB3 is not some crazy Zelda/Final Fantasy level RPG...