Sharedata Chiller NES Advertisement

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

1 hour ago, Code Monkey said:

I doubt there are boxes, many of these smaller companies with mail order advertisements usually just shipped the cartridge in a box.

Ummmm..... every game Sharedata released had a box... Chiller, Shockwave, and Deathrace, all three of their AGCI-branded games have retail boxes............  So they're not big enough to make a box themselves, but they are big enough to incorporate a subsidiary company who can then find the wherewithall to make some cardboard boxes?!?!?  (Think Konami to Ultra, Color Dreams to Wisdom Tree, etc....) IT'S JUST BRANDING - Sharedata and AGCI are THE SAME COMPANY!!!!!  Did you guys miss that minor detail or is it that nobody reads for comprehension anymore?

 

Are you guys all on crazy pills or what???????????????????????????????????

Edited October 25, 2021 by Dr. Morbis

[fcgamer | 4,723]

15 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Ummmm..... every game Sharedata released had a box... Chiller, Shockwave, and Deathrace, all three of their AGCI-branded games have retail boxes............  So they're not big enough to make a box themselves, but they are big enough to incorporate a subsidiary company who can then find the wherewithall to make some cardboard boxes?!?!?  (Think Konami to Ultra, Color Dreams to Wisdom Tree, etc....) IT'S JUST BRANDING - Sharedata and AGCI are THE SAME COMPANY!!!!!  Did you guys miss that minor detail or is it that nobody reads for comprehension anymore?

 

Are you guys all on crazy pills or what???????????????????????????????????

You're wrong, ShareData only published one game on the NES, and no box or manual has been found as of yet, that game being Chiller.

ShareData and AGCI absolutely are not the same company. They are related companies, but there is a difference between subsidiaries and the parent/holding companies, they are different entities.

Their original run of games used the materials licensed by Color Dreams. When they decided to form a dedicated company for the NES, thats when they upped the price, rereleased the Chiller game, and made a box and manual.

 

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

8 hours ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Ummmm..... every game Sharedata released had a box... Chiller, Shockwave, and Deathrace, all three of their AGCI-branded games have retail boxes............  So they're not big enough to make a box themselves, but they are big enough to incorporate a subsidiary company who can then find the wherewithall to make some cardboard boxes?!?!?  (Think Konami to Ultra, Color Dreams to Wisdom Tree, etc....) IT'S JUST BRANDING - Sharedata and AGCI are THE SAME COMPANY!!!!!  Did you guys miss that minor detail or is it that nobody reads for comprehension anymore?

 

Are you guys all on crazy pills or what???????????????????????????????????

You seem really passionate about this topic. I've read your posts about them being the same company but haven't seen any proof. It could have been a Konami / Ultra situation or it could have been a Nintendo / Bandai situation where they bought the company and rebranded the game under the new company name. You don't know and I don't know but I do have concrete proof that companies with mail order forms in magazines did send out cartridges in brown shipping boxes with no manual / box for the game.

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

I say the fact that there is so little known about AGCI Wally Bear, and Sharedata chiller warrants not only investigation, but a full scale hunt for information from the entire community.

Those two games have been a thorn in my side for almost a decade and I so desperately want to add them to the list just to put the final nail in the coffin that is Etler’s List.

AGCI Wally bear feels like a prototype, but Sharedata chiller seems to be an extremely rare unlicensed release.

PS: Stop counting Cheetahmen II and Dizzy the Adventurer in your unlicensed sets. They’re not Unlicensed, they’re Unlicensed (Unreleased)

[Foochie776 | 1,051]

18 hours ago, Hollywoodcaddy said:

Ok...I see it now...that's mostly about the box I take it...please don't quote me but I believe that box was released in Europe....not necessarily a PAL version...I don't believe there are any actual PAL versions of Caltron, I could be wrong...anyways I always assumed that since none of the Caltrons were considered NTSC or PAL...that where they were released is where what collectors used to determine whether they were considered a "North American/South American/European/Japanese" release...that's why we've always considered there to be a couple "American versions" ...but if the way we are looking at these have changed by all means please let me know haha....because there are like 6 or so versions of this game haha...

I’ll be honest and say I don’t know much about the nuances of unlicensed stuff like I do licensed. Somebody in this thread would likely be able to help you though!

[Tulpa | 3,492]

This is one of the most entertaining threads I've read in a while.

 

 

[Ferris Bueller | 495]

For reference.

[a3quit4s | 4,097]

33 minutes ago, Ferris Bueller said:

For reference.

But the real question is did you call in and order it or did you send through the mail for it?

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

9 hours ago, Code Monkey said:

You seem really passionate about this topic. I've read your posts about them being the same company but haven't seen any proof.

I'm passionate about preventing the dissemination of misinformation and the propogation of unproven theories as facts.  Someone posted a picture of a thirty year old print ad and like five billion people were ready to call the game released.  Is no one willing to pause and have some due diligence with regards to doing any research whatsoever before jumping to conclusions such as this?

All I know is that only a single digit amount of these carts have shown up in the last thirty years, all without any sort of retail accompaniment (boxes, manuals, etc), and for the NES era, that essentially guarantees you that the game was not retail released.  It's basically in the sample/proto realm at this point.  And even if a single box were to show up after all this time, that wouldn't really prove anything either; it would be more akin to Mega Man 6 non -1: yeah, it exists, and there are copies out there in collectors hands, but that alone does not in any way imply that the game had a US release...

Edited October 26, 2021 by Dr. Morbis

[Ferris Bueller | 495]

10 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

It's basically in the sample/proto realm at this point. 

I have a Chiller demo cart and it's not Sharedata. Two different things to me.

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

I know Atari is apples and oranges but I can swear I remember a time that they didn’t even know the NAME of Air Raid until a box popped up.

Also, why should Myriad, Racermate, the Three Panesian titles, Cheetahmen II, and all 7 Aladdin Deck Enhancer games count

Or Tengen Tetris being technically a pirate.

The list for unlicensed games is, and always will be arbitrary depending on ones standards, especially ESPECIALLY when it comes to the rare unlicensed stuff.

 

Hell, dig hard enough into licensed and you can find some arguments.

Stadium Events, and N7 Tecmo NBA. Or is “Probotector” a different game from “Contra”? Is “Ninja Jajamaru” different from Yo Noid? Is Doki Doki and SMB 2 the same?

Do we count McDonaldland vs M.c Kids different

Edited October 26, 2021 by ThePhleo

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

44 minutes ago, ThePhleo said:

I know Atari is apples and oranges but I can swear I remember a time that they didn’t even know the NAME of Air Raid until a box popped up.

Also, why should Myriad, Racermate, the Three Panesian titles, Cheetahmen II, and all 7 Aladdin Deck Enhancer games count

Or Tengen Tetris being technically a pirate.

The list for unlicensed games is, and always will be arbitrary depending on ones standards, especially ESPECIALLY when it comes to the rare unlicensed stuff.

 

Hell, dig hard enough into licensed and you can find some arguments.

Stadium Events, and N7 Tecmo NBA. Or is “Probotector” a different game from “Contra”? Is “Ninja Jajamaru” different from Yo Noid? Is Doki Doki and SMB 2 the same?

Do we count McDonaldland vs M.c Kids different

Look, Sharedata Chiller exists and it's a cool curio - I wish I had one and I'm sure most other NES collectors do to.  The "different game" argument is irrelevant to this argument; whether or not the game is licensed or unlicensed is irrelevant; all I'm saying is this:

Don't put a game on a list of confirmed releases if it's not a confirmed release.  Period.  Full stop.

Anyone who wants to collect it, have at 'er; anyone who doesn't - that's fine too.  Do whatever you want, just please do not put a game on a list of confirmed releases unless it is a confirmed release.  Is that too much to ask?

Edited October 26, 2021 by Dr. Morbis

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

1 hour ago, Dr. Morbis said:

I'm passionate about preventing the dissemination of misinformation and the propogation of unproven theories as facts.  Someone posted a picture of a thirty year old print ad and like five billion people were ready to call the game released.  Is no one willing to pause and have some due diligence with regards to doing any research whatsoever before jumping to conclusions such as this?

All I know is that only a single digit amount of these carts have shown up in the last thirty years, all without any sort of retail accompaniment (boxes, manuals, etc), and for the NES era, that essentially guarantees you that the game was not retail released.  It's basically in the sample/proto realm at this point.  And even if a single box were to show up after all this time, that wouldn't really prove anything either; it would be more akin to Mega Man 6 non -1: yeah, it exists, and there are copies out there in collectors hands, but that alone does not in any way imply that the game had a US release...

I've been trying to follow your thought process on this topic but I'm kind of lost with your logic. Maybe it would make more sense to me if we discussed your definition of retail released.

To me, I'm looking at a clear order form for the game where any random person of the public could order the game and exchange money for it. As far as I'm concerned, that's a release because I was able to purchase it at that point in time. Do you have a different definition of released than I do?

It's the same with Red Sea Crossing, it was available only by mail order and as far as we can tell in the Atari community, was only available from a single advertisement in a single magazine in a single print run. Regardless, it was still a retail release.

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

46 minutes ago, ThePhleo said:

I know Atari is apples and oranges but I can swear I remember a time that they didn’t even know the NAME of Air Raid until a box popped up.

That's correct, I remember following that thread as it happened. For years everyone called it Air Raid because some random person that worked in the industry said he swore he remembered it as that even though it wasn't written on the cartridge. We didn't know any different so that's what we called it. When the first box was discovered, the name was confirmed. I read about 150 pages of that thread and it was an incredible read, I would highly suggest it to anyone interested in gaming history.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

1 minute ago, Code Monkey said:

To me, I'm looking at a clear order form for the game where any random person of the public could order the game and exchange money for it. As far as I'm concerned, that's a release because I was able to purchase it at that point in time. Do you have a different definition of released than I do?

Wow, round and round.  You're jumping to conclusions.... again.  A print ad does not prove a game was manufactured, distributed, ordered and shipped to consumers; a print ad proves one thing only: that a company intended to sell a product.  I already gave you an identically analagous example with the Maxi-30 by AVE: an ad ran on TV in the US with a phone number to call, and people did call and try to order it, but the game had not even been manufactured yet - AVE was just testing the waters to see if there would be enough demand to proceed.  In short, the existence of the ad does not prove anything more than intention.  DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

Let’s circle back one more time then:

What would it take for you to confirm it as a retail release?

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

7 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Wow, round and round.  You're jumping to conclusions.... again.  A print ad does not prove a game was manufactured, distributed, ordered and shipped to consumers; a print ad proves one thing only: that a company intended to sell a product.  I already gave you an identically analagous example with the Maxi-30 by AVE: an ad ran on TV in the US with a phone number to call, and people did call and try to order it, but the game had not even been manufactured yet - AVE was just testing the waters to see if there would be enough demand to proceed.  In short, the existence of the ad does not prove anything more than intention.  DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

Yes, I get it now. This advertisement is enough for me to classify it as released but not enough for you. That's understandable, I'm glad I understand now.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

1 minute ago, ThePhleo said:

Let’s circle back one more time then:

What would it take for you to confirm it as a retail release?

Evidence, either direct (a picture/video from the early 90's of a retail outlet with the game hanging on the shelf) or indirect (dozens/hundreds/thousands of copies found over the last thirty years with dozens/hundreds/thousands of people remembering the purchase of the game and dozens/hundreds/thousands of cartridges and boxes and manuals still in existence to this day).

How many copies of Sharedata Chiller have been found in the last 30 years?  How many boxes?  How many manuals?  And now ask yourself this: how many do you think would have been found if the game had been "released"?  Think about it.....

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

And let me ask you this @ThePhleo: do you consider Mega Man non -1 to be an official release?  Why or why not?  I ask because I consider this Chiller to be eerily similar to the MM6 in terms of our discussion in this thread...

Edited October 26, 2021 by Dr. Morbis

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

5 minutes ago, Code Monkey said:

Yes, I get it now. This advertisement is enough for me to classify it as released but not enough for you. That's understandable, I'm glad I understand now.

That's great, also be sure to include every other "unreleased" NES game that was advertised in US media, as by your classification system, all NES games that were advertised were officially released...

PS - Can I please borrow your copy of The Price is Right?  I've been wanting to play it for years......

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

@Dr. Morbis I do consider Mega Man 6 an official release. But not an American one.

the -USA tag doesn’t matter either. Look at the PAL library and you’ll see that the ending code is only a suggestion of where the copy was released, especially the PAL-A library.

Mega Man 6 -USA is an authentic Brazilian Playtronic release. Same for all the super rare games they have like Dinosaur Peak. They’re so authentic that if you put a proper back shell on them then there’s no telling where they came from.

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

10 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

How many copies of Sharedata Chiller have been found in the last 30 years?  How many boxes?  How many manuals?  And now ask yourself this: how many do you think would have been found if the game had been "released"?  Think about it.....

Both Red Sea Crossing and Birthday Mania had retail releases by way of magazine order forms and only 1 or 2 of each game have ever been found. So my answer would be that I would expect it to be exactly the 2 or 3 or 4 copies that have been found. Air Raid had lots of cartridge copies found and was thought to be cartridge only for a long time until a box was found just a few years ago.

I understand not believing it was released because you don't believe they had copies to ship out but you can't use the excuse that not many copies have been found. The exact same number of copies have been found for other released games from the same time period.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

Just now, ThePhleo said:

@Dr. Morbis I do consider Mega Man 6 an official release. But not an American one.

the -USA tag doesn’t matter either. Look at the PAL library and you’ll see that the ending code is only a suggestion of where the copy was released, especially the PAL-A library.

Mega Man 6 -USA is an authentic Brazilian Playtronic release. Same for all the super rare games they have like Dinosaur Peak. They’re so authentic that if you put a proper back shell on them then there’s no telling where they came from.

I know it's a "release" somewhere in the world - I meant do you consider it to be a -USA release?  That's the code it has, and it's been found boxed, loose, sealed, you name it.

If you do not consider it a US release, then why would Chiller be any different?  They were both clearly obviously intended to be released in the US, but were held back by the companies after production for whatever reason.  So why do you ignore this aspect for one game but not the other???

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

2 minutes ago, Code Monkey said:

Both Red Sea Crossing and Birthday Mania had retail releases by way of magazine order forms and only 1 or 2 of each game have ever been found. So my answer would be that I would expect it to be exactly the 2 or 3 or 4 copies that have been found. Air Raid had lots of cartridge copies found and was thought to be cartridge only for a long time until a box was found just a few years ago.

I understand not believing it was released because you don't believe they had copies to ship out but you can't use the excuse that not many copies have been found. The exact same number of copies have been found for other released games from the same time period.

Chiller's ad was a FULL PAGE AD IN GAMEPRO, not exactly comparable to your Atari examples.  You're telling me that you believe a full page ad in a leading contemporary game magazine garnered no more than a couple of sales?  Come on man...

[Code Monkey | 2,006]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Chiller's ad was a FULL PAGE AD IN GAMEPRO, not exactly comparable to your Atari examples.  You're telling me that you believe a full page ad in a leading contemporary game magazine garnered no more than a couple of sales?  Come on man...

Your delivery leaves a lot to be desired but good point.