Game Debate #150: Super Mario Bros. 3 (super cereal this time)

[Makar | 2,030]

Nothing wrong with this game. One of the few games I would consider a perfect game

[Link | 2,821]

Okay, I already know @Tulpa hates this, (you fucknut!) but here's my take on the battery question (no): The ability to save would have been detrimental to this game. 

At the time.
Disregarding modern and adult play habits and lifestyles. 

At the time, always repeating the first few levels bred familiarity and obsession with this game. SMB1 and 2USA operated the same way. Saving doesn't require you to start from the beginning every time (I predict someone thinking)(duh) but it definitely encourages that. And when you only have to beat a stage once in the process of beating a game, you don't have much reason to go back to it, to learn it, to be able to go through it in your head like humming a melody or reciting lyrics in your head. How many times have I replayed the early stages of SMW or DKC? Not nearly as many. I don't have any fond memories of any particular worlds in those games. With SMB3, I do. 

SMB3 is an album that I've listened to a hundred times in my life or more. SMW and DKC are movies I've watched once or twice and don't have them embedded in my brain to the point I really care to do a deep dive ever again. Ditto Rayman Origins. Awesome platformer, not an experience I feel like seeking a replay. 

Maybe that's what people mean by "modern". It's a whole different feel. 

Saving ability with those later games is a factor for me in caring way less about them, and the lack thereof helps SMB3. You don't have to share this opinion, but you can't say it's objectively true that the omission was a mistake. 

If it doesn't fit your gaming habit today, that is a separate question imo. And you can say that it doesn't. That's valid and fine. But like a few people have said, absolutely no one complained about this when the game was current. If you want to save progress now, play it on literally any of at least 4 official rereleases, or any emulation method you like. It's not like the whole console is very convenient for everybody, never mind this one game, but there are plenty of ways to make this more conducive to your lifestyle now and if that's the only complaint with the game, it knocks it down to 10 from 11. 

 

On 4/21/2023 at 1:41 PM, mbd39 said:

SMB3 was one of the last such platformers to not have save. Soon after, Nintendo decided that platformers around that length should save.

You can retroactively draw the line where you with hindsight personally think it should have been, but that feels arbitrary. If you put it in 3, somebody would say it should have been in 2. 

Why wasn't it a FDS game in Japan either, if it needs saves? 

[Gentlegamer | 189]

On 4/20/2023 at 4:59 PM, JeremiahJT said:

As far as leaving your NES on all night, I do not think I ever did that.  Outside of accidentally doing it, I do not think I have done that with any system ever.

I did this with Rygar, including when I went to school for the day.

[Bighab | 58]

10/10 for me. One of my favorite games of all time. I remember the hype over this game when it came out. Great levels and graphically(for it's time) a beautiful game. I still enjoy playing this game today and I try to once a year fire it up and see how I do.

[Link | 2,821]

My aunt worked at a video store. (A "real" one too, not Blockbuster.) She lives in a different state so I never saw the place. But I got this game from her for Christmas probably the next year. A clear clamshell case containing a Japanese copy with a converter. I guess it was the store's old copy that they imported because they couldn't get hold of an American one to have for rent. That's how popular it was. 

If I could have any thing and only one thing back from my original collection, it would be that.

[Tanooki | 4,976]

21 hours ago, Link said:

Why wasn't it a FDS game in Japan either, if it needs saves? 

Solid post, very well spoken and why I went where I did.

To answer the other part, FDS disks are 65kb a side (128kb) max, SMB3 is larger, it wouldn't fit and I don't think they ever wanted to do multi-floppy releases.

Edited April 24, 2023 by Tanooki

[Nintegageo | 582]

On 4/21/2023 at 2:41 PM, mbd39 said:

Maybe SMB3 being no save was just a cost cutting measure and not a great old school feature to be praised, and that it would've been better with it, just like all the platformers that came right after it.

 

 

I could be mistaken, but I thought Nintendo themselves' have acknowledged this. Didn't they apologize in the game manual?

The fact they added it to All-Stars, in my opinion, sorta shows they think that the game should.

[Sumez | 3,043]

They added battery saving to every game in All-Stars

[Link | 2,821]

8 hours ago, Nintegageo said:

I could be mistaken, but I thought Nintendo themselves' have acknowledged this. Didn't they apologize in the game manual?

I think you are mistaken. 

The manual doesn't say anything like that.

[Hammerfestus | 3,980]

Do you know what the Spartans did with their weak babies?  They threw them into a chasm at the bottom of Mt. Taygetus.  Those babies are the people who need a save file for Mario 3.  

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

On 4/19/2023 at 11:05 PM, Reed Rothchild said:

@Bearcat-Doug Meerkat, where you at?

Not sure how I missed this. 7/10 and I think I'm being generous.

[cj_robot | 557]

2 hours ago, Link said:

I think you are mistaken. 

The manual doesn't say anything like that.

From the Japanese manual:

So they basically acknowledge that Warp whistles were the workaround, but ADMIT that players will find this element UNFORTUNATE.

Personally, I think it's clear why no other Mario game (or any other platform game from any developer anywhere in the universe) has ever been made in this style since and never will be until the end of time. Battery-backed up saves are the only serious option for serious gamers.

Edited April 24, 2023 by cj_robot

[Link | 2,821]

Just now, cj_robot said:

From the Japanese manual:

Wow, ok then. Thank you. I had only seen the American manual. 

[Tanooki | 4,976]

Damn wow I haven't seen that page in years...let alone translated.  Fun factoid, maybe it's just piss poor design by MindKids in China, but any of their modern multicarts of the last decade(about) that take a coin cell battery on a mount in there, they only have ONE save slot.

Not exactly relevant, but what is, is that if you play Super Mario Bros 3 on it, it erases your current save game.  The game code itself seems to have some hooks looking for SRAM so when that is flagged on boot, it roasts your save game in something you were playing (kirby, dragon warrior iv, zelda, etc.)

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

2 hours ago, cj_robot said:

From the Japanese manual:

So they basically acknowledge that Warp whistles were the workaround, but ADMIT that players will find this element UNFORTUNATE.

That's really interesting. If they intended the warp whistles to be a workaround for the lack of a battery backup and realized players would find it annoying, I wonder why they didn't just add a save feature unless they were just in a rush to get the game out and programming in warp whistles was the easier option.

[Sumez | 3,043]

3 hours ago, cj_robot said:

Personally, I think it's clear why no other Mario game (or any other platform game from any developer anywhere in the universe) has ever been made in this style since and never will be until the end of time.

I'm assuming that was a intended as a joke, but you can never know on this forum

[Tulpa | 3,583]

4 hours ago, Hammerfestus said:

Do you know what the Spartans did with their weak babies?  They threw them into a chasm at the bottom of Mt. Taygetus.  Those babies are the people who need a save file for Mario 3.  

Well, the Spartans had their asses kicked by the Thebans, which of course was the first known civilization to incorporate a save battery into their video games.

[cj_robot | 557]

6 minutes ago, Sumez said:

I'm assuming that was a intended as a joke, but you can never know on this forum

I mean, yeah I was being a bit facetious. But I honestly cannot think of another game where they intentionally left out a save or password system to instead add some sort of area skip item to be acquired within the game. I really do think it's a strange mechanic and I'm not surprised that future Mario games would use Super Mario World as the model.

[mbd39 | 2,043]

38 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

Well, the Spartans had their asses kicked by the Thebans, which of course was the first known civilization to incorporate a save battery into their video games.

Fortunately ancient aliens gave them save battery technology

[Hammerfestus | 3,980]

15 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

Fortunately ancient aliens gave them save battery technology

Interestingly, the ancient Egyptians preferred password saves in their video games.  

[Tulpa | 3,583]

That would explain why Samus appeared in the Great Pyramid hieroglyphics.

[Nintegageo | 582]

@cj_robot thanks! Thought it was the J version though don't own it.

[Estil | 1,282]

4 hours ago, mbd39 said:

Fortunately ancient aliens gave them save battery technology

Yeah did they ever find out what those so called "Baghdad Batteries" and that weird huge light looking thing in Hieroglyphics really was?

[Estil | 1,282]

16 hours ago, Sumez said:

They added battery saving to every game in All-Stars

Not to mention you can save on every level in Lost Levels!  That really is a God send!  True the NES/FDS version gave you infinite continues but yeah, you don't wanna have to do that one in one sitting!  And how would it even be realistically possible to get eight stars on your title screen if you can't even save???

[Estil | 1,282]

19 hours ago, Nintegageo said:

I could be mistaken, but I thought Nintendo themselves' have acknowledged this. Didn't they apologize in the game manual?

The fact they added it to All-Stars, in my opinion, sorta shows they think that the game should.

Well yeah but that was three years after the fact and pretty much every blue chip SNES game had battery backup by this point.