Music Debate #107: David Bowie

[Reed Rothchild | 9,588]

 

[RH | 4,980]

There are people that get David Bowie and those that don't. I can see and appreciate his talent, but I don't get it. Or should I say, I don't get into it.

[Sumez | 2,995]

Wow, I think I'm going to need some time to prepare a long ass post here that no one will ever read.

 

Spoilers: 10/10

[Brickman | 4,017]

10/10 for me. Versatile, was always re inventing himself and it never sounded shit when he did it (unlike some bands that try to change), so many incredible songs in his library, incredible musician and talented song writer and last of all a half decent actor. I'm sure Sumez's upcoming essay will cover everything I've missed haha.

[Sumez | 2,995]

Just to supplement Reed's post (which is a little heavy on one of Bowie's worst albums, haha ), and prepare for my own writeup, here are (a few) of my (many) favourite tracks that don't get (quite) the attention they need. Hopefully it will help prove just what a multifaceted artist he was.

 

He also forgot two of Bowie's absolutely biggest and best hit tracks  :

 

[Gloves | 11,841]

Who's that?

[Reed Rothchild | 9,588]

10 minutes ago, Sumez said:

which is a little heavy on one of Bowie's worst albums

[Sumez | 2,995]

When we lost David Bowie in 2016 I realised that I barely knew him outside of his biggest hits. Something I'm sure I share with a lot of other people. He's an artist that it's impossible to not be tangientally aware of, and I'm sure almost everyone would be able to recognize songs like Space Oddity or Life On Mars. Songs that are easy to like and respect, and like every other big artist, it is easy to assume that we have heard the most important stuff, and everything else is just for the fans.

But I decided to educate myself, way way too late in my life, and listen to every single album he had put out in chronological order, starting out with his somewhat cringey self-titled debut album from 1967, which you could probably argue was retconned out of existance two years later when another, much much better, self-titled album was released, and ending with 2016's Blackstar, released only two days before his death, which really put the context of the lyrics into perspective. The guy knew what was coming up, and had a farewell package prepared for us.

It's interesting to follow his career this way, and watching how his musical style unfolds. Always very derivative, but at the same time stepping up to be a leader in whatever field he chose to follow, inspiring thousands of other artists. Bowie was a massive fan of music of almost any style, and he wore that on his sleeve. He would never shy from recommending bands that he himself loved, record cover versions, and bring attention to them, with some of the bigger examples being Scott Walker and Pink Floyd, right before they broke through with Dark Side of the Moon. He and Eno also helped launch Devo's career.

But let me tell you, getting into Bowie's music is like getting into a whole genre of music. There is just so much to discover, and continuously rediscover, and so much great stuff hidden right beneath the surface, that rarely disappoints.
His most active, and to this day most recognized, period was clearly the 70s, housing his whole Ziggy Stardust thing, the Brian Eno "Berlin Trilogy", and several of my own favourite albums. He started out producing folk/rock music very representative of the time, and you could hear clear inspiration from acts like Bob Dylan and Velvet Underground, only to break out into his more succesful rock'n'roll career, mimicking the likes of Rolling Stones, and placing him right at the head of the glamrock movement.
He would follow that up with a soul album which became very succesful and ended up having him play at Soul Train as one of the first white artists ever. But it is after this turning point he changes his sound again and I feel becomes the David Bowie that would go into history, finally nailing a style more unique to himself.

After 14 albums released in the span of 1967 to 1980 he finally hits a bit of a dull spot in the 80s, starting out with what is otherwise, ironically, his best selling album of all time (Let's Dance), but when he started to experiment with various styles of electronic music in the 90s he enters one of his most interesting periods, ending ultimately in four more final albums released over the span of the two most recent decades (2002-2016), which in my opinion are up there among his absolute best.

In short, David Bowie never let up, and managed to produce quality throughout his entire life. And that's just "his own" releases, on top of this there is all the production work he has done for artists like Lou Reed or Iggy Pop, soundtracks, and his short flirt with being a band member in Tin Machine.
It is impossible to realise just what an incredibly talented and productive musician he has been without really digging into all the stuff that he made. Of course, most of his albums though they carry his name, are produced alongside other talented artists, handpicked by Bowie for the styles he wanted to create, with Mick Ronson being a big part of his early success, and of course Brian Eno and Nile Rodgers later on. Although he was at the center of it all, appreciation of Bowie music is also appreciation of a band with an ever changing lineup of talented musicians, and that does nothing to detract from the quality.

For any single person there will be albums they love and albums they don't like, and they are rarely the same for two people. Sure, I think few people really like Hours or Never Let Me Down that much, but for every miss Bowie made, there are at least ten other surefire hits. There are Bowie albums were almost every single track is something I could probably throw into a "favourite music of all time" box. And the guy made 26 albums!
There has never, and probably never will be, another music artist like David Bowie, but we can always hope.

 

tldr; I made a Spotify playlist of only my favourite Bowie songs, and it has 110 songs on it.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Sumez

[Sumez | 2,995]

Here's my current ranking of Bowie's albums. I first made it in 2016, but over the past years they have changed places a bit. Ziggy has climbed a lot, and Heroes has dropped a bit, and Honky Dory has replaced Scary Monsters at the top spot.

1. Hunky Dory
2. Scary Monsters
3. David Bowie (Space Oddity)
4. Ziggy Stardust
5. Low
6. Lodger
7. Outside
8. The Next Day
9. Station to Station
10. Heroes
11. Blackstar
12. Reality
13. Heathen
14. Earthling
15. Young Americans
16. Diamond Dogs
17. The Buddha of Suburbia
18. Aladdin Sane
19. Black Tie White Noise
20. David Bowie (1967)
21. The Man Who Sold The World
22. Let's Dance
23. Hours
24. Never Let Me Down
25. PinUps
26. Tonight

(old picture, I'm only lacking a couple of albums now )

Edited June 29, 2021 by Sumez

[Abelardo | 154]

7 minutes ago, Sumez said:

Here's my current ranking of Bowie's albums. I first made it in 2016, but over the past years they have changed places a bit. Ziggy has climbed a lot, and Heroes has dropped a bit, and Honky Dory has replaced Scary Monsters at the top spot.

1. Hunky Dory
2. Scary Monsters
3. David Bowie (Space Oddity)
4. Ziggy Stardust
5. Low
6. Lodger
7. Outside
8. The Next Day
9. Station to Station
10. Heroes
11. Blackstar
12. Reality
13. Heathen
14. Earthling
15. Young Americans
16. Diamond Dogs
17. The Buddha of Suburbia
18. Aladdin Sane
19. Black Tie White Noise
20. David Bowie (1967)
21. The Man Who Sold The World
22. Let's Dance
23. Hours
24. Never Let Me Down
25. PinUps
26. Tonight

(old picture, I'm only lacking a couple of albums now )

Dude Hunky Dory is one of my favorite albums of all time, top 3 I'd say along with Siamese Dream from Smashing Pumpkins and Psychocandy from The Jesus and Mary Chain. I never really took a deep dive into Bowie but some albums once they clicked they were pure bliss, especially Hunky Dory. It seems that Bowie never took a false step thought his career, whatever he was up to he was at least (very) competent, I rated him 10/10 out of the joy of thoughly enjoying Hunky Dory and Ziggy Stardust, everything else is just icing the cake.

[AstralSoul | 503]

Fantastic music, he's a legend. Not my absolute personal favorite so I can't give him a 10 but he is undeniably fantastic. RIP. 9/10.

Edited June 29, 2021 by AstralSoul

[Link | 2,734]

Great musician. Much respect. He changed the face of rock and pop and was a punk progenitor, and opened a door for freaks like me. But his music doesn’t do anything for me. All of my friends who love Bowie are also into indie rock, which doesn’t catch my interest either. So I think there is a reflection. 

Just like Led Zeppelin, the radio hits are overplayed and therefore annoy me, although I couldn’t say that they wouldn’t otherwise, or that a tour of deep cuts would interest me. I did give a cursory listen to a few of those from @Sumez (thank you) but it just isn’t my thing. 

Based on the rating descriptions, I give Bowie a 5 (or 4, but I went 5) which feels less than deserved. But going by the higher ratings, that is true to my personal taste purely on sound, rather than historical impact.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Link

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

5 hours ago, RH said:

There are people that get David Bowie and those that don't. I can see and appreciate his talent, but I don't get it. Or should I say, I don't get into it.

I guess that's me too. He's okay, but his music just doesn't strike me as much more than average. 5/10.

[Hammerfestus | 3,889]

I’ve always wanted to like Bowie more than I actually do.  6

[RH | 4,980]

1 hour ago, Hammerfestus said:

I’ve always wanted to like Bowie more than I actually do.  6

This is also true for me. I actually like the guy as an artist. He seemed really cool and, of course, Labyrinth!

[mbd39 | 2,030]

9

Low in particular blew my mind. He didn't invent anything but he was great at keeping up with trends.

 

 

[mbd39 | 2,030]

3 hours ago, Bearcat-Doug said:

I guess that's me too. He's okay, but his music just doesn't strike me as much more than average. 5/10.

 

Metallica are big fans. They also have a song called Leper Messiah that came from a Bowie lyric.

 

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,105]

16 minutes ago, mbd39 said:

 

Metallica are big fans. They also have a song called Leper Messiah that came from a Bowie lyric.

 

Interesting. I'm in the same boat as those other comments in that I always wanted to like his music more than I do, I just never could get into it.

Edited June 29, 2021 by Bearcat-Doug

[ZeldaFan042 | 1,181]

 

[nrslam | 477]

I gave him an 8.  Prolific, influential and versatile, his best work rivals some of the best of all time, but a lot of his stuff isn't my cup of tea at all.

[mbd39 | 2,030]

8 hours ago, Sumez said:

 

For any single person there will be albums they love and albums they don't like, and they are rarely the same for two people. Sure, I think few people really like Hours or Never Let Me Down that much, but for every miss Bowie made, there are at least ten other surefire hits. There are Bowie albums were almost every single track is something I could probably throw into a "favourite music of all time" box. And the guy made 26 albums!
There has never, and probably never will be, another music artist like David Bowie, but we can always hope.

 

 

 

Nice write-up and summary of Bowie.

Even Hours has its fans. I don't know if you're familiar with web critic Mark Prindle but it's his favorite Bowie album and rates it higher than Ziggy and Low and Heroes. http://www.markprindle.com/bowie.htm#hours

 

[Sumez | 2,995]

I'm not familiar with Mark Prindle, but now I know not to trust his opinion on anything, haha  

[JamesRobot | 5,837]

9.  Dude's amazing.  Got into him with the 1. Outside album in the 90s and it's still my favorite.  Was actually looking to listen to it about a month ago it has disappeared from my collection.  Ziggy is phenomenal of course.  I have a handful of albums but could stand to have more.  

[Sumez | 2,995]

Lots of "I respect him, and would like to appreciate his music, but it's not for me" in this thread.

For those people, I really do recommend digging beneath the surface, get into full albums instead of just the hit songs. It might take a while, but if you do enjoy music in general, there's a good chance it will click at some point.
Personally I don't really like classic rock music at all, so it would be easy to assume I shouldn't really like most of his output. But getting to know it better, it just goes well beyond "rock music". At first I didn't really like the Ziggy Stardust album, and I'm honestly still not very fond of Aladdin Sane at all.

Some unique albums I'd recommend checking out to hear some of the less "common" bowie output:
1. Outside
Low
Blackstar
Earthling
Black Tie White Noise
The Next Day
Heathen

And here are some tracks that really stretch the genres for him:

 

 

Edited July 1, 2021 by Sumez

[TDIRunner | 2,777]

I give his music a 7 and his performance as Nikola Tesla a 9.