American Politics / Current Events Thread

[MrWunderful | 2,927]

9 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

Democrats approve of the criminal activity when they refuse aid to help curb the crime. Even the Mayor of Portland said that Trump can "stay the hell out", because he clearly has Portland under control... Is Portland being overrun by white nationalists or the boogaloo boyz?

How much has George Floyd or Jacob Blake raised through GoFundMe? Today, "another black man shot" = idolized and well-funded by donations if they're shot by a white cop. Much more than "thoughts and prayers". Unfortunately, the other 99% of black men who are shot are only acknowledged through "thoughts and prayers".
Didn't GoFundMe pull the kid's listing? Can't act like this kid is getting praised by the masses when a vast majority of MSM are referring to him as a murderer, racist, white supremacist, etc. He's getting pummeled by the loudmouth social media crowd as well.

I agree. Anyone shot by a cop that It shouldn’t have been, whether black or white should have the attention brought to it, and supported by their community. 
 

and this kid is getting praised by the right wing media ecosystem-trump already supported him! Trump taking sides shows why he is not helping the situation.

 

as for why the Portland mayor wants Trump out, I don’t blame them one bit. He’s just gonna be followed along by his little sheep to hang on his every word and try to stir shit up like those guys in that damn motorcade. He does absolutely nothing to try and lighten the situation.

 

@Rhino If you wanna talk with the adults bring a coherent point. Nobody is taking you serious. 

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

10 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

He would have been killed had he not shot them. The people trying to stop him weren't just "close", they were attempting great bodily harm/death. Self-defense. End of story. 

 

And he never would have been in harms way in the first place if his dumb-ass hadn't been there in the first place as an idiot kid with a firearm he had no business being in possession of.

Irrespective of any successful self defense claim, I wouldn't be surprised if there could be successful civil suit over the negligence of both his parents and his friend's (who supplied the rifle) parents, since ultimately they should be responsible for their minor children.

Edited September 2, 2020 by arch_8ngel

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

18 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

Solid rebuttal.

No need to rebut, my friend. Not worth my time when nothing I can say will change your mind.  

[Silent Hill | 276]

29 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

11 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

He would have been killed had he not shot them. The people trying to stop him weren't just "close", they were attempting great bodily harm/death. Self-defense. End of story. 

 

And he never would have been in harms way in the first place if his dumb-ass hadn't been there in the first place as an idiot kid with a firearm he had no business being in possession of.

Irrespective of any successful self defense claim, I wouldn't be surprised if there could be successful civil suit over the negligence of both his parents and his friend's (who supplied the rifle) parents, since ultimately they should be responsible for their minor children.

And the people who were shot would have not been in harms way had they not violently chased him and forced his reaction. Even if the second group hadn't chased him after the first shooting, they would be fine and the kid would have just ran to the police, like he ended up doing after the second shooting. (don't forget the survivor was an idiot felon with a firearm he had no business being in possession of)

The bottom line is he was out there (whether you agree with it or not), and was chased/attacked to the point where his life was threatened. I highly doubt the murder charge sticks because "he shouldn't have been out there". Nobody should have been out there. Not an armed 17 y.o attempting to protect property, and not armed criminals attempting to destroy property, then chasing and attempting to kill a kid. But they were, and this is how it unfolded. 

[Silent Hill | 276]

12 minutes ago, CodysGameRoom said:

No need to rebut, my friend. Not worth my time when nothing I can say will change your mind.  

You're right, nothing you can say will change the video evidence which is what I base my comments on. 

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

Just now, Silent Hill said:

And the people who were shot would have not been in harms way had they not violently chased him and forced his reaction. Even if the second group hadn't chased him after the first shooting, they would be fine and the kid would have just ran to the police, like he ended up doing after the second shooting. (don't forget the survivor was an idiot felon with a firearm he had no business being in possession of)

The bottom line is he was out there (whether you agree with it or not), and was chased/attacked to the point where his life was threatened. I highly doubt the murder charge sticks because "he shouldn't have been out there". Nobody should have been out there. Not an armed 17 y.o attempting to protect property, and not armed criminals attempting to destroy property, then chasing and attempting to kill a kid. But they were, and this is how it unfolded. 

The entire scenario, on both sides of the equation, was a "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" type of scenario.

[Silent Hill | 276]

1 hour ago, MrWunderful said:

11 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

Democrats approve of the criminal activity when they refuse aid to help curb the crime. Even the Mayor of Portland said that Trump can "stay the hell out", because he clearly has Portland under control... Is Portland being overrun by white nationalists or the boogaloo boyz?

How much has George Floyd or Jacob Blake raised through GoFundMe? Today, "another black man shot" = idolized and well-funded by donations if they're shot by a white cop. Much more than "thoughts and prayers". Unfortunately, the other 99% of black men who are shot are only acknowledged through "thoughts and prayers".
Didn't GoFundMe pull the kid's listing? Can't act like this kid is getting praised by the masses when a vast majority of MSM are referring to him as a murderer, racist, white supremacist, etc. He's getting pummeled by the loudmouth social media crowd as well.

I agree. Anyone shot by a cop that It shouldn’t have been, whether black or white should have the attention brought to it, and supported by their community. 
 

and this kid is getting praised by the right wing media ecosystem-trump already supported him! Trump taking sides shows why he is not helping the situation.

 

as for why the Portland mayor wants Trump out, I don’t blame them one bit. He’s just gonna be followed along by his little sheep to hang on his every word and try to stir shit up like those guys in that damn motorcade. He does absolutely nothing to try and lighten the situation.

 

@Rhino If you wanna talk with the adults bring a coherent point. Nobody is taking you serious. 

Sure right-wing media acknowledges self-defense, most going as far to call him a hero as he defended his life against violent criminals. The left-wing media (which seems to be spread throughout most popular MSM) are denying self-defense and painting this kid as a Trump supporting, Cop supporting, white nationalist murderer. No surprise that the views are apart here, but what is surprising is how far they're apart. We have extremely strong video evidence of self-defense, but folks aren't even acknowledging it and falling back to "well, he shouldn't have been there". No shit. 

For Portland, it's not like Trump will show up with his "sheep" behind him to destroy Portland. Portland needs no help from Trump and his "sheep" to destroy itself. They're refusing military aid to help deter crime/violence, but apparently it's just not worth helping your own city because Trump is a piece of shit. 

[Silent Hill | 276]

2 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

The entire scenario, on both sides of the equation, was a "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" type of scenario.

100%

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

57 minutes ago, Silent Hill said:

Trump supporting, Cop supporting, white nationalist murderer

He's not? Source? 

[Silent Hill | 276]

2 minutes ago, CodysGameRoom said:

1 hour ago, Silent Hill said:

Trump supporting, Cop supporting, white nationalist murderer

He's not? Source? 

I haven't seen a source confirming the most damning claim, which is clearly being a white nationalist murderer. 

Supporting Trump/Police seems accurate at this point, but has no bearing on the situation. It's only being referenced to further paint him in a negative light since it's so trendy to hate Trump and Police nowadays, and most MSM love promoting the angle of supporting Trump/Police = evil/racist. I can't see a connection between supporting Trump/Police and acting in self-defense. I wouldn't be surprised if some of these MSM outlets get slammed like CNN did with Sandmann, assuming he's cleared of murder charges.

[Rhino | 105]

13 hours ago, Californication said:

I didn't say he was on a rampage or a shooting spree. I said his life was 100%  not in danger after he shot the first person. And that people running after him knew he had just killed somebody and were trying to stop him. If he was mature he could have de-escalated the situation. He created the situation and it is his fault people died, full stop. Don't quote a law to me unless you're a lawyer with experience in that jurisdiction. 

I choose to believe what the media wants me to believe? Your a trump supporter. You are the definition of a sheep. Unless your in the 1% your getting drilled in the ass like the rest of us. The difference is your sucking Trumps balls while he fucks you and I understand I am getting screwed.

Edit: And the republican media is the group enjoying this. This white kid murdering protestors is getting eaten up all over republican media. A couple more stories like this and the republicans can stop fucking over the post office and still win the election.

LMAO. Do you realize how dumb you come across as? Where do I even begin with you. Watch the videos then come chat with me and @Silent Hill. It really seems like none of you clowns even bothered to watch the videos. If this dude was "mature" like you suggest he should've been, he'd be dead. I'll quote whatever laws I want. It's funny how every time evidence is presented, you clowns just ignore it or dismiss it. I'm sorry you can't read and understand that law. 

For the record, I don't support Trump. He's a horrible president. Never voted for him, never will. He has divided the country and destroyed international relationships. 

[Rhino | 105]

3 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

And the people who were shot would have not been in harms way had they not violently chased him and forced his reaction. Even if the second group hadn't chased him after the first shooting, they would be fine and the kid would have just ran to the police, like he ended up doing after the second shooting. (don't forget the survivor was an idiot felon with a firearm he had no business being in possession of)

The bottom line is he was out there (whether you agree with it or not), and was chased/attacked to the point where his life was threatened. I highly doubt the murder charge sticks because "he shouldn't have been out there". Nobody should have been out there. Not an armed 17 y.o attempting to protect property, and not armed criminals attempting to destroy property, then chasing and attempting to kill a kid. But they were, and this is how it unfolded. 

Why are you the only one on this forum who gets it?

[Rhino | 105]

5 hours ago, MrWunderful said:

I agree. Anyone shot by a cop that It shouldn’t have been, whether black or white should have the attention brought to it, and supported by their community. 
 

and this kid is getting praised by the right wing media ecosystem-trump already supported him! Trump taking sides shows why he is not helping the situation.

 

as for why the Portland mayor wants Trump out, I don’t blame them one bit. He’s just gonna be followed along by his little sheep to hang on his every word and try to stir shit up like those guys in that damn motorcade. He does absolutely nothing to try and lighten the situation.

 

@Rhino If you wanna talk with the adults bring a coherent point. Nobody is taking you serious. 

I know you're a mod and all, but you sir can go politely f*ck off. I'm not going to tolerate your high and mighty condescending tone of "if you wanna talk with the adults" like I'm some ignorant kid. My points are pretty coherent. You guys just continue to ignore evidence that is counter to your viewpoint. @Silent Hill gets it. You guys don't. Look at the evidence. Take out any bias or agendas, and get back to me and the adults. 

[captmorgandrinker | 1,649]

Okay, everybody take a step back, take a deep breath, and knock it the fuck off.   

Make your points with out namecalling (both sides of whatever issue you're discussing, many of you are guilty of this over the last several pages).

Just because this is in a club doesn't mean the site rules don't apply here.   

If this keeps up the staff may need to discuss a ban on any political chat, which would be a shame to the ones that can discuss things normally.

[MrWunderful | 2,927]

44 minutes ago, Rhino said:

I know you're a mod and all, but you sir can go politely f*ck off. I'm not going to tolerate your high and mighty condescending tone of "if you wanna talk with the adults" like I'm some ignorant kid. My points are pretty coherent. You guys just continue to ignore evidence that is counter to your viewpoint. @Silent Hill gets it. You guys don't. Look at the evidence. Take out any bias or agendas, and get back to me and the adults. 

All your points are “The media lies and is the enemy”.  Another bullshit right wing talking point.  Its the media! Its the  media! Thats all you ever do, is blow in the thread and bitch about the media. 
 

PS- using The same exact sign off on me is called “projecting” and is a Bad look. Maybe next time you can think of your own. 

[Silent Hill | 276]

17 hours ago, Californication said:

I didn't say he was on a rampage or a shooting spree. I said his life was 100%  not in danger after he shot the first person. And that people running after him knew he had just killed somebody and were trying to stop him. If he was mature he could have de-escalated the situation. He created the situation and it is his fault people died, full stop. Don't quote a law to me unless you're a lawyer with experience in that jurisdiction. 

I think you're right that we're on two different planets because being hit over the head with a skateboard, and being rushed by someone with a gun is 100% a danger to your life. Remind me how he created the initial situation of being chased by someone intending to do harm.  You know, the one where he was actively de-escalating the situation by fleeing while the person he ended up "murdering" gave chase and attempted to disarm him once he caught up. Funny that you're telling Rhino to kick rocks when it comes to quoting a law, but here you are making claims on the spot by calling it a murder, without referencing actual law or even the video evidence. 

I choose to believe what the media wants me to believe? Your a trump supporter. You are the definition of a sheep. Unless your in the 1% your getting drilled in the ass like the rest of us. The difference is your sucking Trumps balls while he fucks you and I understand I am getting screwed.

Edit: And the republican media is the group enjoying this. This white kid murdering protestors is getting eaten up all over republican media. A couple more stories like this and the republicans can stop fucking over the post office and still win the election.

"Murdering", "Protesters" - At this point, it seems you're so hellbent on your anti-Trump, anti-Republican rhetoric that you can't even identify your own bias claims. If I didn't know any better, I'd assume you were a "Trumper" with all the blind bias you're displaying. 

 

[Silent Hill | 276]

3 hours ago, Rhino said:

7 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

And the people who were shot would have not been in harms way had they not violently chased him and forced his reaction. Even if the second group hadn't chased him after the first shooting, they would be fine and the kid would have just ran to the police, like he ended up doing after the second shooting. (don't forget the survivor was an idiot felon with a firearm he had no business being in possession of)

The bottom line is he was out there (whether you agree with it or not), and was chased/attacked to the point where his life was threatened. I highly doubt the murder charge sticks because "he shouldn't have been out there". Nobody should have been out there. Not an armed 17 y.o attempting to protect property, and not armed criminals attempting to destroy property, then chasing and attempting to kill a kid. But they were, and this is how it unfolded. 

Why are you the only one on this forum who gets it?

I can only speculate, but the best I have is that I'm not so blinded by political affiliation and personal hatred for Trump that I don't let someone's political beliefs impact my ability to acknowledge evidence objectively. No doubt it my mind that if the roles were reversed here (e.g. BLM Protester being chased down by armed Proud Boys, Trumpers, etc.), a lot of folks would be signing a different tune, and agreeing with the self-defense claim. Clear sign of the shit-show that politics have caused this year, and how it affects people's reactions and ability to think critically. 

[Rhino | 105]

7 hours ago, MrWunderful said:

All your points are “The media lies and is the enemy”.  Another bullshit right wing talking point.  Its the media! Its the  media! Thats all you ever do, is blow in the thread and bitch about the media. 
 

PS- using The same exact sign off on me is called “projecting” and is a Bad look. Maybe next time you can think of your own. 

Not sure what posts you're reading. How is pointing out the media omitting facts a bullshit talking point? You really think the media on both sides is clean? You really think they both don't omit stuff or twist stuff to fit their agendas? It's bad on both sides. I'm just calling out the latest example of it. CNN had two articles about this incident that contradicted one another. One portrayed Rittenhouse as fleeing the scene and sneaking past cops, while the other one said he walked right up to cops and turned himself in. Well which one is it CNN? The media is an enormous problem right now. The right and left so desperately want to keep their core audience that they don't care about the veracity of a story. All they care about is speed and twisting it to fit their agenda. What doesn't help is a ton of people getting their news from Facebook and other social media. A lot of that "news" is fake articles or trolls, but some people eat that stuff up and pass it along as fact. COVID-19 had tons of instances of this over the past 6 months for example. 

You poke fun at me, I mock you, that's how it works. You don't get to get away with it because you're in a position of authority here. I won't tolerate it. You started it not me. 

[Rhino | 105]

4 hours ago, Silent Hill said:

I can only speculate, but the best I have is that I'm not so blinded by political affiliation and personal hatred for Trump that I don't let someone's political beliefs impact my ability to acknowledge evidence objectively. No doubt it my mind that if the roles were reversed here (e.g. BLM Protester being chased down by armed Proud Boys, Trumpers, etc.), a lot of folks would be signing a different tune, and agreeing with the self-defense claim. Clear sign of the shit-show that politics have caused this year, and how it affects people's reactions and ability to think critically. 

Couldn't have said it better myself. If Rittenhouse was a BLM supporter, you are correct, all we'd hear on CNN and from the left was how he acted in self defense and was ambushed.

[Rhino | 105]

30 minutes ago, ChickenTendas said:

Not going into whether or not his pulling of the trigger was justified, because that's entirely subjective, but he wasn't even of legal age to carry an assault-rifle style weapon.  I don't believe it matters if he was acting in self-defense if he clearly wasn't supposed to be carrying the rifle. Gun activists talk about illegal guns all the time, yet when this comes out, it's somehow okay for this kid to carry? At this point in time, he was not legally allowed to have the weapon on him, let alone use it. I don't even want to know what this kid was reading if he thinks that car dealerships and police need more protection than unarmed people of color.

Sources:

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/29/iv/304

https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs3.asp?ActID=3497&ChapterID=39#:~:text="Concealed firearm" means a loaded,the Department of State Police.

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/948/60

Finally some sense in here with articles to back up points. You make an interesting point. I do think he will get charged with something. Just not murder. Some unlawful gun related charge, sure, I could see that. I do wonder like you said, does having a gun illegally make your act of self defense (if they do determine it to be that in court) null and void? I don't think it does. He could've been dual wielding modified ARs and it'd probably still be self defense if his life was in danger and one of those guys pulled a gun on him. The legality of the weapon doesn't negate how he acted to save his own life.

[Silent Hill | 276]

22 minutes ago, Rhino said:

57 minutes ago, ChickenTendas said:

Not going into whether or not his pulling of the trigger was justified, because that's entirely subjective, but he wasn't even of legal age to carry an assault-rifle style weapon.  I don't believe it matters if he was acting in self-defense if he clearly wasn't supposed to be carrying the rifle. Gun activists talk about illegal guns all the time, yet when this comes out, it's somehow okay for this kid to carry? At this point in time, he was not legally allowed to have the weapon on him, let alone use it. I don't even want to know what this kid was reading if he thinks that car dealerships and police need more protection than unarmed people of color.

His cause for pulling the trigger isn't subjective at all. It can be proven by evidence, which is heavily in favor of self-defense. Also, were unarmed people of color the target of crime that night, or was it local businesses/property and those who oppose the destruction? And where did you identify that he felt the need to protect police?

Sources:

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/29/iv/304

https://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs3.asp?ActID=3497&ChapterID=39#:~:text="Concealed firearm" means a loaded,the Department of State Police.

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/948/60

Finally some sense in here with articles to back up points. You make an interesting point. I do think he will get charged with something. Just not murder. Some unlawful gun related charge, sure, I could see that. I do wonder like you said, does having a gun illegally make your act of self defense (if they do determine it to be that in court) null and void? I don't think it does. He could've been dual wielding modified ARs and it'd probably still be self defense if his life was in danger and one of those guys pulled a gun on him. 

**The legality of the weapon doesn't negate how he acted to save his own life**

Key point here^^ - Whether he was legally allowed to carry or not, it doesn't preclude him from his right to defend himself.

 

Edited September 3, 2020 by Silent Hill

[Silent Hill | 276]

30 minutes ago, Rhino said:

Not sure what posts you're reading. How is pointing out the media omitting facts a bullshit talking point? You really think the media on both sides is clean? You really think they both don't omit stuff or twist stuff to fit their agendas? It's bad on both sides. I'm just calling out the latest example of it. CNN had two articles about this incident that contradicted one another. One portrayed Rittenhouse as fleeing the scene and sneaking past cops, while the other one said he walked right up to cops and turned himself in. Well which one is it CNN? The media is an enormous problem right now. The right and left so desperately want to keep their core audience that they don't care about the veracity of a story. All they care about is speed and twisting it to fit their agenda. What doesn't help is a ton of people getting their news from Facebook and other social media. A lot of that "news" is fake articles or trolls, but some people eat that stuff up and pass it along as fact. COVID-19 had tons of instances of this over the past 6 months for example. 

You poke fun at me, I mock you, that's how it works. You don't get to get away with it because you're in a position of authority here. I won't tolerate it. You started it not me. 

Even ol' Chris Cuomo admitted "The media is not your friend"

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

11 hours ago, Rhino said:

I do think he will get charged with something. Just not murder.

He was already charged. With intentional murder. Twice. Among other charges.

 

[spacepup | 2,405]

I think the entire situation was a tragedy that could have been avoided, with lives lost and another young life probably ruined or severely hampered.

It saddens me that people are bringing guns (from any group/side) to these events, and then that things are escalating to the point where people are dying.  Everyone is trying to point a finger and place blame one group/ideology, or the other.  But in my opinion, everyone participating has a role to play in what happens here.  And from the outside, I'd hope that instead of endless bickering with each other, we could try to work together to help us with *some* level of unity and compromise to prevent future incidents.

Does anyone want to listen?  Does anyone want to help heal?  Does anyone want to reach their hand across the aisle just a teensy bit, to help us stop this nonsense?  Or would greater satisfaction come from proving someone else wrong, proving yourself right, and standing on top of the mountain with pride?

I just wish that we (and more importantly, our leaders and politicians) would put egos and elections aside to actually address some of these issues, but unfortunately, I know that reality is more complicated and less idealistic than that, and I get it.  It's just sad to me.

 

[Silent Hill | 276]

29 minutes ago, CodysGameRoom said:

11 hours ago, Rhino said:

I do think he will get charged with something. Just not murder.

He was already charged. With intentional murder. Twice. Among other charges.

Probably meant "convicted".