Flying Sucks

[guitarzombie | 924]

I just got this in the mail a couple of days ago.  All the flying I need
 

 

[spacepup | 2,405]

I mean, I was on flights just last month and I don't consider myself an idiot.

[fcgamer | 4,730]

10 minutes ago, spacepup said:

I mean, I was on flights just last month and I don't consider myself an idiot.

Well, it's an unpopular viewpoint, but here's how I look at it:

A. The pandemic is over and covid-19 is not the beast it once was, i.e. it's like a common cold.

If this is the case, then there is no longer any need for the red tape surrounding flying, i.e. proof of vaccination, requirements for pcr tests for some countries, etc. We don't have such measures in place for the flu, do we?

OR

B. The pandemic, although covid-19 is much milder now (my whole family got it about two weeks ago, actually), it's still a very dangerous beast and precautions are needed left, right and center. If this is the case, then anyone who is flying outside of humanitary needs (i.e. visiting a dying relative or a young son / daughter or something) is traveling for unnecessary reasons, imo, and is spreading germs unnecessarily, and knowingly so.

These are the two options imo.

 

[spacepup | 2,405]

I don't make the rules and regulations.  So I don't really see how myself or anyone would be an idiot for flying right now, which is what you said.   And honestly, the rules aren't super strict atm (at least here in the US) regarding flights.  Many of the issues are from staffing or other problems, creating significant delays and cancellations.  

In either case, if you don't like the rules, that's one thing, but I just thought it odd to say that anyone flying right now is an idiot.  When myself, and many others here, are doing just that. 

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

I mean most people are idiots I don't see what flying has to do with it  

[fcgamer | 4,730]

44 minutes ago, spacepup said:

I don't make the rules and regulations.  So I don't really see how myself or anyone would be an idiot for flying right now, which is what you said.   And honestly, the rules aren't super strict atm (at least here in the US) regarding flights.  Many of the issues are from staffing or other problems, creating significant delays and cancellations.  

In either case, if you don't like the rules, that's one thing, but I just thought it odd to say that anyone flying right now is an idiot.  When myself, and many others here, are doing just that. 

I am not talking about rules, rather I am talking about covid 19.

If it's a serious threat, people shouldn't be flying, and if they are (for non humanitarian purposes) then they are idiots or are feeling pressured due to work; if it's not a threat, then I don't want to see any masks anywhere, or see restrictions and vaccine passports and all that BS. 

It can't be both ways, unless things are dangerous and people just ignore the dangers, in which case I would consider it being a case of idiots. Am I not right?

[fcgamer | 4,730]

5 minutes ago, CodysGameRoom said:

I mean most people are idiots I don't see what flying has to do with it  

Well I agree most people are idiots, that's scary that we both agree for once, I'm gonna leave it at that...

[spacepup | 2,405]

I don't really follow the logic, because not everything has to be analyzed in extremes.  There are some people who feel COVID is still very serious, and others who don't.  There are people, like myself, who believe that it is still a danger, but, we've developed some ways to mitigate risk and still manage about, by following what is going on and modifying based on the severity of things.  I believe we are working to find a balance in things.  We know we have to keep the economy and society going, but we also want to be safe, so we're balancing all that and managing the best we can (some of us).

We don't have to be in "one camp" or "the other" here.  COVID can be a combination of concerning, but not 'omg everything should be shut down and masks should be required everywhere no matter the circumstance.'

I wear my mask in some situations, and in other situations, I don't.  I don't think there's anything idiotic or foolish about this.

At any rate, at this point people have a variety of opinions about COVID, where we are, what we should do, and there is simply not going to be complete agreement on exactly what the situation is and how to handle it.  Personally, I'm still taking it somewhat seriously, but I'm not a shut-in.  I'm going on vacations and living life, with some modifications.  I'm very cognizant of things like sanitary behaviors, and there are times when I put on a mask depending on the environment.  Essentially, I'm figuring out a balance that works *for me* in re-integrating somewhat to normal life, while also being careful in some instances.  So again, it doesn't have to be one extreme or the other.

[fcgamer | 4,730]

16 minutes ago, spacepup said:

I don't really follow the logic, because not everything has to be analyzed in extremes.  There are some people who feel COVID is still very serious, and others who don't.  There are people, like myself, who believe that it is still a danger, but, we've developed some ways to mitigate risk and still manage about, by following what is going on and modifying based on the severity of things.  I believe we are working to find a balance in things.  We know we have to keep the economy and society going, but we also want to be safe, so we're balancing all that and managing the best we can (some of us).

We don't have to be in "one camp" or "the other" here.  COVID can be a combination of concerning, but not 'omg everything should be shut down and masks should be required everywhere no matter the circumstance.'

I wear my mask in some situations, and in other situations, I don't.  I don't think there's anything idiotic or foolish about this.

At any rate, at this point people have a variety of opinions about COVID, where we are, what we should do, and there is simply not going to be complete agreement on exactly what the situation is and how to handle it.  Personally, I'm still taking it somewhat seriously, but I'm not a shut-in.  I'm going on vacations and living life, with some modifications.  I'm very cognizant of things like sanitary behaviors, and there are times when I put on a mask depending on the environment.  Essentially, I'm figuring out a balance that works *for me* in re-integrating somewhat to normal life, while also being careful in some instances.  So again, it doesn't have to be one extreme or the other.

Yup that's my point, so you are in the camp that does not see it as the bubonic plague 2.0. 

That's fine and all that jazz, but as I mentioned earlier, damn, we can't even restore normalcy in mailing parcels abroad the world round?!? Eff, iirc Hong Kong can't even mail to the USA and that's not some dinky, poor, obscure region.

Let's keep spreading boys, spread, spread, spread

[spacepup | 2,405]

One thing I've learned throughout all this, is that there are very strongly opinionated people on all sides of this issue, who very passionately believe in their vision, but cannot *force* other people to view things the same way.  

At some point, you just have to develop your own views on the situation, and act accordingly.  Because I can't force anyone else to be more strict, or more cautious, depending on the circumstances.  I can't change the local grocery store's policy on masks, and I can't change the rules for international travel and shipping.  

What I can do, is review all the latest information, make an informed decision that works for me and my family, and try to balance staying safe while also living life.  

Finding that balance can be tricky for some, and we're still figuring it all out.

 

[FireHazard51 | 2,047]

Flying use to be a "privilege" and I think it was that way because the cost.  Nowadays it's affordable for most to do and even cheaper than alternative modes of transportation.  Overall I do agree that flights are not as good as they use to be.  Like there is clear evidence that flights are worse by cramming in more seats within the same air frame.  

I would never look to an airplane ride as a "fun" thing but just a means to get somewhere.  As long as it's not completely miserable I'm good.  The biggest thing that pisses me off is the shit to just get to the damn gate.  Some shit makes sense but other things..... 

 

[Brickman | 3,995]

6 hours ago, fcgamer said:

I take this, to a point, but as someone who's lived abroad in a culture quite unlike his own for over a decade...in the end, it's all the same. Every culture has some sort of housing, some sort of bread / noodles, music, etc. There are differences, but we tend to get hung up in that, when in actuality people are more or less the same.

Though...I kid you not, a friend of my local friend, his biggest shock when visiting the States...drive through banks.

Yes and that’s what’s so interesting. Seeing how that culture lives and the art they create differs from your own. The culture and landscape in a place like Vietnam is very different from someone living in England for example. 

Like your friend I was also shocked to see drive thru ATMs in the US because we don’t have them here either. Would never have discovered that sitting at home not seeing the world.

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

On 7/14/2022 at 4:38 PM, Gloves said:

I'd love to, and can afford to etc., not much life-wise holding me back. What stops me is that I'm incredibly claustrophobic - a 15 minute car ride takes a relatively significant amount of physical and mental prep. I can only imagine the anxiety I'd feel at the prospect of hopping on a plane.

I haven't flown since 2002. I hate it and I doubt my nerves could even handle it nowadays. I'm not as bad about car rides, but anything over an hour gets to be really agitating for me.

[phart010 | 1,708]

11 hours ago, fcgamer said:

I am not talking about rules, rather I am talking about covid 19.

If it's a serious threat, people shouldn't be flying, and if they are (for non humanitarian purposes) then they are idiots or are feeling pressured due to work; if it's not a threat, then I don't want to see any masks anywhere, or see restrictions and vaccine passports and all that BS. 

It can't be both ways, unless things are dangerous and people just ignore the dangers, in which case I would consider it being a case of idiots. Am I not right?

I agree that they shouldn’t be enforcing the masks anymore since Covid is now considered mild due to herd immunity. But it’s going a bit too far to say you don’t want to see any masks anywhere.

If people want to mask up, that’s their personal choice. Living in Asia, you should know firsthand that prudent people in Asia have been masking up long before Covid in some public settings. That’s just  an extra measure that some people take so they can avoid getting a cold or a flu when there’s a ton of other people around. Which is why masking up was never as big of a deal for Asians as it was for Americans.

[fcgamer | 4,730]

3 hours ago, phart010 said:

I agree that they shouldn’t be enforcing the masks anymore since Covid is now considered mild due to herd immunity. But it’s going a bit too far to say you don’t want to see any masks anywhere.

I just feel that if the situation is serious enough that we need to put so many measures in place, people shouldn't be flying aside from the utmost necessity; conversely, if the situation is not serious at all then there shouldn't be the safety measures put in place, as they would not be necessary any longer.

[Tabonga | 2,324]

On 7/14/2022 at 12:55 PM, Gloves said:

I've never flown, and I've not really had much reason to even think about it. 

 

[nrslam | 476]

There were A-hole flyers in pre 9/11 times too. I know because I was one.

Little known fact from BITD; small, non-structural skin cracks on airplanes were marked with yellow grease pencils, usually a circle to indicate a crack tip with a line leading back to the point of origin. These marks were made by inspectors after each flight and when crack length or density reached a threshold, that skin panel was replaced.

I used to point out those crack marks to my seatmates, especially the nervous looking ones, along with comments like "Ooh! I don't think they're supposed to let them get that long." Got plenty of empty seats next to me that way.

FWIW, airlines no longer use visible crack indicators like that.

Edited July 16, 2022 by nrslam

[LeatherRebel5150 | 1,056]

On 7/15/2022 at 8:51 AM, spacepup said:

Flying is necessary to do the things I want to do in life.  Can it be annoying sometimes? Yes, absolutely.  Is it worth it? Yes, absolutely.  I love traveling and seeing the world too much.  

There are some things you can do to minimize problems - you can never guarantee there won't be issues, but you can do some prep to help.  For example, don't book flights with a 30-minute layover.  A slight delay and boom, you miss your connection.  Do your research about the airport and how busy it gets, to make sure you are there in time.  Pack your items such that in a worst case scenario situation where your bag is lost, you have what you need in your carry-on.  Check-in and prepare your baggage before stepping in the airport.  Make sure your bag is under the weight limit or your carry-on is the appropriate size.  Consider getting TSA pre-check to make security screening better.

I could go on and on, about a number of things you can do to at least make the experience better or minimize issues.  There is still always the chance for a problem, but you can take some steps to make it better.

As someone else said, you also just have to bring plenty of patience, and be prepared that issues happen.  If you have a gameplan beforehand, you can handle it much better than experiencing a delay and on-the-fly reacting "oh my god! what am I gonna do?!"

Honestly all that prep work sounds miserable. But I suppose if your a type that loves to see the world you’ll put up with it.

I hate flaying, the last time I did it was 2016 and I hope that to be the last time ever. I don’t mind the act of flying, but all the bullshit around it (like having to do all the prep work you described) just kills a trip experience. Flight gets all screwed up on the day you leave and  now you lose a day out of vacation, screws up on the way back and now tour missing luggage or miss another day and have to spend more money on food, tickets, whatever.

Nah, I’ll stick to driving. Not a hell of a lot to go wrong there barring a car wreck. Its too far to drive or across the ocean, then I don’t need to see it in person, probably couldn’t afford it anyway  

[Estil | 1,265]

On 7/14/2022 at 8:07 PM, B.A. said:

Am I sure it's fun? Yes.  You get free booze, a meal that isn't bad, 1st to board the plane and exit, and it's not so much the wider seat it's the extra legroom.  Tall people aren't eating their knees and you can actually recline your seat. A bathroom you only have to share with a few other people. How much all that is worth is certainly debatable, but it definitely makes for an immensely more enjoyable experience.  

That's what I've also often questioned my late wife about regarding those Bose Wave Radios she thought so highly of...I've no doubt at all the sound is better and "more lifelike" (as their commercials say), but is it $400-$500 better?

I'm guessing the usual going rate for first class is at least double what coach would cost for the same flight, right?  So again, I've no doubt at all it "makes for an immensely more enjoyable experience", but is it over double the price better?

PS: I'm one of the boring teetotalers of this group (nothing morally against it exactly I just never cared for adult beverages) so...can I get free Diet Pepsi?  Or it'd be my luck they'd only have Coke

[Tulpa | 3,517]

5 hours ago, Estil said:

I'm guessing the usual going rate for first class is at least double what coach would cost for the same flight, right?  So again, I've no doubt at all it "makes for an immensely more enjoyable experience", but is it over double the price better?

Depends on who you are and what resources you have. If you have a travel expense account, have a lot of miles built up on credit cards or from flying a lot, or are of a certain income level that double the price is a negligible increase (and you don't necessarily have to be that rich, just fairly well off), then yeah, it does usually mean first class is double the price better. You have a lot less hassle, you can make important meetings on time more or less, and you get access to certain airport lounges to make the flying experience somewhat less than miserable.

If you're a schlub who only flies once in a blue moon and makes a modest income (or is on the dole), then yeah, coach is probably fine because nine times out of ten, you'll put up with the hassle for the bare bones coach flight if it means saving some dough.

That's why coach cabins are ten to fifty times the size of first class.

Of course if you fly something like Emirates, then first class often means you get what you pay for:

 

5 hours ago, Estil said:

PS: I'm one of the boring teetotalers of this group (nothing morally against it exactly I just never cared for adult beverages) so...can I get free Diet Pepsi?  Or it'd be my luck they'd only have Coke

Depends on the airline. Most offer free soft drinks in coach.

Edited July 17, 2022 by Tulpa

[avatar! | 1,820]

A US flyer tracked his lost luggage back to London and was told by American to go pick it up from the airport — even though he was 4,000 miles away in North Carolina

https://www.businessinsider.com/american-airlines-lost-luggage-heathrow-stranger-texted-passenger-airport-bag-2022-7

[Daniel_Doyce | 475]

On 7/17/2022 at 3:24 PM, Tulpa said:

Depends on who you are and what resources you have. If you have a travel expense account, have a lot of miles built up on credit cards or from flying a lot, or are of a certain income level that double the price is a negligible increase (and you don't necessarily have to be that rich, just fairly well off), then yeah, it does usually mean first class is double the price better. You have a lot less hassle, you can make important meetings on time more or less, and you get access to certain airport lounges to make the flying experience somewhat less than miserable.

If you're a schlub who only flies once in a blue moon and makes a modest income (or is on the dole), then yeah, coach is probably fine because nine times out of ten, you'll put up with the hassle for the bare bones coach flight if it means saving some dough.

That's why coach cabins are ten to fifty times the size of first class.

Of course if you fly something like Emirates, then first class often means you get what you pay for:

 

Depends on the airline. Most offer free soft drinks in coach.

Most people flying Business class, as the name suggests, aren't paying for it themselves.

[avatar! | 1,820]

American Airlines passengers were left 'sobbing' after being held on a hot plane for six hours, report says

https://www.businessinsider.com/american-airlines-travel-chaos-left-hot-plane-sobbing-2022-7

American Airlines held passengers on a hot plane with no food or drink service for six hours on Sunday afternoon, according to a reporter for The Charlotte Observer.

She said in a tweet that by the sixth hour of being held on the plane, another passenger on the flight was having a "mental breakdown." She added that American Airlines did not allow passengers to exit despite their distress.

Contino said the airline turned the air conditioning off to save fuel, "until people started sobbing and having panic attacks."

Representatives for American Airlines did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment.

"While certainly an unfortunate delay, it is something we apologize to our customers for with the combination of maintenance and weather," Trull said.

[MrWunderful | 2,927]

1 hour ago, avatar! said:

American Airlines passengers were left 'sobbing' after being held on a hot plane for six hours, report says

https://www.businessinsider.com/american-airlines-travel-chaos-left-hot-plane-sobbing-2022-7

American Airlines held passengers on a hot plane with no food or drink service for six hours on Sunday afternoon, according to a reporter for The Charlotte Observer.

She said in a tweet that by the sixth hour of being held on the plane, another passenger on the flight was having a "mental breakdown." She added that American Airlines did not allow passengers to exit despite their distress.

Contino said the airline turned the air conditioning off to save fuel, "until people started sobbing and having panic attacks."

Representatives for American Airlines did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment.

"While certainly an unfortunate delay, it is something we apologize to our customers for with the combination of maintenance and weather," Trull said.

I’d be getting locked up or getting put on the no-fly list as I force my way out of that cabin. Let the flight attendants try stop me.

 

I wonder if there’s anything in the terms of service when you buy the ticket that says they can do that to you. If not I’d be calling the cops and telling them that American Airlines kidnapped me and 150 other people or whatever it is in a holding us against our will. 

Edited July 28, 2022 by MrWunderful

[captmorgandrinker | 1,649]

I thought there was a federal regulation where you had to deplane after three hours?