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sp1nz

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  1. Post any descriptions for games you have played but can't remember the name of and maybe someone knows what it is. I have a DOS or PC one that I've tried to search for on/off for quite some time: I don't know how much of this is accurate but here goes: The game must've been like 1990-1997 release. I think it was isometric view puzzle game with some different colored aliens you have to command. The level layouts may have been blocky and floating in space. I think the characters walk with two legs and you had to plan routes for multiple of them and maybe you had limited amount of steps to map their movements with. Maybe bit like Contraption Zack (in picture) in graphical style but probably more zoomed out and in space but the alien colors were similar to those button colors. I think the level area was bluish. Maybe I have fake memories lol but I feel like it wasn't real time action game like Contraption Zack, if it even exists. (suggested by RH), if you own a reddit account or want to make one then reddit.com/r/tipofmyjoystick are ninjas at helping people answer these questions.
  2. Here I come bashing on game collecting investing again. But really to anyone involved, you do you. Bidding wars often result in items going for more than market price. People get competitive and throw reason out of the window. When you're sniping on eBay you're usually against other snipers, usually the max price is informed by the market knowledge but the call on what you're willing to pay is made before the end and you don't have time to adjust or you're using some tool that doesn't even need you to be there. So you have a maximum snipe and you still only pay slightly above second highest bidder, if you happen to win. This too can cause big bump if multiple people value the item at some higher level but if you were willing to pay that price, then you didn't lose anything, you just didn't get a cheap snipe like you might have. So sniping works for occasional deals for flippers and collectors alike or you get to pay your maximum or you lose. In the end you were expecting all of these scenarios to some degree but you didn't actively partake in any bid war. Heritage just by "prestige" alone pulls the eyes of the speculators and others and the bidding style of live auction is to entice bidding war. You get these auctioneers drop in some historical significance, print run or whatever to prime the item for the floor. The new speculators have no clue what some item "should" go for (or what the item even actually is) and the prices aren't high enough for them to care about overpaying compared to historical sales, if they even know of those historical sales (and hopefully not just in their single auction house bubble). When they have relative graded price information it has still been made in the last couple of years and the info is usually from some sealed collector inside knowledge or scouring past sales - the new price is based on assumptions and hopes of quick price appreciation when people pull multiplier bids out of their hind ends. So yeah "fair price" for clueless people. I don't mind items appreciating in value but overnight multipliers would almost never happen without new hype speculators - and by overnight I mean that you have comparable sales somewhere like eBay in recent past and then people just pay 2-20x the price for the heck of it in a day or a month or something. Like who bids $455 for Genesis 6.0 CIB Sonic the Hedgehog "Early Production" (on eBay) or $1680 for NES 1942 8.0 CIB (on Heritage). I must own a handful of more rare Sonic variants and I would value only one of them above $100. 1942 is imo pretty average game and even though Capcom developed the game originally on many platforms the NES version was developed by Micronics and just published by Capcom - the "music" in this game makes you want to dig your ears out. Naturally collectability isn't same as playability but I don't see that much collectability nor playability appeal here. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Sonic-the-Hedgehog-Made-in-Japan-Early-Production-WATA-6-0-CIB-Sega-1991-/333923567277 https://comics.ha.com/itm/video-games/1942-nes-capcom-1986-wata-80-cib-complete-in-box-/a/121909-11352.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515 Then again there is no "fair" bidding, so these issues are inevitable when there are items for sale that have demand. Just nowadays the demand feels more manufactured than organic. Anyway it's not my money being spent and I haven't got that much interest in graded games (I own 0 currently), so I guess we'll see how these investments pan out to these people. Some of the "investments" will keep high value and even go up but there's also so much unbelievable stuff in-between that my eyes go round and round. It's like the art world propping up some new eccentric artists as a gods to invest in and people throw millions at them just because they trust the "lie" of the art hype - even if it's a lie at start, it can legitimately turn into truth, no matter how low quality or bad looking the art being sold is, because beauty is in the eye of the beholder, marketing done right is more important than the content and the moneybags being spent are sometimes drops in the ocean for some people.
  3. Yeah we can't always trust eBay sold listings to equate to transactions that have gone through to an actual buyer. So many sellers "buy" their own game just to relist it endlessly or bidders make some bs excuse that they didn't mean to bid. How much consideration do you put on market manipulation tactics and illegitimate buyers like these and beyond? Not sure what kind of measures could even prevent counting fake sales retroactively, maybe somehow tracking the sales for "seller has relisted this item" kind of activity but maybe some items would be relisted without that function too.
  4. Day 31 - Lunatic (at least 1 song pick per participant) Best of "31-Day VGMC 3" List: Day 01: [2005] Sticky Balls - Intro [GZM] acromite53 Gizmondo has redeeming qualities? Silly but great tune. Day 02: [1991] Turrican II - Title Theme [AMI] acromite53 Christopher Hülsbeck tunes tend to have this epic 80s-90s TV theme quality to them which I like. Day 03: [1994] Sonic the Hedgehog 3 - File Select [GEN] nesmaster14 Just jamming in the tropics with Sonic, Tails and Knuckles. Day 04: [2003] Sword of Mana - Seeking the Holy Sword [GBA] AstralSoul Very heroic theme, the backing flutes are kind of a miss for me though. Day 05: [2007] Contra 4 - Stage 1: Jungle [DS] rdrunner Virt is god, nuff said! Day 06: [1990] Mission Impossible - Moscow [NES] PII Certified Konami style with punchy groove and some melody sprinkled in there. Day 07: [2010] Castlevania: Harmony of Despair - Ebony Wings [X360] ZeldaFreak This is some good chuggin' and epic melodies lad. Day 08: [1996] Logical Journey of the Zoombinis - Zoombiniville [PC] 0xDEAFC0DE Mysterious ambiance to boot. Day 09: [2010] Deadly Premonition - Greenvale [X360] Sumez I fricking love Twin Peaks. This imitates the show's music style perfectly, love the huge nods to Laura's theme. Day 10: [1993] Socket - Antiquity [GEN] acromite53 It's bouncy and happy tune but the melody lines have this melancholic timbre that brings it all together in a sublime way. Day 11: [1995] Waterworld - Diving [SNES] acromite53 One of the most fitting and chill underwater tunes I've heard. Day 12: [1990] Supremacy - Title Theme [C64] 0xDEAFC0DE Now I understand where the band Machinae Supremacy came from haha. I really like them. Day 13: [XXXX] HeroQuest - Title Theme [NES] AverageOliver98 Really SID-inspired style when the song gets going. Day 14: [2010] Xenoblade Chronicles - Agniratha, Mechonis Capital (Night) [WII] koifish Beautiful beyond belief. Makes me tear up on sound alone. Day 15: [2020] No Straight Roads - vs. SAYU [PS4] Aguy Cool high energy EDM. Day 16: [1994] Final Fantasy VI - Kefka [SNES] tigerwolf Mischievous staccato notes shift into triumphant melodies. Planning on world domination are ye? Day 17: [1991] Super Spy Hunter - Band Cover by Harmsing [NES] nesmaster14 These guys bring the FUNKY JAZZ! Day 18: [1998] F-Zero X - Devil's call in your heart (Devil's Forest) [N64] AstralSoul Fervent tremolos and drumming rarely heard in video game soundtracks. Day 19: [2013] Rad Raygun - Berlin [X360] acromite53 This song has a really tight beat, you just have to bop your head. Slap bass parts for good measure. Day 20: [1995] Ristar - Round 5-2 - Ice Scream [GEN] acromite53 Love the brightly bubbling notes that occasionally have that harder edge to fit the icy theme. Day 21: [1992] Spider-Man / X-Men: Arcade's Revenge - Cyclops [SNES] rdrunner In true Follin manner this song is a long epic trip with twists and turns. Day 22: [1994] Biker Mice From Mars - City [SNES] / [1982] Judas Priest - Riding on the Wind fox Judas Priest is one of the greats of Metal music, fitting for riding motorbikes. Loved the show as a kid. Day 23: [2018] Them's Fightin' Herds - Alpake Highlands (Paprika) [PC] fox Like a mix of humppa, klezmer and electronic shenanigans. Bomb. Day 24: [1993] Shining Force II - Town Theme [GEN] tigerwolf My favorite Genesis game and definitely my favorite town theme in games. Just so cheerful. Day 25: [1995] Eek! The Cat - Opening Movie (JP Version) Remix by SiIvaGunner [SNES] acromite53 Mother!!! Super smooth combo. Day 26: [2011] Catherine - Track 9 [PS3] / [1831] Chopin - Étude Op. 10, No. 12 AstralSoul Chopin is one of my favorite composers for piano, not quite on the level of Liszt though. Day 27: [1990] Thunder Force AC - Stage 4 [ARC] AverageOliver98 Love the song but I used to know it as "Truth" on the SNES Thunder Spirits soundtrack, more smooth this time around. Day 28: [2007] Super Paper Mario - Castle Bleck [WII] AverageOliver98 Super cool and quirky soundscape. Day 29: [1998] Resident Evil 2 - Final Boss [PS1] fox You can feel the urgency and danger in this song. Day 30: [1987] Goonies II - Ending Theme [NES] fox Delightful and concise composition that you want to listen to again as soon as it ends.
  5. For me beating something "legit" means popping in the game and clearing it with default settings or "as the devs intended". I remember how people got hung up with this tweet: I think you can beat any game any way you want but there are degrees to beating something: Save states every five seconds < save state between checkpoints < save state between levels < save state between worlds < "legit" clear < 1cc etc. At the end of the day, the easier path you take, the less you get out of it. People have different skill levels though, so someone's watered down clear can be bigger deal to them than core gamer's "legit" clear is to the core gamer. Personally I enjoy the archaic life and continue systems but I can enjoy modern games without them just as much. Assist modes, rewinds and save states I don't touch with a ten feet pole unless I've already beaten a game "legit". Sometimes it's nigh impossible to beat a game blind when it has cryptic elements, so while I don't feel good about looking something up, sometimes it's necessary evil compared to getting stuck and dropping the game. I don't like turbo controllers but I just happen to like smashing buttons even when it's not good for the hands. I probably won't find glitches on my own when playing blind but I probably won't use them before my first clear, if they make the game easier. Cheat devices and codes are a no-no for me before first clear. I do play with emulators with non-platform controllers but I don't use save states, especially before first clear.
  6. "Generally speaking, disc rot occurs due to chemical reactions with the reflective layer of the disc, ultraviolet light damage, scratches that expose the delicate and corrosive layer to environmental factors, or the deterioration of manufacturing materials." Some discs are just pressed badly and leave air pockets inside the disc that can expand into rot but I think the expansion is limited by the amount of oxygen in each bubble and good storage might not help with these cases. Rot that happens to good pressings is most likely from sources unrelated to the pressing itself, hence avoidable. Case 1: Just checked a PS1 game that released in 2003 and that I've owned since 2012; zero holes when looking against a light. Case 2: I bought an unlicensed TurboGrafx CD game in 2014 (released in 1994), the CD had a few small clear spots that go through the disc when looking against a light. I checked it few years later and I don't think the holes were any bigger or more numerous.
  7. That looks pretty hype. DotEmu has published some good stuff in the past years and Tribute Games is at least serviceable developer, so hoping for the best.
  8. Tough choice between 2 and 3 for me. Originally 3rd one added the time trials but with N. Sane Trilogy that's a moot point. 3rd one has more of the vehicle/riding stages for variety but they're not always that good. I think 2 has a bit tighter level design than 3. I think I'll go with Crash Bandicoot 2 N. Sane version for the added time trials.
  9. It can damage collectibles, mostly by fading colors. Type of light, power of light, distance between a collectible and light source, and if there is any protection or not between the light source and collectible are all things to take into account. For example an incandescent light bulb in very close proximity of NES box can fade the colors quickly. Having something next to a window that gets direct sunlight can fade colors quickly. Having LED lights that reflect light from walls instead of direct exposure should be of no issue. If you can dim the light by having some kind of cover / obstacle around the bulb or if you make the light bounce from walls instead of being direct should be safe even with bad light types or the damage would take multiple years at minimum to accumulate. LED strips with intelligent setup could be one way to go. Blinds for windows would be very helpful, if there's any chance of direct sunlight exposure. Just some of my own observations on the issue.
  10. Awesome pick, I've loved that song for a long time and I second that Vic Tokai has underrated music. Columns III was not developed by them though but they were the publisher for the US version.
  11. Few years went in a blur of crazed scouring and buying when I started but nowadays I buy only a few things per month or so. So from an obsession into a hobby I suppose, though getting most of my stuff organized and inventoried still awaits me, so that'll be a job and a half
  12. Funny how some people consider cheap to be automatic trash without looking at the game for its qualities or other factors at all. Wide taste, knowledge and eye for peculiar things is a good way to nab some "future hidden gems". I'm so over the misuse of the word grail though, a lot of the hype collectors even call uncommons or commons grails but this again comes from the price tag and their weird perception alone.
  13. Everyone is free to collect however they want but I do get annoyed by some approaches, like hoarding endless duplicates - especially in the high end - especially when done in an attempt to raise value by tanking supply. I'm also annoyed by how some people conflate playing with collecting in a way that they just have to have the originals physically or they can't play or enjoy the game at all, because there are often legal digital ways to play or we accept some gray areas to play with low/no cost and let's face it how can you even give money to the developers, if the developers are out of business / don't have rights anymore / games are not being produced anymore for a series etc. Sure owning original games and playing on original hardware can greatly enhance someone's experience but if they're fan of games I have hard time believing that's the thing that breaks the camel's back and if it does then they should prepare to pay or hunt for the game and not waste their time complaining about it. Prices are what they are due to hundreds of reasons and complaining won't change that. On the flipside some people spend so much time hunting for deals that they end up not saving money at all or are even losing it, if they'd assign monetary value to each hour used. The problem is that everyone wants to buy the same things suddenly and the supply isn't there. People also ignore potential market manipulation due to being beginners or otherwise. No one is entitled to own anything anyway, even if we enjoy owning physical things, they're not a be-all and end-all importance of life. However no matter how modest or extravagant your collection is I'm just happy for you, if you love video games. Yeah I'm not fan of when people only become fans of something when it's accepted or touted as great. Especially, if that includes a value proposition. I've been gaming since I was 4 years old and I sadly didn't realize "collecting" was a thing for games or other stuff back then, even though I always had the gene to collect things like random pins from places and events or pokémon cards / sports cards, or even catch different colored grasshoppers for fun lol - I just never considered that I had collections, just accumulations of things. Games were games to me and I just gave most of my accumulated games away to my sister's family in my teens (I've bought a couple good copies back of nostalgic games after actually having the mindset of collecting games though) and I don't even know what happened to some of my earliest games. I started collecting by happenstance of nostalgia and then it snowballed hardcore, since I had decent amount of expendable cash at the time. I started collecting "too late" and that's entirely on me but I started spending money on games just because I enjoy it. I've rarely shared my collection online though and when I have it's only been bits and pieces. Maybe one day on this forum I'll go all out and share stuff on weekly basis or something. I also don't buy things to get rid of them usually, I buy them because I want to have them in my library, I enjoy variants (mostly major variants on specific systems) but not so much sealed. The problem is that I've bought bunch of games new in retail for say PlayStation platforms and never got around to playing a lot of them, then they've stayed sealed and it might be a little painful to open them up to play but that way the condition is prime at least and I'm happy to support certain developers, games or series by buying brand new. Only games I definitely will keep sealed are blister packs I have and that's only like handful of things. Yeah it's super lame when someone joins a hobby to cash in and comes to gloat on the forums how others are collecting wrong, don't have aspirations to make a bank on their collection or aren't valuing items on the same level as their "expert" opinion. I still do have to say that any collectible category has to have commons and rares, cheap items and expensive items to be stimulating to collect for most people.
  14. Alien Trilogy, as there's no way I had seen Alien 1-3 when I was 8-9 years old, but I had seen a lot of movies and even some gory ones that my older brother showed me (like Hellraiser), so having seen one Alien movie prior is in the realm of possibility but I think even that happened many years later. Very atmospheric FPS to boot and I won't ever forget the Facehugger effects.
  15. My vote is for Pokemon Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald (GBA). I've played Blue, Silver, Sapphire, Black and Y. Blue is most nostalgic but also most archaic (duh). Starter Pokémon: Squirtle. I beat it and then I catched MissingNo, and I wasn't happy with the glitches after that, so I got a new copy. I gave my cartridges to my niece though in my teens, when I had a video game collection purge. I think she still has them. Silver was a good one. Starter Pokémon: Cyndaquil. The rival was memorable in this game but I don't remember too much else about my experience overall other than I didn't like Unown and yet I probably caught all of the alphabet... oh and Miltank used Rollout. Sapphire I loved but after finishing it I lent it to a friend thinking it has multiple saves for some reason, so needless to say poof went my save and I'm still salty about that. Starter Pokémon: Torchic. I liked many of the additions to the game like ribbons and competitions, and I like the Pokémon that are in the game, in total number and in style. I feel like 3rd gen is a good balance of difficulty, content and good vibes. Black was great but my playthrough was pretty quick and not super involved. Starter Pokémon: Tepig (I think?). I remember catching shiny Oddish in the wild, I was stoked about actually seeing a random Shiny without any actual hunting shenanigans / grind. Y I didn't even finish... felt soulless and watered down as all hell. Starter Pokémon: Fennekin (I think?). I did like 3-5 gyms and I felt that there was so much dead air and boring characters, and not that the game series is some challenge oriented thing but in here you get exp share out of the gate and things just felt easier than ever before. This gen kinda killed my enthusiasm towards the series but I do collect the series all the same.
  16. Lunatic mode: Day 01: [2000] Armored Core 2 - RoboComBat [PS2] Day 02: [1996] Donald in Maui Mallard - Title Screen [SNES] Day 03: [1990] Elemental Master - Temptation of the Devil (Stage Select) [GEN] Day 04: [1993] Gauntlet IV - Sortie [GEN] Day 05: [1998] Star Ocean: The Second Story - The Venerable Forest [PS1] Day 06: [2000] Sheep - Chillin Fields [PS1] Day 07: [2007] eXceed 3rd - Jade Penetrate - High Tension Beet [PC] Day 08: [2007] My Word Coach - Menu [DS] Day 09: [2012] The Cat Lady - Lily of the Valley [PC] Day 10: [2000] Keitai Denjuu Telefang: Power/Speed Version - T-Fanger Battle [GBC] Day 11: [1994] Final Fantasy VI - Blackjack [SNES] Day 12: [2008] Suikoden Tierkreis - The People of the Sea [DS] Day 13: [XXXX] Mega Man Legends 3 - Prototype Trailer BGM [N/A] Day 14: [1998] Dragon Warrior Monsters - Never Ending Journey [GBC] Day 15: [1990] Shadow Dancer: The Secret of Shinobi - Boss Theme [GEN] Day 16: [1999] Silent Hill - My Heaven [PS1] Day 17: [1992] Shining Force - Epic Metal Medley by Connor Engstrom [GEN] Day 18: [1991] Midnight Resistance - Flood of Power [GEN] Day 19: [2018] Bloodstained: Curse of the Moon - Stage 3 (The Brilliant Void) [PS4] Day 20: [1991] Super Ghouls 'n Ghosts - Ice Forest [SNES] Day 21: [1990] Solstice: The Quest for the Staff of Demnos - Title Screen Theme [NES] Day 22: [1994] Sonic 3 - Ice Cap Zone Act 1 [GEN] / [1982] The Jetzons - Hard Times Day 23: [2001] Klonoa 2: Lunatea's Veil - Mad Biscarsh [PS2] Day 24: [1992] Alisia Dragoon - Stage 4 [GEN] Day 25: [1996] Kirby Super Star - Float Islands Remix by SiIvaGunner [SNES] Day 26: [1995] Earthworm Jim - What the Heck? [PC] / [1867] Mussorgsky - Night on a Bald Mountain Day 27: [1991] Super R-Type - Solo Sortie [SNES] Day 28: [1993] Rolling Thunder 3 - No Way Out [GEN] Day 29: [1992] Puyo Puyo - Final of Puyo Puyo [GEN] Day 30: [1994] Contra Hard Corps - The Dawn [GEN]
  17. Fair market value in my opinion is just the average of last x copies sold in similar condition... BUT we're in a highly speculative era in the video game market, so many people are buying more on feelings than brains in some areas of the hobby and those prices can affect the future sales a lot when sellers get stubborn and don't want to sell for less than the fluke prices from uneducated buyers splurging on something. A good example of this uneducated buying is graded sealed Atari games; people think they're buying gold but the platform is already low demand / low value for majority of its games and many people are sitting on shipping cartons of sealed games, combine that with no population reports from grading companies and new buyer with too much money and no sense of the market will get burned or maybe they're just laundering money. You also have longer time intervals between sales when the supply is low, sometimes we're talking multiple years in open market, so you don't really have the data for "fair" price and you just have to consider how much something is worth for you in relation to what you know from past sales or the overall game collecting market. In general when a game has real demand I think it organically appreciates in value on a certain line and a lot of that is due to inflation. The general game collecting prices can be like waves that rise and crash (or rise and level out) in different order depending on platform in question BUT when a market is injected with new blood and invigorated by hype you can throw all past data into the garbage bin for the time being - just look at Pokémon cards, future value can be there but it all hangs on relevance and staying power of the whole franchise. Let's not forget that any collectible on eBay (and most other marketplaces) can be easily fall under market manipulation. Shill bidding, buying your own product and then re-listing it, hoarding and trickling supply, best offer sales not showing actual sale price, abusing search terms, ultra high price to appear highest on certain filters to promote yourself, listing same item multiple times to promote visibility, listing items with stolen or no pictures, trying to pass of fakes as authentic, auctions having "reserve price" setting while starting from the most minimum bid possible etc. - maybe some of that is "fair" play but some of it is causing big effects in perception and is not fair play at all. Auction houses eliminate some of those problems but the Wata Games + Heritage Auctions partnership seems like conflict of interest; no population reports, higher price is higher cut for the auction house, big hype machine for how video games are worth a lot - signaling to people outside of game collecting to hop on the train. Maybe item sold with no reserve price on open market auction is an estimation of fair but all of the previous stuff still applies and it can distort the ending price. I have seen too many items sell higher on auction than better condition BINs readily available. So technically there is no "fair", there is just you and what you know, and what you're willing to pay but if you pay out of the ass then joke's on you.
  18. Ahead of its time and I appreciate the smooth 60Hz gameplay a lot but on the flipside the library is relatively small and doesn't have too many killer exclusives. The library doesn't have too many absolute stinkers either though. It can be your favorite or least favorite Sega home console (disregarding Sega Pico) and both sides have merit. 7/10
  19. I'm pretty sure Wolfenstein 3D was my first FPS experience. I was visiting one of my cousins and he had it for his PC. It was very fun at the time to roam the blue hallways, blast some nazis and find secrets, and I didn't want to stop playing. Nowadays I would say the level design is mazey and samey but the gameplay is pretty tight still. Wolfenstein 3D is to Doom what Donkey Kong is to Super Mario Bros.: grandfather of a genre and thus it didn't have it in the cards to be the best for all time, well for most people anyway. 7/10
  20. From Tom Massey's review: "While Legend mode is designed to serve Ghouls ’n Ghosts diehards – fans who need something to test their limits – Knight, Squire and Page difficulties (the latter essentially offering immortality) have something for everyone else. Knight difficulty is still utterly brutal, but Arthur gains three hit points and faces fewer, marginally slower enemies. For the casual retro gamer looking for a solid challenge, Squire difficulty, affording Arthur four hits and arguably too many checkpoints, is probably a good place to start." Sounds to me like Capcom went above and beyond mainstreaming the game for the masses, if anyone outside the fanbase wants to try it out - so if games have outgrown being challenging then this is a game you can go at with training wheels anyway. Instead Mike goes on to complain how the game is frustrating instead of challenging, while praising the game for being "technically and spiritually faithful homage to the original Ghost 'n Goblins series".
  21. I have quite many CEs but then again I like posters, soundtracks, artbooks, statues and such. I won't buy every CE just for the sake of having them and I've been especially picky about about CEs for "mainstream" games. I totally understand people who don't care about the extra items or the space-hogging though. Most CEs go in the category of artificial scarcity in any case and many will not even hold their retail value - the CE market is definitely bloated and causing fatigue for many collectors that buy them out of compulsion.
  22. Indeed they were supposed to be connected from the start but Sega split them into two games due to time constraints and limited cartridge space. Therefore the lock-on is the intended full Sonic 3 experience and the stories are connected: like for example Sonic 3 ends with less involved boss and the & Knuckles half has super emeralds that allow you turn into Hyper Sonic/Knuckles, if collected - you of course need all chaos emeralds to start gaining these.
  23. Cool as a curiosity but who cares about edutainment unless they are a child with no other games. I'd say it still fares better than some absolute garbage consoles and it did very well in Japan. 2/10
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