Br81zad | 629 Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 Pawn Stars is just a less authentic Antiques Road Show.... 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fsped09 | 223 Moderator · Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 I was also surprised to see the Wata guys come out to validate their own graded game. Its usually a third party or something. I know it is a scripted show, but still, bring in that guy woh values toys for him and get his opinion. I wonder if Wata paid to get on the show? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Br81zad | 629 Posted November 21, 2019 Share Posted November 21, 2019 42 minutes ago, fsped09 said: I was also surprised to see the Wata guys come out to validate their own graded game. Its usually a third party or something. I know it is a scripted show, but still, bring in that guy woh values toys for him and get his opinion. I wonder if Wata paid to get on the show? I expected a rep from Heritage or GoCollect Jeff, tbh. Having a Wata guy look at a Wata game is redundant... At least milk the collusion for what it's worth. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 4,933 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 (edited) Isn't it kind of a conflict of interest to have the combined powers of wata and ha working together to come up with ratings and set new all time high starting values on games to let them soar. I mean basically someones sends in an item, and it gets a high value after you pay the one, then you pay the other the fees on selling said item, yet the money kind of intermingles between both given their roots. My mind kind of races to, it makes sense to have them to rate high, and then start and end as high as possible because the interest is there to get as much as they can from the same owner and item twice. Maybe I'm missing something but this felt like a good spot to ask as maybe I'm just not clear on it as I was absent on NA when all this kicked off some time ago. Edited November 22, 2019 by Tanooki 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kell | 102 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 I don't see it as a conflict, they compliment each other. The market is setting the prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriGuy82 | 768 Posted November 22, 2019 Share Posted November 22, 2019 Shameless who-ers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quest4Nes | 376 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 i want to see a billionaire buy it to play it the outrage would be so awesome 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
themisfit138 | 523 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 Wow! That is just sad. No shame, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrels | 125 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 On 11/21/2019 at 2:01 PM, Br81zad said: I expected a rep from Heritage or GoCollect Jeff, tbh. Having a Wata guy look at a Wata game is redundant... At least milk the collusion for what it's worth. That threw me off bad. Denis even admitted knowing the game and the existing offers... Rick really needs to improve his “short list” of go-to guys. Or, do more actual pawn stuff than merchandise sales in his shop. If anyone has been there, you know what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Californication | 1,477 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 The worst line for me was, "it's a piece of history, it would be hard for me to part with it, but I would do it for a million dollars." Why is it hard for you to part with something you bought as an investment? Your goal is to sell it 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinusWorlds | 193 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 Can someone pass the salt? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExplodedHamster | 404 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 Who would you ask, if not Deniz? The "collector's market," as we'll call it, is basically coming up on a year and has been led by WATA. Most random sellers you'll find in brick and mortar either don't know who WATA is or are just now learning. Heritage probably has the best data at this point, but obviously that's a legit conflict, so can't ask them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPX | 1,369 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 54 minutes ago, ExplodedHamster said: Who would you ask, if not Deniz? The "collector's market," as we'll call it, is basically coming up on a year and has been led by WATA. Most random sellers you'll find in brick and mortar either don't know who WATA is or are just now learning. Heritage probably has the best data at this point, but obviously that's a legit conflict, so can't ask them. Ask a person who has been collecting sealed for a long time independent of the seller and the grading company. If I was to sell you an expensive graded coin, would you go and ask the price from a coin collector or the coin grading company? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nugfish | 652 Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 I dont have a problem with someone building their own brand... The problem is if this Deniz is actually an investor in WATA, the ethics were slightly iffy on the initial purchase of the SMB to start with and it is definitively unethical to do this scripted plug... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rman | 23 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 3 hours ago, Nugfish said: I dont have a problem with someone building their own brand... The problem is if this Deniz is actually an investor in WATA, the ethics were slightly iffy on the initial purchase of the SMB to start with and it is definitively unethical to do this scripted plug... Deniz is the owner of Wata..... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captmorgandrinker | 1,649 Administrator · Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 They could have at least brought in Battletoads. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExplodedHamster | 404 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, GPX said: Ask a person who has been collecting sealed for a long time independent of the seller and the grading company. If I was to sell you an expensive graded coin, would you go and ask the price from a coin collector or the coin grading company? Why wouldn’t a long-term collector/investor of sealed games be biased? Certainly they want the market to boom as much as the next long-term collector. Or they might be biased the other way if they dislike a fellow collector, happens all the time. In the end, it’s worth what someone pays for it. Deniz wasn’t lying about the other offer, so I’m not really sure what better data points are out there that would outweigh it coming from anyone different. That has to be the most objective data point possible. If I was viewing, I’d definitely want to know what offers had been received over speculation from random collector X. Edited November 24, 2019 by ExplodedHamster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GPX | 1,369 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 3 hours ago, ExplodedHamster said: Why wouldn’t a long-term collector/investor of sealed games be biased? Certainly they want the market to boom as much as the next long-term collector. Or they might be biased the other way if they dislike a fellow collector, happens all the time. In the end, it’s worth what someone pays for it. Deniz wasn’t lying about the other offer, so I’m not really sure what better data points are out there that would outweigh it coming from anyone different. That has to be the most objective data point possible. If I was viewing, I’d definitely want to know what offers had been received over speculation from random collector X. I think I need to clarify from the outset that I don’t have a personal vendetta against WATA. I believe I will use their service one day as I have some nice CIB worth considering to be authenticated/graded later on. Now with the above in mind, I’m giving my current opinion based on hopefully an unbiased point of view. Your argument is partly true in that everyone is potentially biased towards their estimation. However, each individual has a different magnitude of bias, and rightly or wrongly, the public’s perception of bias will be different for different people in various fields and/or experience. Subsequently, who speaks out on their estimation, will garner different sway in public confidence. To cut to the chase, what would have made me believe more the hype if: - Deniz talked about the rarity and whatever else associated with the sticker-sealed Mario BUT...he should not have commented further on a price estimation. - the $300,000 offer should really have come from the mouth of the seller, not from a representative of WATA. - why no mention of $100,000 sale? What about past previous sales including past sales of other sought after sealed Mario Bros. I genuinely don’t know, but also genuinely keen to know. - the seller coming down with his original asking price, would have made it appear more legit. Instead, nope! Still sticking with $1,000,000 in asking price! ———————— It’s nice to keep things simple “in the end, it’s worth what someone pays for it”. But when the value of a game is overlapping with the prices of housing, it’s sensible to evaluate the situation in a bit more detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Bogomil | 815 Posted November 24, 2019 Share Posted November 24, 2019 Brb gotta add *As SeEn On PaWn StArZ* to all my eBay listings. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dkaps82 | 3 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 Pawn stars brings CGC graders to authenticate and provide a valuation whenever comics show up. I’d assume the grading companies know better than anyone what the value is of every comic that passes through their doors...and no one can track more data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MiamiSlice | 3,091 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 On 11/22/2019 at 11:37 AM, kell said: The market is setting the prices. Is the market setting the prices when the auction house buys one of the items up for auction? Is the market setting the prices when these guys stage a fully scripted segment where they pretend not to know each other and get someone who is basically a celebrity to play along with their name-a-price game? Is the market setting the prices when these same guys are claiming they've had legit offers for $300k with no proof? We all know how often people say they will make an offer and never come through. So what if someone made a private offer - it's not a sale. It's definitely not "the market setting the price." People will fall for this stuff, the intention is to create hype and boost values beyond what the market is currently pricing things at. Not everyone sees through it like we do. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tdub21 | 12 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 I thought that my understanding was that guy who brought it in to "sell" was one of the 3 investors who brought the 100K one earlier in the year, and one of them is a founder or owner of Heritage Auctions? And Heritage Auctions works with Wata games? correct me if i'm wrong but seems like a ploy to try pump up their investment, with the notion to bring more exposure to Hertiage and Wata? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Californication | 1,477 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 (edited) I don't think Wata should comment on the rarity or the price. Their job is to give an opinion on condition, that is it. A more ethical person would have either given their opinion on the condition and what the grading system means. Rarity and value have nothing to do with condition. The only way to do it right would have explained what Wata's grading system meant, and then if he wants to talk about rarity he should have explained how long he has been collecting or something and made a seperate opinion independent of his role at Wata. I think the second most telling thing is when he says he knows of offers of $300,000. If he wasn't associated with it, why would he know what offers were made? Edited November 25, 2019 by Californication 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonebone | 1,307 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 To be fair, as someone with absolutely no stake in that game, I'd say it "feels like" $250k+ just based on current hype / speculation / rarity / new money in the scene, etc. I understand some people not liking how it was portrayed, but I don't think the estimate was egregiously high or biased. My main contention would be that word of mouth offers aren't worth much. For one, you don't know if it was real. We saw this on a FB thread not even two days ago. A buyer claiming Mega Man would go at least $90k and that he and someone else were already going to drop $100k+ bids. Then his "cc didn't go through" or whatever BS and that item closed at $60k with a buyer premium of $75k. End of day I don't believe anything second hand as anything more than gossip. Other point, you don't know terms. Was it a payment plan? Was it 10 guys going in together? Was it someone trading a comic "worth" $300k? The details absolutely matter. People are a lot more loose with trades than with cold hard cash. And when you get to trades of that magnitude, the values are practically made up as the sales data is either so sparse or so infrequent that it is more based on buyer / seller "feel" than data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nugfish | 652 Posted November 25, 2019 Share Posted November 25, 2019 On 11/23/2019 at 7:20 PM, Rman said: Deniz is the owner of Wata..... Yikes, that is shady... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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