Game Debate #150: Super Mario Bros. 3 (super cereal this time)

[Reed Rothchild | 9,548]

1 hour ago, Hammerfestus said:

I don’t understand how people are dinging this game for not having a save feature.  Sure it would be nice but with the warp whistles it’s totally not necessary.  Don’t give me that but my items and lives line.  Don’t sit there and tell me you actually use any of that stuff to play through this game.       It takes all of five minutes to get the first whistle.

I don't really give a crap about the lack of save because I just play the All-Stars version.  But calling the whistles a save?

Worst.  Save feature. Ever.

[Tulpa | 3,516]

8 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

Battletoads takes about an hour for a casual playthrough. SMB3 takes that long if you already completely know the game and you're speedrunning it.

 

From what I can find on Youtube, fastest 100% run of Battletoads (no warps) is a hair under a half hour. Fastest 100% of SMB3 (again, no warps) is about an hour and fifteen, and most longplays clock in at over two hours.

Edit: I guess there is a warpless run of SMB3 at forty minutes, but no idea if he was glitching things or what.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Tulpa

[Link | 2,714]

28 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

EDIT: Actually SMB3 on the SNES does have saves. So there.

So does SMB1. You gonna say that should've had a battery? 

[mbd39 | 2,025]

4 minutes ago, Link said:

So does SMB1. You gonna say that should've had a battery? 

Eh, I wasn't being entirely serious with that remark.

I just didn't want the inevitable "SMB3 WAS ON THE SNES YOU JERK. WHAT ABOUT ALL STARS"

Edited April 20, 2023 by mbd39

[AirVillain | 490]

1 hour ago, TDIRunner said:

Warp whistles do not take you back to your recent game progress.  They also do not retain your inventory.  Warp whistles are great for speeding through the game quickly, but they are NOT a replacement for game saves.  That argument might have worked for SMB, but by the time SMB3 was released, there was no excuse for leaving the save feature out.  

The "excuse" was it's totally unnecessary and would make the game too easy and not as fun. 

As a kid part of the fun of "beating" the game was to actually beat it in one sitting.

Yes, we all left the NES on overnight/for days to do this sometimes, but STILL... it counts because of the risk you're taking with the NES. 

YOU GOTTA LIVE, MAN! WIth save states that rush of leaving your NES on while you run to take a piss, go play outside with your friends, eat lunch/dinner, or have to go to sleep/then school the next day would be completely gone.... 

WHY ARE YOU TRYING TO TAKE AWAY MY CHILDHOOD!?!?!?



 

34 minutes ago, cj_robot said:

Except, my daughter did get what she wanted. SMB2 FTW

Perhaps Nintendo will get it right with Super Mario Bros. 4 (probably not)

Well... no.... no she didn't because she can't play SMB3 as Peach.... ssssssssssooooooooooo....

And SMB4 is already out, man.... a couple years ago. Still no Princess. Yoshi, yes. Peach, no. 

To be clear.... all this talk about SMB3 "needing" a battery is COMPLETE NONSENSE. IT'S INSANITY! Enough already. 

If you are some sort of baby who can't handle playing through the game (15 minutes to 2+ hours to complete) in one sitting then leave your NES on like a REGULAR HUMAN BEING!!! Or just play on All-Stars. 

BUT PLEASE... ENOUGH WITH THIS "SMB3 nEeDS a BatTerY" BULLSHIT. It's pure and utter nonsense. 

Zelda/Final Fantasy need batteries. SMB games do not. 

[Hammerfestus | 3,860]

18 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

I don't really give a crap about the lack of save because I just play the All-Stars version.  But calling the whistles a save?

Worst.  Save feature. Ever.

It’s not a save.  But it is more than adequate for the purpose of returning to where you left off.  Why do you need a save?  None of the save staters are providing information as to what exactly they are saving.   Back in my day we replayed level 1 uphill both ways and we liked it.   

[Tulpa | 3,516]

4 minutes ago, AirVillain said:

The "excuse" was it's totally unnecessary and would make the game too easy and not as fun. 

As a kid part of the fun of "beating" the game was to actually beat it in one sitting.

Yes, we all left the NES on overnight/for days to do this sometimes, but STILL... it counts because of the risk you're taking with the NES. 

YOU GOTTA LIVE, MAN! WIth save states that rush of leaving your NES on while you run to take a piss, go play outside with your friends, eat lunch/dinner, or have to go to sleep/then school the next day would be completely gone.... 

WHY ARE YOU TRYING TO TAKE AWAY MY CHILDHOOD!?!?!?



 

Well... no.... no she didn't because she can't play SMB3 as Peach.... ssssssssssooooooooooo....

And SMB4 is already out, man.... a couple years ago. Still no Princess. Yoshi, yes. Peach, no. 

To be clear.... all this talk about SMB3 "needing" a battery is COMPLETE NONSENSE. IT'S INSANITY! Enough already. 

If you are some sort of baby who can't handle playing through the game (15 minutes to 2+ hours to complete) in one sitting then leave your NES on like a REGULAR HUMAN BEING!!! Or just play on All-Stars. 

BUT PLEASE... ENOUGH WITH THIS "SMB3 nEeDS a BatTerY" BULLSHIT. It's pure and utter nonsense. 

Zelda/Final Fantasy need batteries. SMB games do not. 

             \

               \

                 \

[AirVillain | 490]

2 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

             \

               \

                 \

This is exactly what it feels like arguing with someone who says "SMB3 needed a save battery."

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills over here!!  

But.... It's not ME who's crazy... It's all of YYYYYYOOOOUUUUUU crazy "SMB3 battery savers". Buncha babies I say!

Seriously, though, haha... this game is far too easy to require anything close to save states. A battery would cheapen it's experience. 

What the fuck's next???? You going to want saves in Contra???? 

Muh-fuckas crying about Contra now, shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit. 

[Reed Rothchild | 9,548]

14 minutes ago, Hammerfestus said:

 Why do you need a save?

For any game that is multiple hours or longer, and has save functionality, do you use that save functionality, yes or no?

That's the answer.

[Hammerfestus | 3,860]

3 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

For any game that is multiple hours or longer, and has save functionality, do you use that save functionality, yes or no?

That's the answer.

Right but this isn’t an RPG.  It’s a 3 or 4 hour platformer that lets you skip to what world you want with only a little bit of effort.  Again, it would be nice but it is hardly a major flaw.

[docile tapeworm | 4,203]

1 hour ago, mbd39 said:

Battletoads takes about an hour for a casual playthrough. SMB3 takes that long if you already completely know the game and you're speedrunning it.

 

 

57 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

From what I can find on Youtube, fastest 100% run of Battletoads (no warps) is a hair under a half hour. Fastest 100% of SMB3 (again, no warps) is about an hour and fifteen, and most longplays clock in at over two hours.

Edit: I guess there is a warpless run of SMB3 at forty minutes, but no idea if he was glitching things or what.

“Seems I’m out of my league here”

[docile tapeworm | 4,203]

Still never thought it needed a save feature.

[Tanooki | 4,937]

12 hours ago, Dr. Morbis said:

There's your problem right there: the game doesn't actually start to get challenging until you hit the clouds in World 5 (the half way point of the game) - everything before that is essentially baby mode.

Get two whistles on World 1 and warp immediately to World 7 with only a couple men in reserve and no items and tell me again this game is too easy...  

You know, you're right, this needs to be acknowledged.

 

Look I've slacked off trying to bother playing NES at all in the last few years, very rare to turn it on more than once or twice due to other games.  Because of that PVM I got last week I started poking away at a few things, and as a side to this, which is valid, I have TWO copies now of SMB3 to base this on...is that the game is not that easy.  Yes the first few worlds, perhaps even through World 4 are basically training mode, world1 is definitely baby mode right down to the hammer bros moving trap on the map.  About a week before I got the new screen I did this nice little bundled up deal on cheap Famicom games and they had SMB3, so I grabbed it because of that, love the cart art, and knew it was even harder by design.  SMB3 in Japan is instantly mini mario if you take a hit, US you lose the suit, then being big which gives you way more durability.  That loss of help was noticeable.  The fact I've not genuinely tried at that game for at least a decade or more is another.  I felt the challenge build as the worlds ticked away much like a new to the game player would.

SMB3 is *NOT* easy.  it's fair, and it is challenging the deeper you go.  If you disagree, fine, but to be fair, you're well versed, practiced, and used to it at some level so you're letting some rose tinted glasses infect you judgement.  SMB3 is not any easier than the other two by any means.

But if you feel it is, play the Japanese release, unless you've so perfected your play not to take hits but rarely, you'll be feeling the pain eventually.  One slip up, by by Tanooki/Raccoon/Frog/Hammer suit and wha??? hi mini Mario, which you'll need to make super, then suit up again to get normal once more which given items often means the next stage now.

 

6 hours ago, Estil said:

Okay, I gotta ask this and I've been curious about this since 1991 when I got this game for my 11th birthday...what is up with that flickering thing you see above the top left part of the scoreboard?

Scanline/timing issue bug.  Game uses the MMC3 which allows for that area at the bottom to be static while the rest can move in any direction freely.  They never addressed or fixed it in any revision of the game either from what I remember.

 

 

I also never left my system on, was afraid as a kid it would overheat and I wouldn't get it replaced.  Same with systems since until sleep mode was a thing.  If it wasn't finished, oh well, next time.  If needed I'd whip out NP and find a level skip code and start there which depending on the game could be fairly more brutal than a restart.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Tanooki

[cj_robot | 543]

I don't know if anyone's mentioned this yet, but Super Mario Bros. 3 could really benefit from having a save feature.

[Foochie776 | 1,055]

GOAT for the nes for sure. The first video game I’d ever beaten. I still play through once or twice a year on All Stars. A save function would have been nice but I played it for many years and never thought twice about it.

[Tulpa | 3,516]

18 minutes ago, cj_robot said:

I don't know if anyone's mentioned this yet, but Super Mario Bros. 3 could really benefit from having a save feature.

I can see the vein in AirVillain's forehead popping from here.

[Brickman | 3,994]

Maybe you just had to be there but I don’t ever recall anyone complaining about there been no save feature in SMB3.

It’s a NES game, barely any games saved outside of RPGs. I think this must be a modern gamer complaint because if you grew up with the NES no one was talking about games needing batteries.

This place is honestly the first time I’ve ever heard people complain about no save battery. There’s a whistle or the SNES version if you’re really struggling with the game.

[Webhead123 | 679]

Why do people keep talking about SMB3 needing a shave feature? Mario's mustache is one of the most iconic things about his appearance. Why in the world would anyone want the ability to shave it? 

[JeremiahJT | 75]

I gave it an 8, almost a 9.  I like the original Super Mario Bros. more, but I prefer this one to Super Mario World.

 

As far as leaving your NES on all night, I do not think I ever did that.  Outside of accidentally doing it, I do not think I have done that with any system ever.

[mbd39 | 2,025]

2 hours ago, Brickman said:

Maybe you just had to be there but I don’t ever recall anyone complaining about there been no save feature in SMB3.

It’s a NES game, barely any games saved outside of RPGs. I think this must be a modern gamer complaint because if you grew up with the NES no one was talking about games needing batteries.

This place is honestly the first time I’ve ever heard people complain about no save battery. There’s a whistle or the SNES version if you’re really struggling with the game.

Save or password became standard in long platformers by the early/mid 90s.

 

[Link | 2,714]

6 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

Save or password became standard in long platformers by the early/mid 90s.

?  It was released in USA February of 1990. 

[mbd39 | 2,025]

4 minutes ago, Link said:

?  It was released in USA February of 1990. 

Brickman said someone has to be a "modern gamer" to think that Mario 3 missing passwords is a problem. Or you grew up with games like Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island and DKC.

Edited April 20, 2023 by mbd39

[Link | 2,714]

1 minute ago, mbd39 said:

Brickman said someone has to be a "modern gamer" to think that Mario 3 missing passwords is a problem. Or you grew up with games like Super Mario World, Yoshi's Island and DKC.

And Mario 3 was released well before batteries were "standard" in "long platformers".

[mbd39 | 2,025]

Just now, Link said:

And Mario 3 was released well before batteries were "standard" in "long platformers".

I know, I was specifically replying to the "must be a modern gamer complaint" remark because saves became standard not long after SMB3. Nobody was expected to complete Super Mario World or Donkey Kong Country without saves and they're comparable in length to SMB3.

 

 

 

[Hammerfestus | 3,860]

6 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

I know, I was specifically replying to the "must be a modern gamer complaint" remark because saves became standard not long after SMB3. Nobody was expected to complete Super Mario World or Donkey Kong Country without saves and they're comparable in length to SMB3.

 

 

 

They are also on the next generation of systems.