Hardest game you've beaten?

[Reed Rothchild | 9,545]

 

6 minutes ago, AirVillain said:

Some of these newer games just let you play forever. So yeah, you played for 50 hours, but were those 50 hours AS difficult as Contra is?

Definitely more difficult.  The commonly cited equivalent is Zelda II.  Make Zelda II a 50 hours game and you're in the ballpark.  Zelda II is much harder than most of the NES games we're talking about IMO.  Harder than a 1CC of GnG?  I think it's a close call.

4 minutes ago, AirVillain said:

Or, if you die in Dark Souls do you have to start the game from the beginning? 

That would be impossible for 99.999% of players.  Like no-deathing Zelda II, but worse.

But there's certainly crazy-skilled people that can do it.

 

[AirVillain | 490]

15 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said:

"I beat the game but I used continues."

vs

"I completed the game but I used continues."

 

I've heard the former spoken countless times in my life, whereas the latter I've never heard, nor does it even sound right.  So I'm going to have  to side with backloggery...

But strictly grammatically speaking.... the word "beat" versus the word "complete" is the difference for me.

"Beat" implies defeating and crushing the game..... "completed" sounds so boring, like you just barely made your way through the game. 

I want to finish that game with some force!!

 

14 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

 

Definitely more difficult.  The commonly cited equivalent is Zelda II.  Make Zelda II a 50 hours game and you're in the ballpark.  Zelda II is much harder than most of the NES games we're talking about IMO.  Harder than a 1CC of GnG?  I think it's a close call.

That would be impossible for 99.999% of players.  Like no-deathing Zelda II, but worse.

But there's certainly crazy-skilled people that can do it

Interesting. Okay, well I suppose that would be a good candidate for the list, then. 

Perhaps Dark Souls isn't a good example, but do you know what I mean?

Overall, when a game is released today that people can just continue when they die and make their way through the game.... those games, in general?, aren't as difficult as some of the older ones like Contra, where if you aren't playing great you'll be fucked.....?

See what I mean? I don't know enough modern games to give better examples. Maybe I'm wrong.... but I'm pretty sure lots of games nowadays you can just cruise though and "beating"/"completing" it is just a matter of time.

[sp1nz | 612]

Wings of Vi on Mortal difficulty I guess.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,545]

21 minutes ago, AirVillain said:

But strictly grammatically speaking.... the word "beat" versus the word "complete" is the difference for me.

"Beat" implies defeating and crushing the game..... "completed" sounds so boring, like you just barely made your way through the game. 

I want to finish that game with some force!!

 

Interesting. Okay, well I suppose that would be a good candidate for the list, then. 

Perhaps Dark Souls isn't a good example, but do you know what I mean?

Overall, when a game is released today that people can just continue when they die and make their way through the game.... those games, in general?, aren't as difficult as some of the older ones like Contra, where if you aren't playing great you'll be fucked.....?

See what I mean? I don't know enough modern games to give better examples. Maybe I'm wrong.... but I'm pretty sure lots of games nowadays you can just cruise though and "beating"/"completing" it is just a matter of time.

Yes, it's definitely true.  One hour games that have to be padded out with extreme difficulty are less of a thing nowadays.  Most games are 8-20 hours, and are more of a "ride" that you see through to completion.  Brutal challenge is more of a side or optional thing with those kinds of games (ie Call of Duty World at War on Veteran, which several of us have called out as maybe being the hardest game we've EVER beaten).

But there are definitely lots and lots of modern game that returned to some of those old school sensibilities.  All of the roguelikes for example, give you one life to beat the game, and many of them (such as Isaac) or harder than most/all of the 8-bit games we're talking about.  And the Soulslikes.  And I'd say there games like Devil May Cry and Bayonetta which can be called the modern equivalent of beat-em-ups mixed with action platformers, and those games are absolutely no joke on the default difficulties, much less the hardest ones.

And then you've got the hell platformers like Meatboy and Celeste.  Cuphead, I Want to Be the Guy...

You can have it both ways nowadays.

[Dr. Morbis | 2,089]

2 hours ago, Reed Rothchild said:

 

Zelda II is much harder than most of the NES games we're talking about IMO.  Harder than a 1CC of GnG?  I think it's a close call.

I think you have to use caveats when making comparisons like this since many games can be manipulated for unfair advantages while still staying within the "rules" of the game.  For example, Zelda II is very easy to 1CC because it gives you a free man every time you level up after you've maxed out all of your attributes.  This means one can find a good spot to farm XP and build up nine men in reserve before tackling whatever difficult palace they're on, and then as soon as they get low on lives, back off and farm for more lives again.  Doing so [technically] allows for a pretty easy 1CC of a game that is otherwise extremely difficult to beat when using just the three starting lives plus the small handful of Link Dolls that are hidden throughout Hyrule...

Edited October 24, 2022 by Dr. Morbis

[Reed Rothchild | 9,545]

Gross.  I mean, you can do the same thing in Contra III, but I think it goes against the spirit of the accomplishment.

Sounds like a "no death" of Zelda II has a lot more merit.

[Sumez | 2,964]

12 hours ago, AirVillain said:

When you "beat" a game, you do literally that. Kick its ass and take no prisoners. 

Glad it's not just me. 

Its not a question of elitism or right/wrong way of playing a game. To me, saying that you "beat" something just implies exactly what you're saying. You kicked its ass! 

I also agree that "completing" a game has more to do with a completionist mindset. But in my experience people using that vocabulary tend to talk more about straight up coverage of game content, and not skill based challenges (which may not reveal any actual new content or even ingame recognition) 

[Sumez | 2,964]

Maybe all we need is a new vocabulary

"I defeated the game" 

Vs

"I covered all of the game" 

 

[guitarzombie | 924]

Its boiling down to this argument again?  Christ people, take your meds.

[Sumez | 2,964]

So cool

[mbd39 | 2,024]

I think Zelda II is way easier than Ghosts n Goblins.

As a kid, I was able to get close to the end of Zelda II with no exploits because I didn't know about any. On the other hand, GNG always kicked my ass. Even with infinite continues I never made it that far without giving up.

 

[guitarzombie | 924]

34 minutes ago, Sumez said:

So cool

Explain to me, whats the point of telling someone else that the way they beat the game isn't valid to YOU.  WHO CARES?!  Why is this a thing?!

[Sumez | 2,964]

No one is doing that, are you just looking for reasons to get aggressive?  

[guitarzombie | 924]

3 minutes ago, Sumez said:

No one is doing that, are you just looking for reasons to get aggressive?  

Ive seen plenty of times on NA the whole "You didn't beat the game unless you 1CC" or did this or that.  When I say "YOU" I meant the royal you, meaning anyone, not you specifically.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,545]

24 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

I think Zelda II is way easier than Ghosts n Goblins.

As a kid, I was able to get close to the end of Zelda II with no exploits because I didn't know about any. On the other hand, GNG always kicked my ass. Even with infinite continues I never made it that far without giving up.

 

Mileage definitely could vary per person.  I know that I was nearly able to 1CC GnG in one week back when we did the contest in 2016.  Whereas it probably took me 30-40 hours to limp through Zelda II, and the last dungeon was a massive struggle

[Sumez | 2,964]

Quote

Ive seen plenty of times on NA the whole "You didn't beat the game unless you 1CC" or did this or that.  When I say "YOU" I meant the royal you, meaning anyone, not you specifically.

Still, people aren't doing that. We're just discussing terminology.

Considering how much bullshit "this game is harder or that game is harder" talks usually go, it seems to me the discussion has been pretty sober and constructive in this thread so far. People might disagree, but I'm not seeing anyone getting into eachother's face.
And it's an interesting subject, at least it is to me, so no reason to slam on what people like talking about.  

(Edited with a quote, since Reed sniped the next post )

Edited October 24, 2022 by Sumez

[guitarzombie | 924]

1 minute ago, Sumez said:

Still, people aren't doing that. We're just discussing terminology.

Considering how much bullshit "this game is harder or that game is harder" talks usually go, it seems to me the discussion has been pretty sober and constructive in this thread so far. People might disagree, but I'm not seeing anyone getting into eachother's face.
And it's an interesting subject, at least it is to me, so no reason to slam on what people like talking about.  

Alright, perhaps I overreacted.  But if I see this thread get worse, i'll be back :D.

[Sumez | 2,964]

Keep keeping watch  

[Brickman | 3,991]

I’ve always been in the same camp as backloggery too.

Beat the game=defeated it to see the credits. Completed = 100% obtained.

If someone told me they beat a game I wouldn’t be thinking they 100% completed/1CC etc.

Maybe we need a poll 

[Sumez | 2,964]

7 minutes ago, Brickman said:

Maybe we need a poll 

So we can see how many people are wrong? 

[Brickman | 3,991]

27 minutes ago, Sumez said:

So we can see how many people are wrong? 

Well it is called Beat the X library on VGS not complete the X library sooooo…I think we know who will be right 

[Sumez | 2,964]

You're telling me now people aren't even beating the games?? 

[DarkTone | 985]

Wasn't there a thread on [NAME REDACTED] where someone said they beat the game on emulator, therefore it counts? 

[Reed Rothchild | 9,545]

5 minutes ago, DarkTone said:

Wasn't there a thread on [NAME REDACTED] where someone said they beat the game on emulator, therefore it counts? 

PatrickM.  Battletoads.  Hall of Fame thread. I tried to find it 

[killerkobra | 268]

Journey to Silius maybe. Pretty tough game