American Politics / Current Events Thread

[Tulpa | 3,537]

45 minutes ago, Rhino said:

I hope he's not that crazy.

Every time someone says that, he ends up doing something even crazier.

[Californication | 1,490]

2 hours ago, Rhino said:

You know what's crazy about the Breonna Taylor case? The fact that the media ignores this critical piece of information. Walker is Breonnas boyfriend.

"After the police broke the door off its hinges, Mr. Walker fired his gun once, striking Sergeant Mattingly in a thigh. The police responded by firing several shots, striking Ms. Taylor five times."

Walker fired first at cops, and they defended themselves. How were they supposed to know who had the gun? They entered, were shot at by Walker, then they returned fire. Had they not done so, they could've died. Self defense and a tragic accident. No murder here.

https://www.nytimes.com/article/breonna-taylor-police.html

What's even crazier is that the police officers warrant was not a no knock warrant as earlier reported.

The warrant was that they had to announce themselves. 

The police kicked down the door without uniforms on or announcing themselves. Eleven of twelve witnesses said they did not hear the police announce themselves. 

The boyfriend who was in bed with the girl that was murdered was on the phone with the police because he thought someone was breaking into the apartment when he fired a single shot.

 

[Californication | 1,490]

2 hours ago, Rhino said:

I hope he's not that crazy. His real quote seems to be that he's confident he'll win if mail in ballots are done safely and timely

If he was confident that he would win with mail-in ballots they wouldn't be destroying the post office or trying to discredit mail in voting for the last two months.

[Silent Hill | 276]

2 hours ago, Californication said:

What's even crazier is that the police officers warrant was not a no knock warrant as earlier reported.

The warrant was that they had to announce themselves. 

The police kicked down the door without uniforms on or announcing themselves. Eleven of twelve witnesses said they did not hear the police announce themselves. 

The boyfriend who was in bed with the girl that was murdered was on the phone with the police because he thought someone was breaking into the apartment when he fired a single shot.

 

Wonder why there were no charges brought for incorrectly serving a warrant?

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

lol. Somehow it's NEVER racism with you guys. Always some mental gymnastic explanation. No possible chance it could be racism, because that's not a problem. 

Get real.

 

[ThePhleo | 2,186]

31 minutes ago, CodysGameRoom said:

lol. Somehow it's NEVER racism with you guys. Always some mental gymnastic explanation. No possible chance it could be racism, because that's not a problem. 

Get real.

 

I work in an industry who's customers are predominately far right. As a business owner, I wear many hats and one of those hats is "Customer Relations", part of which is socializing and engaging in non-work related chit-chat.

Now, I myself am a right leaning centrist, but behind closed doors I hear way too many "See you at the rally later, Joe" type jokes way too often.

I can only imagine what would happen if I ever had to reveal to some of my clientele that not only am I not *actually* white, but that I'm also the #2 target of Hitler himself (Romani / gypsy).

When I hear jokes like that it hurts, but I have a family to feed and I can only pretend to laugh.

Edited September 25, 2020 by ThePhleo

[Link | 2,734]

How was Walker supposed to know who was breaking into his home?

 

Edited September 26, 2020 by Link

[Rhino | 105]

7 hours ago, CodysGameRoom said:

lol. Somehow it's NEVER racism with you guys. Always some mental gymnastic explanation. No possible chance it could be racism, because that's not a problem. 

Get real.

 

How is what happened in this tragedy racism? Not every white cop on black victim shooting is racism. 

2 hours ago, Link said:

How was Walker supposed to know who was breaking into his home?

 

He wasn't. He should've defended himself. It's an unfortunate tragedy. I haven't heard anyone say he shouldn't have fired at the police. What I'm saying is this was not murder. It shouldn't have happened, it sucks, and it's a tragedy but it's not murder.

[Californication | 1,490]

6 hours ago, Rhino said:

How is what happened in this tragedy racism? Not every white cop on black victim shooting is racism. 

He wasn't. He should've defended himself. It's an unfortunate tragedy. I haven't heard anyone say he shouldn't have fired at the police. What I'm saying is this was not murder. It shouldn't have happened, it sucks, and it's a tragedy but it's not murder.

Hard to say if there was racism in the initial act itself. The officers expected they were going to a black home. Racism could have played a part, but that is open to debate.

I think the problem people are having is. 1. the efficacy of no-knock warrants (although this was not a no-knock scenario.) 2. The  racism in the lack of accountability for the police. The one officer who looks like he might get in some real trouble is because he sexually assaulted white women. How is he getting in trouble for sexually assaulting a white women, but not for hisbpart in killing a black woman lying in her bed.

You say it's not murder, it's clearly this wasn't just a tragedy this was caused by the police officer's incompentence making it manslaughter at a minimum. Those guys were trained and given guns and are over there playing like it's a movie. 

How is it that after all the gun fire was going they still hadn't said anything. How is it that the boyfriend watching his girlfriend die had the capacity to call the police, but these jack asses shooting into someones bedroom couldn't yell out this is the police don't shoot.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Californication

[Californication | 1,490]

I also just want to say that the information the police used to kick down these people's door in the middle of the night probably shouldn't have gotten them a warrant in the first place. The warrant had nothing directly to do with either of the people there that night. The police are saying the warrant was associated with one of Taylor's ex-boyfriends. So if Taylor and Walker, the two sleeping in bed, were dating for "years," the information used to get the warrant was not timrly/well out of date.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Californication

[Rhino | 105]

6 hours ago, Californication said:

Hard to say if there was racism in the initial act itself. The officers expected they were going to a black home. Racism could have played a part, but that is open to debate.

I think the problem people are having is. 1. the efficacy of no-knock warrants (although this was not a no-knock scenario.) 2. The  racism in the lack of accountability for the police. The one officer who looks like he might get in some real trouble is because he sexually assaulted white women. How is he getting in trouble for sexually assaulting a white women, but not for hisbpart in killing a black woman lying in her bed.

You say it's not murder, it's clearly this wasn't just a tragedy this was caused by the police officer's incompentence making it manslaughter at a minimum. Those guys were trained and given guns and are over there playing like it's a movie. 

How is it that after all the gun fire was going they still hadn't said anything. How is it that the boyfriend watching his girlfriend die had the capacity to call the police, but these jack asses shooting into someones bedroom couldn't yell out this is the police don't shoot.

I think there's still way too much we don't know for certain yet. It's a he said she said type of thing. The cops say they did announce who they were before breaking in. Walker says he didn't hear anything. 

When gunfire is ringing out, things get crazy and accidents can happen. Does it excuse what the officers did, no. Could they have done things better and differently, absolutely. They could probably charge the one cop who fired and killed Breonna with manslaughter but I don't think that is going to stick. Like I said, this is definitely not murder. Manslaughter at the very most. 

https://www.nytimes.com/article/breonna-taylor-police.html

[Californication | 1,490]

15 minutes ago, Rhino said:

I think there's still way too much we don't know for certain yet. It's a he said she said type of thing. The cops say they did announce who they were before breaking in. Walker says he didn't hear anything. 

When gunfire is ringing out, things get crazy and accidents can happen. Does it excuse what the officers did, no. Could they have done things better and differently, absolutely. They could probably charge the one cop who fired and killed Breonna with manslaughter but I don't think that is going to stick. Like I said, this is definitely not murder. Manslaughter at the very most. 

https://www.nytimes.com/article/breonna-taylor-police.html

For announing themselves it's not he said she said. lt's 11 witnesses said they didn't hear them and one witness that said they did. 

Edited September 26, 2020 by Californication

[Rhino | 105]

32 minutes ago, Californication said:

For announing themselves it's not he said she said. lt's 11 witnesses said they didn't hear them and one witness that said they did. 

All I'm saying is it's not 100% clear what exactly happened. The police very well could've not announced themselves, or they could have. There is no body can footage. Maybe there are surveillance videos that caught it that haven't been released yet who knows. Jumping to conclusions before all evidence is out is dangerous and can lead to misunderstandings of what truly happened like with Ferguson. Once we have the full picture then we can have a better discussion. 

[Californication | 1,490]

1 hour ago, Rhino said:

All I'm saying is it's not 100% clear what exactly happened. The police very well could've not announced themselves, or they could have. There is no body can footage. Maybe there are surveillance videos that caught it that haven't been released yet who knows. Jumping to conclusions before all evidence is out is dangerous and can lead to misunderstandings of what truly happened like with Ferguson. Once we have the full picture then we can have a better discussion. 

Nobody is jumping to conclusions. Eleven witness plus the victim out weigh one witness and the police. If the police announced themselves they clearly didn't do it well enough. Unless you are saying that the police and their one witness opinions out weigh the other witnesses that may be black. Camera's are not needed to figure out that the police didn't announce themselves properly. They wanted this to go to trial so we could all find out what happened and the police don't want to do that because they are clearly at fault.

Edited September 26, 2020 by Californication

[Rhino | 105]

2 hours ago, Californication said:

Nobody is jumping to conclusions. Eleven witness plus the victim out weigh one witness and the police. If the police announced themselves they clearly didn't do it well enough. Unless you are saying that the police and their one witness opinions out weigh the other witnesses that may be black. Camera's are not needed to figure out that the police didn't announce themselves properly. They wanted this to go to trial so we could all find out what happened and the police don't want to do that because they are clearly at fault.

Not necessarily. Tons of witnesses said Michael Brown was telling hands up don't shoot but that never happened. Just curious, where did you see the 11 witnesses thing? I'm not saying anyone's opinion outweighs anyone elses. I'm saying we simply don't know for a fact what happened. If two sides are saying different things, someone is wrong and our "facts" of the case aren't truly facts. The police definitely did a lot of things wrong if they truly didn't announce themselves. 

[Silent Hill | 276]

On 9/25/2020 at 3:56 PM, CodysGameRoom said:

lol. Somehow it's NEVER racism with you guys. Always some mental gymnastic explanation. No possible chance it could be racism, because that's not a problem. 

Get real.

 

Somehow it’s ALWAYS racism with “you guys”, even when there’s zero evidence of racism, just like in this case. You have no evidence other than the skin color of those involved. 

[Silent Hill | 276]

21 hours ago, Californication said:

I also just want to say that the information the police used to kick down these people's door in the middle of the night probably shouldn't have gotten them a warrant in the first place. The warrant had nothing directly to do with either of the people there that night. The police are saying the warrant was associated with one of Taylor's ex-boyfriends. So if Taylor and Walker, the two sleeping in bed, were dating for "years," the information used to get the warrant was not timrly/well out of date.

What recon are you looking at to determine if the warrant was valid? From what I’ve seen, Taylor’s name was on the warrant and she was still in contact with her ex, so she was most definitely associated. 
 

If the police had actually served the warrant as a no-knock, I’m confident nobody would have been shot. Knocking gave Walker time to arm himself and prepare to shoot whoever came through that door. That’s a main reason they execute no-knocks. 

This is just an unfortunate stalemate situation. They had enough evidence to secure warrants for multiple locations, including Taylor’s. If they truly didn’t announce themselves then I fully see why Walker armed himself (especially since he was aware of her ex and what they were involved in). The police didn’t shoot until Walker did, so their return fire was justified. Walker had his charges dropped because his shooting seems justified, and the police were justified in returning fire, so no manslaughter/murder charge there. 
 

But instead of people looking at it from both sides and from a legal standpoint, you have most people falling into an extreme stance either fully blaming the police and their “racism”, or people blaming Walker for defending themselves against police (even though there’s a strong chance they didn’t know who they were). Then you have some people still overlooking the evidence that’s come up, which to me are the worst of all, since it proves they can’t look at anything objectively/logically. (e.g. Taylor was asleep, police didn’t knock, police fired first, police had the wrong address, etc.) 

 

[Californication | 1,490]

Just because you say, "people should look at it from both sides," that doesn't mean you are looking at it from both sides. 

Look at the Kyle Rittenhouse incident. You said the same thing in here. And then when we point out four or five things that are factually wrong, you've got nothing to say.

You are wrong so often, don't you start wondering about the sources you are getting your information from?

(I don't know how you think you know what Taylor's current relationship with her ex-boyfriend is or "what they were into" I am sure that it's probably more misinformation from those racist right wing sites you get your news from.)

And you conjuring up a story about Walker owning a gun to protext himself.from Taylor's ex-boyfriend is sick. This poor guy watched his girlfriend die in front of him and then got arrested for doing the right thing and you want to drag him into your crazy stories to defend the police.

Do you get embarrassed when you say something that is silly and clearly wrong or do you just brush it off like nothing happened and do it again? You clearly aren't learning anything. You know if you voice your opinion on Breitbart, FB, or 8-Chan people will agree with you. Maybe you should give your opinion there.

[fcgamer | 4,754]

On 9/14/2020 at 10:32 PM, CodysGameRoom said:

Uh he literally did. That's what the quote is about. He sexually assaulted women and bragged about it.

Sorry, I haven't been following this club much, you're surely talking about Biden, right ? And the sexual assault allegations against him over the years.

[Silent Hill | 276]

1 hour ago, Californication said:

Just because you say, "people should look at it from both sides," that doesn't mean you are looking at it from both sides. 
 

I literally described both sides, Walker and the Police. 

Look at the Kyle Rittenhouse incident. You said the same thing in here. And then when we point out four or five things that are factually wrong, you've got nothing to say.
 

Remind me what I said that was factually wrong, and where I failed to respond to any correction presented.

You are wrong so often, don't you start wondering about the sources you are getting your information from?

Please share your sources with me since they’re always correct. 

(I don't know how you think you know what Taylor's current relationship with her ex-boyfriend is or "what they were into" I am sure that it's probably more misinformation from those racist right wing sites you get your news from.)
 

Glover was/is a criminal, no debate needed. Taylor bailed him out of jail multiple times so she clearly knew what he was up to. I’m not sure exactly how she was involved, but it was enough to issue a search warrant.  

And you conjuring up a story about Walker owning a gun to protext himself.from Taylor's ex-boyfriend is sick. This poor guy watched his girlfriend die in front of him and then got arrested for doing the right thing and you want to drag him into your crazy stories to defend the police.

Not sure how my one sentence is “conjuring up a story”, but I never said Walker was wrong for owning a gun, only owned one to defend against Glover, or was wrong for firing it if the Police didn’t announce themselves. I heard in Walker’s police interview that he thought it may have been Glover and/or a home invasion. I would have armed myself as well. 

 

Quote

Do you get embarrassed when you say something that is silly and clearly wrong or do you just brush it off like nothing happened and do it again? You clearly aren't learning anything. You know if you voice your opinion on Breitbart, FB, or 8-Chan people will agree with you. Maybe you should give your opinion there.
 

I would have expected you to provide counter points or refer to evidence to prove that I’m clearly wrong. Instead, you’re just telling me how wrong, and uneducated I am without any attempt to logically disprove anything I said. 

 

Edited September 27, 2020 by Silent Hill

[Californication | 1,490]

@SilentHill -  being wrong over and over again,

Kyle Rittenhouse, "stopped to give medical aid to the first person he shot. - Wrong

"WI law covers a 17 y.o. for that type of gun so he was legally carrying - Wrong

"The group committing the damage escalated the situation since he was trying to extinguish a fire." - Wrong

"The man who was shot in the arm had a pistol, and illegaly as he's a felon" - Wrong.

[Silent Hill | 276]

13 minutes ago, Californication said:

@SilentHill -  being wrong over and over again,

Kyle Rittenhouse, "stopped to give medical aid to the first person he shot. - Wrong

I stand corrected on this. He did circle back and stop after the first shooting, but made a phone call instead of attempting aid (others already were) 

13 minutes ago, Californication said:

"WI law covers a 17 y.o. for that type of gun so he was legally carrying - Wrong
 

I mentioned the WI law that may or may not make it legal. I haven’t seen something that clearly excludes him from that law. 

"The group committing the damage escalated the situation since he was trying to extinguish a fire." - Wrong

Can you link me somewhere that proves why they were chasing him to begin with?

 

13 minutes ago, Californication said:

"The man who was shot in the arm had a pistol, and illegaly as he's a felon" - Wrong.

I also stand corrected on this. His conviction of possessIon of a firearm while intoxicated is a misdemeanor. 
 

While I’ve been corrected on a few things as more evidence is presented, nothing I was incorrect about diminishes the overall stance of self-defense. Grosskreutz being a felon or not doesn’t impact it, Rittenhouse not attempting to apply aid doesn’t impact it, and Rittenhouse illegally carrying doesn’t impact it.

[Californication | 1,490]

1 hour ago, Silent Hill said:

I stand corrected on this. He did circle back and stop after the first shooting, but made a phone call instead of attempting aid (others already were

You are stilly trying to spin this by saying "but made a phone call instead of attempting aid(others were already doing this)." He did nothing to help. And your statement makes it sound like he thought about it. He made a phone call to a friend. If he was trying to help he could have 1. Physically helped, 2. Called an ambulance 3. Called the police. He did nothing to help the person he shot and to say anything otherwise is plain wrong. 

1 hour ago, Silent Hill said:

I also stand corrected on this. His conviction of possessIon of a firearm while intoxicated is a misdemeanor. 
 

2. You said Gaige Grosskrautz was, 'illegally armed as a felon."

Gage Grosskreutz was/is a licensed gun holder

Then you completly dismiss your incorrect statement that Rittenhouse was putting out a fire. 

This is relevant because again you are again inferring positive attributes to Rittenhouse that are completely false.

Now you're saying that these points don't matter so your original opinion is the same? 

 

So why did you say these things in the first place if they don't matter?

Do you understand why when people read your opinions it doesn't make sense when you say you are just telling both sides?

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

22 hours ago, fcgamer said:

Sorry, I haven't been following this club much, you're surely talking about Biden, right ? And the sexual assault allegations against him over the years.

No, I wasn't referring to the allegations against Biden, I was referring to the ADMISSIONS from Trump.

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

On 9/25/2020 at 10:15 PM, Rhino said:

How is what happened in this tragedy racism? Not every white cop on black victim shooting is racism. 

I never said they are. 

On 9/27/2020 at 8:42 AM, Silent Hill said:

Somehow it’s ALWAYS racism with “you guys”, even when there’s zero evidence of racism, just like in this case. You have no evidence other than the skin color of those involved. 

You are both missing the point. I'm just saying, for literally everything that's ever brought up in these politics threads, there is always someone who tries to explain it away without any racism involved. Like apparently it's just not even possible that there was any racism involved, like it just doesn't exist. It's short sighted. Racism exists and it happens every day.

And yes, when the system is in itself racist, then there is a high possibility of some level of racism involved. But we all know you (Silent Hill) don't believe that so why am I even responding?