Game Debate #182: Final Fantasy

[Reed Rothchild | 9,526]

[Tanooki | 4,933]

I'm basing this both on the original NES game and the modern since upgrade which dumped the shitty magic system of X turns per magic level for a normal NP system and then averaged it.  This means I gave the average an 8.

The NES release gets a 7.
The GBA, mobile download, back to PS1 release gets a 9.

The story is a lot of fun and feels kind of open ended given you can pick a random make-up party of what for a long time we all felt were nameless people.  Did you know they have official names Square gave them ages ago?  I didn't until more recent years.  Fighter = Zest, Thief = Zauber, B. Mage = Daewoo, W. Mage = Floe,  B.Belt = Fritz, and R. Mage = Puffy.  Just a bit of fun trivia for you all to start the reply trail here.  This is quoted out of Final Fantasy Memory of Heroes, a series of short stories from Umemura Takashi, a retelling of the first 3 FF stories.  The names are from the novelization.

 

Anyway the game broke ground for me and was meaningful.  I never gave a damn about RPGs really, though I did try DND for a year around that time, it's not the same.  Coupled with the NP coverage and then the transition to monthly freebie full game guide I really worked to crush this game.  The grind was the only problem, a hell of a slog with few GP and XP against some pretty high prices for things.  I've always enjoyed a FIghter, Thief(or BB), White and Black Mages party to nail down those best skills.  I liked the concepts of a solid setup with the turns, the environments that changed, the quality skill set and magic sets too. The bosses were interesting, the story always kept me going, and the grind while painful wasn't negatively painful enough at least as a kid never to quit.  The music was just on another level against much of what the NES had shown off for a time, ever since I've loved a lot of Uematsu's work, particularly what is called the N-Generation stuff by Square.  I have CDs of these early games (all but FF3-FC) and made MP3s for my phone to enjoy.  I never could finish the NES game more than once, my save was childishly and selfishly erased with malicious intent a day after I cleared the game (which I think took maybe a month around life.)  Said younger brother got an ass kicking, and given the loss, even I didn't get in actual trouble for it that time.

It took the GBA game to muster the will to go further than usually the vampire/lich area at best to see it through again.  The QOL fixes of the revised release with a real magic system coupled with fair amounts of GP and XP per battle made the game still need to grind a bit, but not worse than Dragon Quest obnoxiously so.  I finished it again when it came to the GBA Dawn of Souls, did it on PS1 Origins too around the same time.  Still yet it retained the quality stages, designs, perked up the colors, audio, and painfully slow and annoying bits of the old game to make it a real gem, a game that must be played.

These days I still have my complete (minus box) original copy of FF1, and I have the GBA game too, but for quick mindless action it also rests on my phone with no hurdle to the fun at any time.  It's a gem, and I'd recommend it, even the NES release with it's poorly aged mechanics.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

One of my favourite games of all time and my favourite RPG.  I've beaten it solo with all six classes, both with and without class-change, and I keep a chart of all my completions with the party details and whatnot.

Desert Island game for me... 10/10

[the_wizard_666 | 1,325]

As it is, I give it a solid 8.  Throw a bug fix patch on it and it's at least a 9, if not a 10.  Broken spells hurt it a bit IMO, but I had a ton of fun renting it back in the day.

[Sumez | 2,951]

Pretty good. I might enjoy occasionally playing it.

[fox | 1,667]

Oh hey I just beat this one

I don't know if there is any game I have started, abandoned, and restarted more times, be it on the nes, gba, and now the Switch.  I would always get lost or bored with the grind and tap out.  But this is the year I finally buckled down and beat it.

The pixel remaster makes things a lot easier to stomach with being able to run and auto battle.  Those are a life saver because this game is a grind.  So much of your time is spent grinding for xp or money to stand a chance in the dungeons, only to dive deep in a dungeon and grind thru dozens more monsters to get to the boss.

The best feature is the ability to create your own party from the start of the game.  You get to pick 4 characters from 6 classes and can make some wild combos to fit your playstyle.  I went Fighter, Black Belt, Thief, and Red Mage, so I didn't have to depend too much on magic.


But where RPGs really shine is the story and Final Fantasy 1 is well....pretty bland.  It is some generic fantasy adventure mixed with time travel bull$hit.  What's more is because of the ability to make your own party, your cookie cutter characters have no personality and nothing to say.

For some reason I always felt this was a tough game, but the difficulty is really lopsided.  I actually feel like the early part of the game is harder, because it takes a lot to get your team up and running with costs of armor and magic being pretty high.  Once I hit the mid game class change, I went on a tear and nothing could stop me.  Even bosses fell in a couple turns.  But dang, Chaos got a huge boost in the pixel remaster.  He ate my lunch a couple times until I did a bit of leveling, but mostly I think it came down to luck as I just eek'd out a win out of what looked like defeat.



If you need a mindless grindfest, Final Fantasy 1 certainly will do the trick.  If you want good story and characters, look elsewhere.  Is this an all time classic?  No way, it is just too basic and bare bones.  This is where the series began, but it didn't really hit it's stride till the SNES/PSX games.

+Customizable party
+Great soundtrack
+Simple gameplay

-Bland nonsense story
-Character-less party members
-Grindy AF

[RH | 4,903]

I enjoyed my play through even though this was not my first Final Fantasy game.

It was tough to rate but I gave it an 8.

@Reed Rothchild You do what you want to do but I’d be interested in seeing Dragon Warrior next week just to see how people think it stacks up against Final Fantasy.  I didn’t play Dragon Warrior until it was remade on iOS.  I’m sure it’s had several improvements but I (gasp!) enjoyed it more than Final Fantasy.

In a different universe I’m probably a bigger DQ fan than a FF fan because I played DQ first, but as reality stands, this is the better game in my book because I love the series.

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

I'm not really a fan of RPGs, but this is one of my favorite NES games. 9/10.

[TDIRunner | 2,737]

I've never played any game in the Final Fantasy series.  

[Reed Rothchild | 9,526]

4 hours ago, RH said:

@Reed Rothchild You do what you want to do but I’d be interested in seeing Dragon Warrior next week just to see how people think it stacks up against Final Fantasy

https://www.videogamesage.com/forums/topic/8461-game-debate-59-dragon-warrior

[Sumez | 2,951]

Dragon Quest 3 would be a more fair comparison as that's the game that's contemporary to FF1

Final Fantasy already had the first two DQ games to learn from when it came out.

[Webhead123 | 675]

It's a fine game but wasn't then and it's now one of my favorites or anything. I didn't play the original until after I'd already played Final Fantasy II (SNES), so the experience overall felt like several steps back but I did enjoy it for what it was and I think there's a reason the sprite-work became so iconic. Dragon Warrior was a much bigger deal for me in terms of my exposure to and experience with early RPGs but I had fun occasionally exploring this game. I never have played it all the way to the end and I rather doubt I ever will.

Still, Final Fantasy on NES deserves a 7/10 from me. A good game, if not...well...fantastic.

[Kguillemette | 1,544]

7/10

If there ever was such a pick up and play RPG, it's the OG final fantasy. I've been itching to play it again, and everyone here seems so describing the pixl remaster as the way to play it. 

I'll never forget thinking I was so well prepared going to get the floater only to get smoked by a group of 9 perilisks like 10 times in a row! 

[G-type | 2,481]

not really into this type of game

[Reed Rothchild | 9,526]

Its on my backlog somewhere, but I will do it eventually.  Just need to do 16, 7 Remake, and finally finish 5 first.  Oh, and 15.  And Heroes of Light...

[Tanooki | 4,933]

Isn't the pixel remaster the same core setup Dawn of Souls (GBA) had as far as how the bosses, end game, mp, xp, gp, general grind goes?  I've considered getting that one, but I have the now canceled FF1 ios release before it got pixely remastered and I thought it kind of crap having to pay full price twice.  If anything when they do the christmas period discount on their titles I may pop for FF4 to have it on the go, as it's what I did a year ago for DQ4.

[Gentlegamer | 174]

Edited December 14, 2023 by Gentlegamer

[Gaia Gensouki | 1,073]

I'm going back and forth between an 8 or a 9 on this one. It's obviously a really good RPG for the NES, that is only really marred by the crazy amount of bugs. So meany weapons and spells aren't working properly. I wish that there would be a big-fixed version of this game, but without any of the modern additions or lower difficulty of the later ports, remasters etc. I also think that the magic system is interesting and replacing it with an MP-based system is boring as it robs this game of some of its flavor.

I'm even okay with this game nullifying your attacks if your characters are attacking an enemy that has already been killed. Later RPGs introduced the convenient feature that your attack will just hit another enemy, but this leads to players just mindlessly mashing buttons and then whining about how this game is too easy and simple. The system in FF I however forces you to think about what you want to do in any given turn.

Apart from that the music is obviously top-tier and the graphics at least decent. The story is indeed kinda bogus and overly convoluted for such an early and simple game, but it seta  tradition for later FF games. But at least you can't say that this game doesn't have some interesting twists and surprises!

That the game characters have no personality is due to you being able to create your own party similar to Dungeons and Dragons. So I find it weird to criticise this game for lacking memorable main characters. Many western RPGs also have protagonists that are pretty much blank slates as they are the player's avatar, but somehow that's not a fatal flaw of the game, but when FF does it it is? Furthermore, this is a really old RPG and by this time console RPGs barely had recognizable characters. Dragon Quest 2 at least made an attempt, but apart from a few sentences here and there they are also pretty barebones. For game characters with actual personality and story arcs you had to wait roughly until the early 90s, when FF IV and DQ IV hit the scene.

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

16 hours ago, the_wizard_666 said:

As it is, I give it a solid 8.  Throw a bug fix patch on it and it's at least a 9, if not a 10.  Broken spells hurt it a bit IMO, but I had a ton of fun renting it back in the day.

I forgot about the broken spells, but from what I remember, they weren't ones I picked up anyway.

[wongojack | 214]

6 out of 10. I got introduced to the RPG format on home computers.  I did play Dragon Warrior on NES and thought it was really boring.  After that, JRPGs just never really did it for me.

In about 2002 or so, I went back and played Final Fantasy in emulation.  It was ok.  I had fun finishing it with my wife, so that's a good memory, but I doubt I will ever play it again.

[rdrunner | 422]

9/10 - Lots of fond memories of this one, playing through multiple times.  Not sure why it gets dinged for the spell limit system instead of traditional MP.  I always thought of it as part of the game's charm!  The GBA version is nice, but way too easy (they had to add the mega dungeons just to add a little challenge).  Easy 9.

Edited December 15, 2023 by rdrunner

[The Count | 527]

I've never played it, but I feel like I should as any retro enthusiast worth their salt.

[NostalgicMachine | 235]

The OG is a 10/10 title for me. No hyperbole. It's an absolute classic in every sense of the word. Yes, the remakes include lots of quality of life upgrades, but there's just something about this game on the NES.

[fox | 1,667]

15 hours ago, Gaia Gensouki said:

That the game characters have no personality is due to you being able to create your own party similar to Dungeons and Dragons. So I find it weird to criticise this game for lacking memorable main characters. Many western RPGs also have protagonists that are pretty much blank slates as they are the player's avatar, but somehow that's not a fatal flaw of the game, but when FF does it it is? Furthermore, this is a really old RPG and by this time console RPGs barely had recognizable characters. Dragon Quest 2 at least made an attempt, but apart from a few sentences here and there they are also pretty barebones. For game characters with actual personality and story arcs you had to wait roughly until the early 90s, when FF IV and DQ IV hit the scene.

So you roll up to the table to play DnD and leave the character background blank, no traits, no ideals, no bonds, no backstory.    That is what breaths life in the game.  You are just going to play a mute amnesiac and not even make an attempt to role play in a role playing game.  If you are just here to roll dice, we can play Yahtzee or something. 

FF IV and DQ IV are solid examples of games that have good stories with memorable characters as do dozens of other great rpgs.  Final Fantasy I is just lacking that special sauce.

[Sumez | 2,951]

  

43 minutes ago, fox said:

If you are just here to roll dice, we can play Yahtzee or something. 

Or Final Fantasy

I'm not a massive fan of the first Final Fantasy, but if the game wasn't designed around the premise of having interesting characters and a fun story, it seems odd to criticize it for lacking that. The same is true for a majority of video games, and most of the time I prefer it that way. I'd say Etrian Odyssey would be straight up worse if it had named protagonists that kept talking, nevermind games like Metroid or Bubble Bobble, etc.

Edited December 15, 2023 by Sumez