How do you pronounce Ninja Gaiden?

[Hammerfestus | 3,921]

Here’s the real question: when you are speaking a foreign language and you encounter a loan word from your native language, do you pronounce it the way you would in your native language or do you use a sketchy imitation of the way they pronounce it in the foreign language?

[fcgamer | 4,792]

20 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

That's because your country is ESL.  In countries where English is the first language, seeing a word with an "ai" in the middle makes you naturally say the word like "gay" not "guy."  That's why all of us in North America grew up saying Ninja Gay-den until we learned the supposed "proper" way years later.

But with regards to linguistics, it doesn't much matter what the origin country calls anything, really; if a word is sounded out a certain way in a certain region, then that is the right way to pronounce it in that region.  Are all English-speaking people wrong for calling Deutchland Germany?  Do you think the Japanese call their country "Japan?"  Are portuguese people "wrong" for spelling my country "Kanada?"  I could go on literally forever, but the point is: if everyone in a certain region pronounces a word a certain way, then that is the correct way to say that word in that region... Full Stop.

Excellent post.

A fun example is with the Pennsylvania Dutch, who are actually of German ancestry. Then again, from my understanding Dutch didn't just mean "Netherlands people" back in the day.

Speaking of Netherlands though, a lot of people I know refer to the country as Holland even though that's not correct. Or the country where I reside, technically Taiwan just refers to the largest island. 

These aren't pronunciation issues, but they still relate to different groups of people using language in a certain way, even if it is technically "incorrect".

Going back to names though, it drives me nuts when people pronounce their surnames wrong.

 

[Kguillemette | 1,561]

I used to say gayden until I learned the right way to say it. Same with rye you vs Ryu. 

[Ankos | 479]

1 hour ago, Dr. Morbis said:

That's because your country is ESL.  In countries where English is the first language, seeing a word with an "ai" in the middle makes you naturally say the word like "gay" not "guy."  That's why all of us in North America grew up saying Ninja Gay-den until we learned the supposed "proper" way years later.

But with regards to linguistics, it doesn't much matter what the origin country calls anything, really; if a word is sounded out a certain way in a certain region, then that is the right way to pronounce it in that region.  Are all English-speaking people wrong for calling Deutchland Germany?  Do you think the Japanese call their country "Japan?"  Are portuguese people "wrong" for spelling my country "Kanada?"  I could go on literally forever, but the point is: if everyone in a certain region pronounces a word a certain way, then that is the correct way to say that word in that region... Full Stop.

I agree with this logic, however judging by the commercial I posted and claims people make on this site both pronunciations appear to have been used back in the 1980s in the USA, so it wouldn't be quite right to say every person called it one or the other. The thread title just asks how people pronounce it though, it does not ask which way is correct. I was not born in the 80s, so when I first heard the game's name I heard Guyden and that stuck with me

Side note: Why is it called "Gaiden"? Doesn't that mean side story? It has Japanese text on the cart label that says that when I put it in Google Translate. That isn't a very good title for the main entries in a series

[SailingWiimote | 16]

[CMR | 522]

If people would just spell the English pronunciations properly instead of butchering the language every time they introduce a foreign word, we wouldn't have these problems.

Edited June 7, 2023 by CMR

[Dr. Morbis | 2,096]

1 hour ago, Ankos said:

The thread title just asks how people pronounce it though, it does not ask which way is correct. I was not born in the 80s, so when I first heard the game's name I heard Guyden and that stuck with me

My post was not intended to determine which way of saying Gaiden is correct, but rather to refute the arguments claiming that Gay-den is 100% wrong around the world on account of the pronunciation it has in Japan.  For me personally, I did not once hear it pronounced Guy-den before the year 2000 - not one single time - so in my small neck of the woods in Western Canada, Gay-den was the "correct" way to say Gaiden before the internet made us all 1337 videogame  know-it-alls for the rest of our natural lives...  

[JamesRobot | 5,844]

2 hours ago, fcgamer said:

Going back to names though, it drives me nuts when people pronounce their surnames wrong.

fcgamer  is actually pronounced eff see gah-MEHR in his native toung.

[Tulpa | 3,569]

1 hour ago, Ankos said:

 

Side note: Why is it called "Gaiden"? Doesn't that mean side story? It has Japanese text on the cart label that says that when I put it in Google Translate. That isn't a very good title for the main entries in a series

Side story is one of the meanings. It could also mean "tale" according to some. Literally, gaiden is "outside legend." 

The Japanese title translates to Ninja Dragon Sword Legend. 

One theory I read was Ninja Gaiden was the working title in Japan before they adopted Ninja Ryukenden, but kept Ninja Gaiden for North America because it looks cool and exotic. 

Who knows?

[Link | 2,768]

I always said Guy-den. Although I think some kids in school said Gay-den. But not everybody. 

Gray-dee-us, although I don't think I knew of it back in the day. 

Never knew how to say Taito. 

Kage is obviously Cage, there's no chance for that to be anything else with English convention. 

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

15 hours ago, Ankos said:

I agree with this logic, however judging by the commercial I posted and claims people make on this site both pronunciations appear to have been used back in the 1980s in the USA, so it wouldn't be quite right to say every person called it one or the other. The thread title just asks how people pronounce it though, it does not ask which way is correct. I was not born in the 80s, so when I first heard the game's name I heard Guyden and that stuck with me

Side note: Why is it called "Gaiden"? Doesn't that mean side story? It has Japanese text on the cart label that says that when I put it in Google Translate. That isn't a very good title for the main entries in a series

I'm surprised that nobody brought up this clip from The Wizard yet.

Edited June 7, 2023 by Bearcat-Doug

[docile tapeworm | 4,206]

2 hours ago, Bearcat-Doug said:

I'm surprised that nobody mentioned this being mentioned in The Wizard yet.

Never trust a guy in an orange jump suit!

Ng2 challenge?! I can’t remember if I cleared that before or not. Are you good at it?

Edited June 7, 2023 by docile tapeworm

[DoctorEncore | 3,691]

Gay-den when I was a kid and then Guy-den after I took Japanese in college.

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

1 hour ago, docile tapeworm said:

Never trust a guy in an orange jump suit!

Ng2 challenge?! I can’t remember if I cleared that before or not. Are you good at it?

I'm good at the first one, okay at the second one and awful at the third.

[AirVillain | 494]

"Ninja Gai...DEN!"

Is the only correct way.

[Tyree_Cooper | 781]

kesselveynia

[BlackVega | 583]

Of course it's pronounced "guy" den. Are you even aware there are other languages on this planet other than English? (I'm talking to you AVGN)

[fcgamer | 4,792]

5 minutes ago, BlackVega said:

Of course it's pronounced "guy" den. Are you even aware there are other languages on this planet other than English? (I'm talking to you AVGN)

So how do you pronounce / write the name of former USA president Martin van Buren?

Edited June 9, 2023 by fcgamer

[mbd39 | 2,036]

Used to think it was Gayden, now I say Guyden.

 

[docile tapeworm | 4,206]

I’m proud to be amongst the “gayden”

[Gentlegamer | 174]

how do you pronounce Legend of Kage?

[BlackVega | 583]

So many people insist that it is in fact "ninja gayden". So how is this, is the protagonist of this game really a homosexual or what?

What is the next topic, how do you pronounce "Ryu"?

Edited June 10, 2023 by BlackVega

[PII | 1,916]

On 6/6/2023 at 8:14 AM, docile tapeworm said:

no kid (on the playground, bus or in the neighborhood) ever: “it’s actually pronounced guyden”

I did.

I remember finding it weird that other kids pronounced it wrong and I specifically remember telling a friend once that I thought it was pronounced "guy-den."

I wasn't exactly knowledgeable about Japanese, but I did know enough back then to know that speakers of other languages pronounce letters, particularly vowels differently than native English speakers and on account of knowing enough about how German works, eg. when two vowels meet, it is typically the second vowel that is pronounced (albeit with an English sensibility), as in: "ie" is pronounced "ee" and "ei" is pronounced "i" (as in like.) I say with an English sensibility here because in German "e" is "ay" and "i" is "ee."

Anywho, to put it one way, I rather erroneously arrived at the correct pronunciation and to put it another way, I simply knew enough about another language, and generally, to arrive at the correct pronunciation.

At any rate I think you are right, generally speaking, every kid who wasn't a native Japanese speaker said it wrong back in the day, and I'm just an exception that assists in proving the rule...

[PII | 1,916]

18 hours ago, docile tapeworm said:

I’m proud to be amongst the “gayden”

I'm pleased to know you, "doctor of islands tappy-warm." 

Edited June 10, 2023 by PII

[fcgamer | 4,792]

8 hours ago, Gentlegamer said:

how do you pronounce Legend of Kage?

How do you pronounce / write the name of former USA president Martin van Buren? Well in the USA the "v" in "van" is capitalized, but that is wrong. I'd reckon the pronunciation that most attribute to his name is highly Anglicized as well. 

Not aimed at @Gentlegamer specifically, rather just making a point that why are we getting ready to tell others how to pronounce a Japanese name, yet no one is doing so over the name of a U.S. president? 

Let's also discuss the pronunciation of that Dutch painter, the one that did Starry Night.