Game Debate #36: Tetris

[Splain | 2,569]

The "hold" feature in more modern Tetris games turns it into a different game. That game is also fun, but it's undeniably a nerfed version of real Tetris. Someone played Tetris, whined that it was too hard, and invented the Hold feature.

But yeah, I gave it a 10. It's in my top Very Few games, easily. It's funny to think that a game like Tetris can compete with games that have a lot more "content," like, well, all the other games we've been ranking. But nothing is quite like it. I'll be fixing a Game Boy or something, and I'll pop Tetris in to quickly test the screen, and then like 30 minutes later "yep, it's good."

"0/10 - The Desert Bus of painful experiences. You'd rather shove an icepick in your genitals than play this."

RIP you guys' genitals.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,528]

Changed the OP art.  Hopefully you're even more confused now.

[T-Pac | 7,544]

My favorite thing about Tetris is that it's one of the few video games my whole family can enjoy playing together, taking turns at the controller. The only other video games that have ever held my parents' interest were Pac-Man and Atari Golf.

Also, it's basically the perfect puzzle-game ... so there's that, too.

-CasualCart

[Jeevan | 8,911]

25 minutes ago, CasualCart said:

My favorite thing about Tetris is that it's one of the few video games my whole family can enjoy playing together, taking turns at the controller. The only other video games that have ever held my parents' interest were Pac-Man and Atari Golf.

Also, it's basically the perfect puzzle-game ... so there's that, too.

-CasualCart

my mother used to sit up at night and play Mario 1.  When we found out it was funny because we didn't think she liked video games at all.

[peg | 370]

2 hours ago, mbd39 said:

Nice. My pb is 566k with a level 15 start and over 400k with a level 18 start.

I hit a wall with level 19 though. I can barely even make one Tetris.

All I can say is that it took me an absurd amount of time to get even remotely decent at level 19+.  Even still, doing 19 starts I usually play too aggressively and top out around 100-200K.  It really takes some restraint for me to post decent scores because I'm just way too aggressive. 

 

Also do you ever play B-Type?  I highly recommend it, I got substantially better at clearing out of weird situations from playing it.  I'm still looking for that elusive 19-4 clear though.

 

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by peg

[Sumer | 221]

On 2/11/2021 at 8:42 PM, Tulpa said:

I got the sense that the poll is primarily for the NES version. Licensed Nintendo.

Nope, Tengen version got my score of 8.    Just because it one of the few games I can get my wife to play with me recently.  Two-player Tengen is my favorite at the moment, but I am also not a big Tetris guy, so that is why I gave it an 8...I can do puzzle games once in awhile, but my wife loves them.

Nintendo version would be a 7 to me...just under Tengen due to no 2-player simultaneous.

[Sumer | 221]

On 2/12/2021 at 2:44 AM, Sumez said:

I'm not sure anyone likes Tengen Tetris, it's just popular because of its rarity and historical circumstances.

As a Tetris game it's really terrible.  

I do...see my comment above.  If I can get my wife to play a game with me with four kids for us to handle, it gets the nod ahead of the NES version.  I think it is a great version of the game.

[Tulpa | 3,495]

Tengen version might be okay if you don't play a lot but once you start getting into the higher levels it becomes apparent how limited that version is. The co-op and competitive modes are nice, but in terms of look I prefer the Nintendo version. The Tengen version grays out the pieces when they set and I don't like that. I also think the Nintendo version's music is more iconic.

Edited February 13, 2021 by Tulpa

[mbd39 | 2,020]

3 minutes ago, Tulpa said:

Tengen version might be okay if you don't play a lot but once you start getting into the higher levels it becomes apparent how limited that version is. The co-op and competitive modes are nice but in terms of look I prefer the Nintendo version. The Tengen version grays out the pieces when they set and I don't like that. I also think the Nintendo version's music is more iconic.

The Tengen version has been considered "better" for years. But the Nintendo version's had the last laugh. People are getting into Nintendo Tetris thanks to  Youtube, CTWC, Jonas Neubauer, Joseph Saelee, etc. It's still a high level competitive game. The Tengen version is almost forgotten by comparison.

 

 

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

9 hours ago, mbd39 said:

The Tengen version has been considered "better" for years. But the Nintendo version's had the last laugh. People are getting into Nintendo Tetris thanks to  Youtube, CTWC, Jonas Neubauer, Joseph Saelee, etc. It's still a high level competitive game. The Tengen version is almost forgotten by comparison.

 

 

No, people are into the Nintendo version because it's actually challenging; once you get to even a mediocre level of ability in Tetris, you can play the Tengen version forever... and that gets real boring real fast...

[Sumer | 221]

22 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

No, people are into the Nintendo version because it's actually challenging; once you get to even a mediocre level of ability in Tetris, you can play the Tengen version forever... and that gets real boring real fast...

I think I am lower than mediocre, then.  

I have never been a good Tetris player, and really just enjoy it once in a great while, but especially when my wife and I play against each other.  She's good...too good...

[CMR | 520]

I've been playing tetris since it came out on the gameboy and NES, and I've bought multiple versions of it across multiple systems.  For this reason alone I think it deserves a 10.

[mbd39 | 2,020]

31 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

No, people are into the Nintendo version because it's actually challenging; once you get to even a mediocre level of ability in Tetris, you can play the Tengen version forever... and that gets real boring real fast...

And that's why it's still a high level competitive game that draws interest.

[Sumez | 2,951]

Exactly. Tengen Tetris could never be a competitive game at all, because you only need a very basic understanding of Tetris to easily play it forever and lose any kind of metric to actually estimate the skill of the player. And by barely giving any reward for making tetrises, it doesn't even entice people to play skillfully either. It's pretty much just the time waster that a lot of people tend to write Tetris off as in the first place.

(And that's only the surface of its issues. The oddly asymetric rotations and the wall kick that only works in one direction is bound to throw off even beginner players. Tengen Tetris just feels really uncomfortable to play)

Like I explained earlier, one of the primary things that really fascinates me about Tetris is the near infinite depth of the design which is absolutely comparable to a game like Chess. Every new piece introduces at least 10+ possible ways you could place it, and even as soon as the next one spawns that already adds up to 100+ different combinations. There are trillions of ways even short Tetris games can play out, and even equally skilled top players with a perfect understanding for the most optimal placements will always end out with very different games when given the same pieces.

As such, it's a game you can always get better at. It doesn't matter if you've played it for a year, five years, or twenty, there is always more to learn, habits you can work on, and little things that can be improved.
When a game like Tengen Tetris gives you no metric to compare that level of skill between two players, it essentially foregoes the one thing that makes Tetris incredibly good. It's not like you need to be a top level player to reach that point, either. Practice Tetris for a week and you'll be able to perform "perfectly" in Tengen Tetris.

 

Now getting into Nintendo's NES Tetris, that game is a real little oddball. Because the exact same thing that makes in incredibly competitive is also the thing that makes me feel the game doesn't play very well, and probably wouldn't score higher than a high 8/10 compare to the indisputable 10/10 I'd award Tetris in general.

The complex DAS mechanics, which are very clearly a result of messy programming moreso than overt game design, means that even controlling the pieces at the higher speed levels is its own skill that needs to be honed in order to master that metagame. Something that's largely invisible to anyone just watching the game. When you are watching the top players duke it out in the big tournaments, there's a lot going on simply in order to maintain the fastest sideways speed of the pieces and make them as mobile as what you're seeing. Unless the player is a hypertapper, where that aspect is clearly visible, even if the reason they are doing it isn't.

This is a game mechanic that is entirely unique to that NES version of Tetris, and a skill that you can't transfer to any other versions, just like simply being good at Tetris won't help you get past level 19 on an NTSC version of the game. When you observe players at tournaments, you will often see that the people who get far are the people who are the best at controlling the pieces at those speeds, and not necessarily the people who make the best decisions about where to put the pieces. Because as long as you can get them almost anywhere, you can really get away with a lot of sloppy play, which will help you score much higher as long as you'll make it to the killscreen.
That said, the absolute best players have the full stack. They are excellent at every aspect of the game, so high level matches are still extremely exciting to watch.

And that's where NES Tetris really excels. I don't enjoy playing it much myself, but I do think it is hands down the absolute best version of Tetris for spectator matches. Unlike most variations of high level play, it's simple and slow enough that anyone who doesn't even understand Tetris can easily follow what's going on, yet the metrics for being the best players are at such an insanely high level that the game is as competitive as any sport.

Edited February 15, 2021 by Sumez

[Jicsan | 589]

Went with a 10.  I have to be careful when starting to play Tetris because I will lose track of time and next thing you know it's 2 am.  My go to version now is Tetris Effect on the PS4.  

[Ninja Warriors | 86]

The New Tetris in n64 is a perfect 10 in my estimation.

 

All other versions of Tetris cap out at a 9.

 

[Inzoreno | 102]

For me, Tetris is THE perfect game. It's such a basic concept that practically anyone is able to understand how it is played with very little background, but it does take skill to get truly good at the game. The mechanics are tuned in such a way that there's really not much you can change to make it that much better than earlier versions. It's a game that, to this day, continues to be ported and played by people all over the world. It's timeless. 

[mbd39 | 2,020]

Speaking of Tetris, I got a new level 0 start PB. 464K! I went from 0 to 19 so my Tetris rate must have been really high.

I guess my next big goal is over 500k with a level 18 start. Or 600k with any level start.

 

[Reed Rothchild | 9,528]

Second week in a row I forgot to ready a game debate...

Uh... what would be a good one *thinks*

[Tulpa | 3,495]

Pit Fighter!

[mbd39 | 2,020]

Have you done Mike Tyson's Punch-Out yet?

[Strange | 1,700]

One of the rare times you can say “one of the greatest video games ever made” and it not be an exaggeration.

[SpoonMan Abrams X | 697]

On 2/12/2021 at 4:58 PM, CasualCart said:

My favorite thing about Tetris is that it's one of the few video games my whole family can enjoy playing together, taking turns at the controller. The only other video games that have ever held my parents' interest were Pac-Man and Atari Golf.

Also, it's basically the perfect puzzle-game ... so there's that, too.

-CasualCart

Had this on Gameboy. One of the few games I would play with my sister and she would kick my butt lol

A great game, the hallmark of Puzzle vidya

9/10