the_wizard_666 | 1,329 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said: First, your info to him is erroneous as the stone does not teleport you back to the Castle; it casts Malor which sends you somewhere else in the dungeon based on cooridinates, after which it takes on an entirely different name and properties and casts a different spell, of which you make no mention. And second, I don't see anything regarding the teleport method to get your whole party through, meaning your info is essentially useless as the amount of levelling required to kill the Demon Lord solo would disqualify just about anyone from choosing that method when a much easier one exists. So, in a nutshell your factually correct contribution is thus: "when you finish the game, collect all the KOD armaments a second time, then go through the warp that took you to the Staff of Gnilda with a solo character. This take you to a completely new section of Level 6, at the end of which is the Demon Lord." Congrats, man! You successfully confirmed that the Demon Lord actually exists! I only wish I had already stated in an above post that that was the extent of your actual contribution to the topic, but alas... Couple that with me having told you about accidentally landing on the path after triggering a teleport trap (which you alluded to in your previous post about my "accidentally bumble-fucking" my way to him), but okay. I have notes from my childhood that detail the stone, that btw only drops from the Demon Lord fight (meaning I had found it as a kid), though clearly I had forgotten about that fight entirely. Why would that happen? Well, I would posit that's because the game in no way makes it known that the fight is significant in any way. There is no way my 15 year old self would have known it was a secret boss fight, so I didn't earmark it as significant. When I got the guide in '09, the blurb about the Demon Lord showed it was actually a post-game bonus. Since at the time I didn't want to start from scratch, I played through on the Famicom version (which had some Japanese dude's save file with massively over-levelled characters) and found him with ease. And given how often I would tell you about it in the eleven years between that and you writing your guide (I still have every email btw), not to mention having done it multiple times myself in that span, and yes, mentioning the teleporting possibility (because Malor cannot be used to traverse Level 6 at all, so it wouldn't normally be an option). But lets get to the root of this - I was, and am, in no way trying to take credit for any of your actual work. You did it, multiple times, and documented it beyond anything a normal person would do in the interest of helping others. That's fucking awesome. But I planted more than a few seeds over the years, and we both know it. Oh, and speaking of the emails, I have to thank you for getting me to actually check them. The walkthrough that I had worked on for over a decade that was lost when my hard drive crashed...turns out I had sent you a copy back in 2011. So while I lost probably around 40% of the extra stuff (monsters, etc), I recovered 90% of the walkthrough itself. Oh, and here's an interesting bit from the "Boss Enemies" section of that guide: Spoiler The Demon Lord (Level 6) - The game never expressly tells you to hunt for the root of the evil in the dungeon, and not many adventurers have discovered this elusive beast, but I can say that he does exist in a hidden portion of Level 6. Only accessable by random teleport trap (if you're lucky), or more likely once you've obtained a high enough level to face him solo, because to get to his lair one must proceed through KOD's Temple, which in turn only allows you to enter alone and with the full set of KOD's gear. I can't say much about his abilities or stats, because I have only faced him once and the available data is sketchy at best, but I can say that he absorbed three shots from Hrathnir without going down. To top it off, he is usually accompanied by a Lycurgus as well as several Greater Demons and Ferocious Fiends, making this one of the toughest encounters in the game by far. HP: ? AP: ? AC: ? XP Value: ? Abilities: ? Disguise: Demonic Figure Reward: Demon's Stone So yeah, keep telling yourself I didn't ever mention anything at some point. Just because you completely forgot shit doesn't mean the shit didn't happen. Oh, and as an aside, you are correct, the stone casts Malor. That was my bad, as I used it to teleport to the castle. But yes, the stone is a one-time use of the Malor spell (stone has a 100% chance of breaking after use). Edited January 6 by the_wizard_666 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Morbis | 2,096 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 2 minutes ago, the_wizard_666 said: Couple that with me having told you about accidentally landing on the path after triggering a teleport trap (which you alluded to in your previous post about my "accidentally bumble-fucking" my way to him), but okay. I have notes from my childhood that detail the stone, that btw only drops from the Demon Lord fight (meaning I had found it as a kid), though clearly I had forgotten about that fight entirely. Why would that happen? Well, I would posit that's because the game in no way makes it known that the fight is significant in any way. There is no way my 15 year old self would have known it was a secret boss fight, so I didn't earmark it as significant. When I got the guide in '09, the blurb about the Demon Lord showed it was actually a post-game bonus. Since at the time I didn't want to start from scratch, I played through on the Famicom version (which had some Japanese dude's save file with massively over-levelled characters) and found him with ease. And given how often I would tell you about it in the eleven years between that and you writing your guide (I still have every email btw), not to mention having done it multiple times myself in that span, and yes, mentioning the teleporting possibility (because Malor cannot be used to traverse Level 6 at all, so it wouldn't normally be an option). But lets get to the root of this - I was, and am, in no way trying to take credit for any of your actual work. You did it, multiple times, and documented it beyond anything a normal person would do in the interest of helping others. That's fucking awesome. But I planted more than a few seeds over the years, and we both know it. Oh, and speaking of the emails, I have to thank you for getting me to actually check them. The walkthrough that I had worked on for over a decade that was lost when my hard drive crashed...turns out I had sent you a copy back in 2011. So while I lost probably around 40% of the extra stuff (monsters, etc), I recovered 90% of the walkthrough itself. Oh, and here's an interesting bit from the "Boss Enemies" section of that guide: Hide contents The Demon Lord (Level 6) - The game never expressly tells you to hunt for the root of the evil in the dungeon, and not many adventurers have discovered this elusive beast, but I can say that he does exist in a hidden portion of Level 6. Only accessable by random teleport trap (if you're lucky), or more likely once you've obtained a high enough level to face him solo, because to get to his lair one must proceed through KOD's Temple, which in turn only allows you to enter alone and with the full set of KOD's gear. I can't say much about his abilities or stats, because I have only faced him once and the available data is sketchy at best, but I can say that he absorbed three shots from Hrathnir without going down. To top it off, he is usually accompanied by a Lycurgus as well as several Greater Demons and Ferocious Fiends, making this one of the toughest encounters in the game by far. HP: ? AP: ? AC: ? XP Value: ? Abilities: ? Disguise: Demonic Figure Reward: Demon's Stone So yeah, keep telling yourself I didn't ever mention anything at some point. Just because you completely forgot shit doesn't mean the shit didn't happen. I don't know how you go from you "mentioning" stuff to me over the years (and long before I had ever played the game to know or care what you were even talking about) to you being responsible for the explicit minute details of every single aspect of the the Demon Lord that are so explicitly detailed in my guide. How do you make that leap? You told me you'd fought him and you told me how you triggered a teleport trap to get to him with your whole party; that's literally it! It's not like I'm trying to avoid giving credit where it's due; in my Romance II Free Generals Guide I take an entire paragraph to thank DraganAtma for all the information he provided, and I explicitly state that my guide would not even have been possible without all of his hard work... and that's the very first paragraph at the top of the guide! I definitely give credit where it's due, and if I felt that you had provided even a modicum of that level of detail to me for my Demon Lord guide, I would have 100% given you credit for that, but you didn't. You confirmed he existed and explained how one could get a whole party to him via a teleport trap, and that's it! Then, after I spent hours writing a guide that spared not one single detail about every conceivable aspect on the topic, you type out, "you're welcome for the info," as if you were somehow the wellspring from which all of my information had come. You're a fan of the game who speaks and writes passionately about it, and that's it. If you actaully want to make a real contribution to the world in the realm of Wizardry KOD, then finish and publish your KOD guide rather than just taking credit for someone else's hours of work. And if you ever do, feel free to reference my guide when you're detailing the Demon Lord; the more information we have on the internet for NES games, the better... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_wizard_666 | 1,329 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 3 minutes ago, Dr. Morbis said: I don't know how you go from you "mentioning" stuff to me over the years (and long before I had ever played the game to know or care what you were even talking about) to you being responsible for the explicit minute details of every single aspect of the the Demon Lord that are so explicitly detailed in my guide. How do you make that leap? You told me you'd fought him and you told me how you triggered a teleport trap to get to him with your whole party; that's literally it! It's not like I'm trying to avoid giving credit where it's due; in my Romance II Free Generals Guide I take an entire paragraph to thank DraganAtma for all the information he provided, and I explicitly state that my guide would not even have been possible without all of his hard work... and that's the very first paragraph at the top of the guide! I definitely give credit where it's due, and if I felt that you had provided even a modicum of that level of detail to me for my Demon Lord guide, I would have 100% given you credit for that, but you didn't. You confirmed he existed and explained how one could get a whole party to him via a teleport trap, and that's it! Then, after I spent hours writing a guide that spared not one single detail about every conceivable aspect on the topic, you type out, "you're welcome for the info," as if you were somehow the wellspring from which all of my information had come. You're a fan of the game who speaks and writes passionately about it, and that's it. If you actaully want to make a real contribution to the world in the realm of Wizardry KOD, then finish and publish your KOD guide rather than just taking credit for someone else's hours of work. And if you ever do, feel free to reference my guide when you're detailing the Demon Lord; the more information we have on the internet for NES games, the better... I HAVE NEVER TAKEN CREDIT FOR THE WORK YOU DID. Dude, I've known you for what, 20 years now? Yeah, I told you a bunch of shit about one of my all-time favourite games many, many times in that span. Again, the fact that you probably forgot 99% of it doesn't make it any less of a fact that I did, indeed, tell you about it. You didn't use it when you played, fair enough. I'm not asking for any of that. I'm saying that I have freely volunteered info to anyone who ever had a goddamn question about it. I've provided examples of communications. Hell, I had over 500 hits on the word "Wizardry" from our back emails. That does not include PMs on NA or other forums that no longer exist, nor does it include anything we discussed on the phone. BUT it shows a pattern. I have attempted two speedruns of the game IN YOUR PRESENCE. Granted, I failed, but you had to have learned a few things about the game from that. "You're welcome for the info" is simply me stating that I had provided info that helped you get to the point of writing the guide. It in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY is me taking credit for you actually DOING THE WORK. I could give a crap about you giving me credit for the myriad of tips and pointers I had casually dropped over two decades. Not everything is a goddamn fucking personal slight toward you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Morbis | 2,096 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 2 minutes ago, the_wizard_666 said: I HAVE NEVER TAKEN CREDIT FOR THE WORK YOU DID. Dude, I've known you for what, 20 years now? Yeah, I told you a bunch of shit about one of my all-time favourite games many, many times in that span. Again, the fact that you probably forgot 99% of it doesn't make it any less of a fact that I did, indeed, tell you about it. You didn't use it when you played, fair enough. I'm not asking for any of that. I'm saying that I have freely volunteered info to anyone who ever had a goddamn question about it. I've provided examples of communications. Hell, I had over 500 hits on the word "Wizardry" from our back emails. That does not include PMs on NA or other forums that no longer exist, nor does it include anything we discussed on the phone. BUT it shows a pattern. I have attempted two speedruns of the game IN YOUR PRESENCE. Granted, I failed, but you had to have learned a few things about the game from that. "You're welcome for the info" is simply me stating that I had provided info that helped you get to the point of writing the guide. It in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY is me taking credit for you actually DOING THE WORK. I could give a crap about you giving me credit for the myriad of tips and pointers I had casually dropped over two decades. Not everything is a goddamn fucking personal slight toward you. No, if someone mentions he wrote a guide about some subject, and then another person quotes him with the response, "you're welcome for the info," that is a pretty clear comment about who he feels is actually responsible for the information presented in that person's guide. And if you felt otherwise, you wouldn't have posted these numerous walls of text relating all of the countless ways in which I had used you as some sort of indespensable Wizardry crutch when the guide was being written. Anyway, best of luck with the completion of your KOD guide. After twenty-odd years in the making, I'm sure it'll be one hell of a piece of work... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulpa | 3,569 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PII | 1,916 Posted January 6 Share Posted January 6 Galaxy 5000 is done. Had a pretty great run without setting any records for eliminations or blowing shit up I'm sure. Although I had to buy a second Stiletto after I hit one of those ship destroying blackholes on the last lap of Pluto 4 (whoops!) Still, I'd say this was the smoothest that Pluto has ever gone for me, which is saying something. Pluto 3 is usually trouble... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 929 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Um... back to the topic, finished Power Blade 2. Another good run. Its not a tough game except for a few stupid parts, especially if you don't have the right power up. One of the weakest and easiest final bosses of all time. Also this is one of those games where using the password is more harmful because it doesn't save any of your extra batteries or health recharges. So in fact its harder to use passwords, than playing it thru. You can go into the final level with like 6 extra lives, 7 batteries and 6 health refills. With a password you start with the basic 3 lives and 0 powerups. Stupid. GI Joe Atlantis factor has the same issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdynebraskan | 356 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Godzilla is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Doyce | 477 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 I've never played Lemmings on the NES, so I'm going to give it a spin. Giving a heads up since it's going to be a slog based on the pain points 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Morbis | 2,096 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 9 minutes ago, Daniel_Doyce said: I've never played Lemmings on the NES, so I'm going to give it a spin. Giving a heads up since it's going to be a slog based on the pain points It's kind of like Battleship in the sense that it's not really difficult so much as it is a chore and a time sink to have to play through so many individual levels... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel_Doyce | 477 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Just now, Dr. Morbis said: It's kind of like Battleship in the sense that it's not really difficult so much as it is a chore and a time sink to have to play through so many individual levels... The winning conditions guide says to start at the highest level, but I think that's not going to go well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Morbis | 2,096 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 1 minute ago, Daniel_Doyce said: The winning conditions guide says to start at the highest level, but I think that's not going to go well. You're really lucky then, because that will save you hours and you've only got to do 25% of the game. But yeah, without ramping up your experience and skills mentally, starting on Mayhem might be a bit of a slap in the face... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WashYourFace | 80 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) 1 hour ago, Daniel_Doyce said: I've never played Lemmings on the NES, so I'm going to give it a spin. Giving a heads up since it's going to be a slog based on the pain points There are a few levels where you have to be pixel-perfect. When I beat it (see my signature), I swear there were some times when I didn't do anything different but for whatever reason the game gave a slightly different result. So there is a lot of luck involved as well. Unfortunately the NES version isn't very good. Good enough for a casual play, I guess, but glitchy and not play-tested. Lemmings 2 on SNES is a lot better, I think. Edited January 7 by WashYourFace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaia Gensouki | 1,079 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Mission: Impossible is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_wizard_666 | 1,329 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 27 minutes ago, Gaia Gensouki said: Mission: Impossible is done. Quit beating all the games I want to play! This makes like 20 now Seriously though, any pointers for me? I've given it so many attempts over the years and yet I've never made it past the first level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdynebraskan | 356 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Super Dodge Ball is done. I think it's my first time doing it for this thread, and the first time playing it in about 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdynebraskan | 356 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Pipe Dream is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 929 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Finished Festers Quest. Not too bad if you know the key glitch. I also still think turbo fire should be allowed for this game because its recommended in the manual :P. Also you can do the key glitch on the final boss, but you have to be SUPER precise. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerdynebraskan | 356 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Wacky Races is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaia Gensouki | 1,079 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 7 hours ago, the_wizard_666 said: Quit beating all the games I want to play! This makes like 20 now Seriously though, any pointers for me? I've given it so many attempts over the years and yet I've never made it past the first level. I'm really sorry about that. I though that if I played these less popular or crappy games that I wouldn't take away the games that others wanted to play. Do you maybe have a list of games that you want to play? I just took a look at your 2024 backlog and I'm sorry about that. Maybe we could introduce something like a "claim sheet" in the future like they did in the N64 challenge? Which part of the first level gives you trouble? The beginning where you're on the streets or afterwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_wizard_666 | 1,329 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Gaia Gensouki said: I'm really sorry about that. I though that if I played these less popular or crappy games that I wouldn't take away the games that others wanted to play. Do you maybe have a list of games that you want to play? I just took a look at your 2024 backlog and I'm sorry about that. Maybe we could introduce something like a "claim sheet" in the future like they did in the N64 challenge? Which part of the first level gives you trouble? The beginning where you're on the streets or afterwards? Oh no, it's all good. I just happen to really like shitty games myself I just look forward to beating games I haven't knocked off yet, and many of the ones I haven't done are games you've been picking off early. Go ahead and play whatever you feel like Honestly, I was just kidding around with you...yeah, there were a bunch of games I've wanted to play, but if I really want to play them I'll just knock them off anyway, challenge or not. There's no reason to feel sorry As for the trouble, it's in the back half for sure. In the sewers. I just can't seem to pull a good run together. Don't think there's anything I can do different, just gotta learn to execute better I think, but maybe there's a strategy I haven't thought of yet. Anyway, I just knocked off The Three Stooges. Got me the best ending too, after a couple attempts. You need to average around $500/day to get the $15K needed for it. As such, it's best to avoid the Waiter and Doctor stages entirely. The free money isn't worth it unless the other options are bad, as although you can get a cool $1000 from it, you can also get as low as $100, and it's frequently on the low end of the average needed. The best option IMO is the Cracker Eating Contest, as once you get to the end, there's a bowl with one cracker. If you can beat the oyster to it, you get $60 for each one. It's really easy to get $500 on it, and I've managed as high as around $2500, and could probably have gone further if I didn't overshoot the damn cracker Trivia is good for $600 (there's a really good FAQ detailing all the answers, though after a few runs you'll have seen almost all of them numerous times anyway), and the boxing minigame is pretty simple - line up in the middle, jump anything in your way, and don't worry about hitting the ladders. You should be able to get back with time to spare - no weaving required. The safe seemed to be worth $500 every time I hit it as well, so it's also an okay option if the board is crap otherwise. All in all, it's a surprisingly decent game for what it is. I remember renting it once as a kid and enjoying it, and I enjoyed the hour and a half I just spent playing it (I managed to beat it my first time trying, but with the bad ending...took a couple rounds to figure the best tactics out). I don't think it's great by any means, but it's worth a run nonetheless. Edited January 7 by the_wizard_666 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_wizard_666 | 1,329 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 Fisher Price: Perfect Fit is done. I can't even see toddlers enjoying this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaia Gensouki | 1,079 Posted January 7 Share Posted January 7 (edited) 3 hours ago, the_wizard_666 said: As for the trouble, it's in the back half for sure. In the sewers. I just can't seem to pull a good run together. Don't think there's anything I can do different, just gotta learn to execute better I think, but maybe there's a strategy I haven't thought of yet. I think a big part is figuring out where to go and which switches to activate and in which order. For example you have to deactivate the electric floor before you can turn off the switch protected by it. You also don't have to clear every single path and enemy. You can make many parts easier by properly using the different characters and their abilities. The guy with the gun can pick off enemies from a safe distance or place bombs to dispose of them. For example, when you get caught and these four dudes come running at you, you can just lure them into your bombs to kill them without taking a single hit. Then there's also these enemies with shields that push you into the water or a pit. These can also easily be killed with a bomb. Then there's the black guy who can run and attack really fast. With him you can sneak around corners and hit enemies before they even have a chance to fight back. He can also throw some kind of explosive that stuns enemies, which is very practical for when some enemies are blocking your path, like the big and bulky guys throwing molotov cocktails. Another way to get rid of them is the nerdy guy with glasses. He can dress up as an enemy, which will stop them from attacking you for a few seconds. This way the molotov guys will stop attacking you, so you can can get rid of them. Another good use of him is to throw his boomerangs around a corner to hit enemies in hiding. With these methods you can avoid getting hit, if you're careful. Moreover, every character has an individual HP bar, so you can switch someone out, if they're in danger, and switch them back in, when you find a health kit. In later levels it's important to find out where the health kits are hidden and to ration them well. And finally, if you want to get through this level, you have to find the switches that turn off the flood and the robot. These two obstacles will insta-kill you. I've made a short video of me going through the sewers. Not sure if it's any help. Some of it was a little bit sloppy since I've played this so often that I don't care about getting hit at certain points. During the later levels I'm obviously more careful. (the video is unlisted and my account is not monetized. So I'm only doing this for sharing, not for personal gain) Spoiler Edited January 7 by Gaia Gensouki 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scaryice | 603 Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 Tiger-Heli looped after 15 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scaryice | 603 Posted January 7 Author Share Posted January 7 Soccer done, Brazil 5:0 over the easiest cpu opponent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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