phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) This just in.. Rudy Giuliani has the evidence There’s still a month until the “real election” by the electoral college. What could happen between now and then? Who knows... all we can do is wait and see. Whenever a judgement is made, we should accept it and move on Edited November 9, 2020 by phart010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulpa | 3,492 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Was the evidence on Hunter's laptop? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 36 minutes ago, Tulpa said: Was the evidence on Hunter's laptop? Let him present his evidence. It will either stick or it won’t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulpa | 3,492 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, phart010 said: Let him present his evidence. It will either stick or it won’t No one is saying he shouldn't, but let's see, this is like the eightieth time they've presented some "smoking gun" over the last four years and each one has been a resounding dud. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, phart010 said: Let him present his evidence. It will either stick or it won’t You were being serious? Edited November 9, 2020 by arch_8ngel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 9 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: You were being serious? I’m straddling in the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, phart010 said: I’m straddling in the middle The world is too strange right now to take positions satirically 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Well, shock of shocks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 22 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: The world is too strange right now to take positions satirically Are you saying I have to take a side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strange | 1,700 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 McConnell met with Barr and is now on board with the “fraud” garbage. The start of the coup. We can’t let Trump and his complicit pals steal this election from the American people. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 1 minute ago, The Strangest said: McConnell met with Barr and is now on board with the “fraud” garbage. The start of the coup. We can’t let Trump and his complicit pals steal this election from the American people. If we can’t trust the courts, then the system has already been stolen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strange | 1,700 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, phart010 said: If we can’t trust the courts, then the system has already been stolen I don’t trust the Supreme Court as it is now. A partisan court packed by one political party. Let them provide the evidence. We’re waiting. Trump’s legal team and the Republican poll watchers in those states said there is no evidence of fraud. This is an attempt to take the election anyway. Refusing to acknowledge the winner is dangerous. I know Trump has sung praises of the leaders of Russia, North Korea, and China, and their ability to hold power, but we are not those countries. December 14th is a month away. The fact that we have the possibility of faithless electors who can ignore the will of the people is proof of how un-democratic our system really is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 15 minutes ago, The Strangest said: I don’t trust the Supreme Court as it is now. A partisan court packed by one political party. Let them provide the evidence. We’re waiting. Trump’s legal team and the Republican poll watchers in those states said there is no evidence of fraud. This is an attempt to take the election anyway. Refusing to acknowledge the winner is dangerous. I know Trump has sung praises of the leaders of Russia, North Korea, and China, and their ability to hold power, but we are not those countries. December 14th is a month away. The fact that we have the possibility of faithless electors who can ignore the will of the people is proof of how un-democratic our system really is. I can see how different justices can have different biases based on their own personal values when it comes to interpreting broadly defined rights and relating them back to modern social issues. I can’t imagine a justice having any room to apply their biases on determining legitimacy or illegitimacy of evidence and concluding existence or non-existence of fraud based on facts. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWunderful | 2,927 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 What federal or constitutional questions would arise to get the SC involved? They dont just preside over things chosen by the president. The SC only got involved in 2000 bush v gore because of “equal protection” and the fact that the entire presidency came down to one state that hinged on constitutional interpretation. That why real laywers are laughing at all this. Dont fall for the fake news! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 1 minute ago, MrWunderful said: What federal or constitutional questions would arise to get the SC involved? They dont just preside over things chosen by the president. The SC only got involved in 2000 bush v gore because of “equal protection” and the fact that the entire presidency came down to one state that hinged on constitutional interpretation. That why real laywers are laughing at all this. Dont fall for the fake news! State Supreme Courts. Each state has specific laws regarding the voting process. It seems the RNC is challenging whether the processes defined in these laws were followed. They are arguing that if the processes were not followed for a portion of the ballots, it could put their integrity at question, and potentially disqualify them. I think any and all of these cases that gain traction, are inevitably going to get appealed by whichever side loses until they reach the highest level of court for final decision. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 54 minutes ago, phart010 said: Are you saying I have to take a side? It would amaze me if someone was actually "neutral" on Trump and not effectively offering tacit support by their lack of rejection for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 9, 2020 Author Share Posted November 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: It would amaze me if someone was actually "neutral" on Trump and not effectively offering tacit support by their lack of rejection for him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 10, 2020 Author Share Posted November 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: It would amaze me if someone was actually "neutral" on Trump and not effectively offering tacit support by their lack of rejection for him. I actually voted libertarian, not because I feel strongly about the party, but because I didn’t feel particularly enthusiastic about Trump or Biden. I guess the beauty about being a minority is that everyone on both sides hates you 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kguillemette | 1,544 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, MrWunderful said: What federal or constitutional questions would arise to get the SC involved? They dont just preside over things chosen by the president. The SC only got involved in 2000 bush v gore because of “equal protection” and the fact that the entire presidency came down to one state that hinged on constitutional interpretation. That why real laywers are laughing at all this. Dont fall for the fake news! Agreed. This is not 2000 again. On a side note, I truly hope that after this very fervent election season, we can truly come together as a country. I respect that Biden goal according to his victory speech was compromise above all else. For too long, neither party has been able to accept political defeat and thus turn the other cheek while still living each other as Americans. Collectively, our lives from Covid have been flipped so far upside down that it really hurts to not see us be able to come together like we did after 9/11. That moment as a society was very special, and it is a moment I long for and feel we need again moving forward. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch_8ngel | 1,597 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 14 minutes ago, phart010 said: I actually voted libertarian, not because I feel strongly about the party, but because I didn’t feel particularly enthusiastic about Trump or Biden. I guess the beauty about being a minority is that everyone on both sides hates you It is fine not to be enthusiastic about either AND to have voted Libertarian. I didn't say the choice was binary. I just said that not being opposed to Trump is effectively providing tacit support for him. You didn't vote for him, and actively voted for someone else. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 10, 2020 Author Share Posted November 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said: It is fine not to be enthusiastic about either AND to have voted Libertarian. I didn't say the choice was binary. I just said that not being opposed to Trump is effectively providing tacit support for him. You didn't vote for him, and actively voted for someone else. The Trump supporters I know would argue that I tacitly supported Biden 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWunderful | 2,927 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 46 minutes ago, phart010 said: State Supreme Courts. Each state has specific laws regarding the voting process. It seems the RNC is challenging whether the processes defined in these laws were followed. They are arguing that if the processes were not followed for a portion of the ballots, it could put their integrity at question, and potentially disqualify them. I think any and all of these cases that gain traction, are inevitably going to get appealed by whichever side loses until they reach the highest level of court for final decision. How does that affect 200,000(?) votes across 4 states? And if they had anything legit, they would have lead with it. I believe the Trump lawyers (lol) are 0-5 for lawsuits? Great start. The best bet they have is the segregated votes in PA, that arent included in the count anyways. So it wont make a difference. I get you are playing devils advocate, but pretty sure if they had anything close, real lawyers would be on it. There is a reason why Ben Ginsberg, Kavanaugh, Sotomayor (maybe, I forget) all litigated the 2000 case. It was a real high profile case. Ben Ginsberg said on CNN, that these have no chance. Im going with what the top republican lawyer for the last 40 years says vs the pathetic clown show Rudy Guliani. Probably just part of the deep state though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulpa | 3,492 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 (edited) 59 minutes ago, phart010 said: I think any and all of these cases that gain traction, are inevitably going to get appealed by whichever side loses until they reach the highest level of court for final decision. You do realize the Trump administration's MO if things don't go their way is to attack, attack, attack, even if you're wrong, so you don't look weak to the masses, right? This is just the latest theatre. When their lawsuits fail (and they will), they'll just argue the courts were against them, too, and rile up their base even more. That's all this is. Seriously, go look on any of the pro-Trump forums. They're fully convinced he has an ace up his sleeve and that the "true" votecount will be disclosed any day now. Edited November 10, 2020 by Tulpa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,707 Posted November 10, 2020 Author Share Posted November 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Tulpa said: You do realize the Trump administration's MO if things don't go their way is to attack, attack, attack, even if you're wrong, so you don't look weak to the masses, right? This is just the latest theatre. When their lawsuits fail (and they will), they'll just argue the courts were against them, too, and rile up their base even more. That's all this is. It’s there’s no substance, they lose the court battles (or don’t get their cases heard), and continue fighting after that, they would basically be admitting that the US government is not legitimate. The argument Trump supporters are making right now is that “the government decides the election, not the media networks”. If the government decides, then the government decides. There’s nothing else after that. If we want to have a civilized outcome from this election, I don’t see it happening unless both sides can agree to trust in the court system that we have and allow fair scrutiny followed by a decision. If Biden legitimately won, just give the people who doubt it some time to process it so they can see and accept the loss. If we just call it the way it is now Republicans are going to feel betrayed, rightly or wrongly. They will not make peace if you skip this step. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrWunderful | 2,927 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, phart010 said: It’s there’s no substance, they lose the court battles (or don’t get their cases heard), and continue fighting after that, they would basically be admitting that the US government is not legitimate. The argument Trump supporters are making right now is that “the government decides the election, not the media networks”. If the government decides, then the government decides. There’s nothing else after that. If we want to have a civilized outcome from this election, I don’t see it happening unless both sides can agree to trust in the court system that we have and allow fair scrutiny followed by a decision. If Biden legitimately won, just give the people who doubt it some time to process it so they can see and accept the loss. If we just call it the way it is now Republicans are going to feel betrayed, rightly or wrongly. They will not make peace if you skip this step. Who is arguing against that? Pretty sure all the Democrats want every last legal vote counted as well. They just didn’t spend the last six months telling everybody it would be a rigged election. Am I missing democrats out in public saying “stop the count, lets go with what Cnn says!” Politics will never be civilized again because of Trump and his sycophants, he is who made it ok to be a terrible person, like insulting veterans, disabled people, old people, or overweight people. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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