ExplodedHamster

This is a holy grail for me. I have been looking for a sealed one for a decade or so. Seal has some tears, but box is great and I’ll take what I can, trust me.

Who’d have thought a mere 1.5 million dollar sale would have brought out some of the highest graded items!? This reminds me of when people said there were thousands of matte Mario CIBs because a handful came out after the 25k or whatever sale (which was crazy insane at the time). Then they basically disappeared. Without a massive warehouse find, which is I suppose possible, it’ll be nowhere near 60-70 in 9.8/95. VGA got a handful in 15ish years, and I think 4 of the 5 were from the same single casepack they got in that time? It’s very tough to get 9.8 or 95 N64 that are not from casepacks. Possible, but real hard. And most casepack games have that notorious N64 side corner indent anyway, which would prevent a 9.8 from WATA. But where video games and collectibles in general are in 5 years is anyone’s guess. The past two years have been beyond insane across collectibles. There’s no way it can just keep going.

No, what I’m saying is WATA is more harsh on N64 than VGA is (because VGA is lenient in box damage and weighs seal heavily), though I agree it’s generally the other way around. I think VGA in general was too harsh for a long time and scared people away because of it.

My guess is the buyer is probably doing ok for himself or herself one way or another, so none of us should lose sleep lol. I figured mine would hit 500k or so, so I’d still be quite happy as a seller at the 780k. The big question on these are how will they shake out long term? I think there are three 9.8/A++ now, let’s say within 5 years you get up to 6-7. What’s that worth? Who knows.

Under their old system, there were rare cases where grades changed after being initially put into the system. I forget why. It’s why they changed their entire system so grades don’t show until the game has shipped. It forces them to put in the final grade. I’m guessing this was one that was changed before shipping under the older system.

Good luck @Jared_Goldinauctions! Some really nice results already and we all know the insanity that is extended bidding on Goldin. Definitely should be fun to watch!

I have crossed dozens of N64 games, and I can assure you that crossover article does not translate. VGA is quite lenient on box damage for N64 and weighs heavily the seal. I have had a number of 85+ hit from 8.0 to 9.0 with A++ seals. You likely are not getting a WATA 9.8 below a 90+, and quite often 90+ and above (including 95s) do not translate to a 9.8.

Well, I certainly think part of this is fair, particularly in terms of the optics. I don’t think there was really any particular need to showcase certain people the way they did or to use titles that left any room for the imagination. In terms of making money, they are first and foremost a business. With collectibles going bananas and video games riding the wave, business models were going to shift more towards catering to where the money is. It’s funny, you’ve seen new grading companies in cards start up now advertising to the “affordable for true collectors” crowd, and then once they get more business they jack prices too lol.

My stance on these issues has been consistent for years, prior to any money I made on these games. As has been stated, none of this is new info and it has been discussed ad nauseam here and on NA. I think you have a harder time defending people who get up in arms about the most basic business transactions (like HA and WATA partnering), which makes it clear for many people it’s really been about the lame and played out “true collectors” and “games are for playing” garbage that has infested the community for long before WATA became a thing. The problem is it’s basically impossible to get past the noise and focus on the real issues, because people say something like “oh he’s made money, he’s a WATA shill” and I have to waste energy on that. Tbh it’s reaching the point where it’s probably a waste of time, it’s like arguing politics lol. I also have no problem whatsoever saying I believe in video games as collectible assets, and it was something destined to occur at some point with the younger generation shifting gears on investments. I believe in capitalism (isn’t the so-called American Dream based on it?), and I’m not going to shy away from any of that. I am also an avid gamer and collector, and have been for far longer than I started buying graded WATA or VGA games. There is, and always has been, room for both.

See, I disagree. 99.99% of the people pissed off never read that NYT article. So, to me, it’s more about the issue itself and not what Deniz did or didn’t say. Personally, I would not consider an advisor or investor an employee, for reasons stated above (namely, ability to influence at ground level on a daily basis). If I was a member of the general public, I would probably think Mark was an employee, however. Put another way, the large majority of stuff I see from Joe Public is “Mark Haspel was grading his own games.” I think that sentiment is both fair to believe (based on what’s out there), but also inaccurate, if that makes sense. I 100% agree WATA employees should not grade their own games. So while some may see arguing what is an “employee” as semantics, I think it’s key. There’s a second divide, though, which is whether it’s appropriate for investors to participate in grading companies at all. I think that’s far more interesting and important for future in collectibles. How much separation is needed to participate? Lots of gray lines in the space.

Deniz - Antonio Banderas Kenneth- Brad Pitt Mark Haspel - Steve Carrell Jim Halperin - John Lithgow Karl Jobst - Aaron Carter Seth Abramson - Himself Wait, Jobst is Australian. Let’s go with Iggy Azaelia.

Pretty sure it’s simply defined as anyone paid a salary, which I think is basically anyone working in the office. But I 100% agree with you that WATA left far too much to the imagination here. That, in and of itself, is probably the biggest reason they got caught in this mess. People are saying a million things that are untrue at this point, but that’s because stuff was presented and not clearly defined. If I read Mayer was a director and the things about Haspel, and I didn’t personally know better because I was around from early on, I’d have assumed the same. Personally, however, as someone participating in the market, my bigger concern would be whether preferential treatment was actually given. I’m certainly not going to argue with or begrudge anyone who sees what’s on the website and raises an eyebrow.

Appearances of potential conflict, I agree it’s an issue. But that’s where grading companies are generally in a tough spot. As we sit here today, [i]the same company owns PSA, WATA, and Goldin[/i]. Doesn’t that potentially create the appearance of a million conflicts? Not only do people gloss over that, but some have suggested now that WATA has sold, CU will save them. It’s just a massive contradiction to me. Where are we drawing a line in collectibles and subjective grading companies? Seems the video game community views a lot of this differently than, for example, sports cards collectors. I think it’s because there’s always been a schism between “real collectors” and “investors,” and this has set the microscope times 10,000.

I do not see why it’s unethical for investors to use WATA. It would be highly unethical (and quite possibly more) for WATA to treat them differently than other customers, however. Or, of course, for graders to grade their own games. If the government ever came in and regulated collectibles, I highly doubt they’d precent minority share investors from using the services.

I’ll be honest, I would absolutely distinguish between employee/on the ground worker and shareholder/advisor. One is down on the ground overseeing everything and could easily have direct influence in their daily activities, [i]most notably grading[/i], while the other is not. So, literally, he denied exactly that. What this really boils down to is whether Mark received preferential treatment or grading. I personally do not care if the investors/advisors use the service, provided they are treated as any other customer. Would you agree or disagree that investors should be able to use the service? I can see both arguments. I think that is what is really of issue in the ethics debate.

Mark Haspel did not know the first thing about sealed games when WATA started up. I can assure you he was not capable of overseeing WATA even if he wanted to lol. He was brought on as a liaison to the collectibles community. As for a “nondenial,” he’s been public about this for years and has never hidden it. There was never going to be a denial, and in fact he literally states right there he’s been buying, submitting, and selling. I’m not saying if it’s wrong or not, but clearly HE has been under the impression it is not because he’s been 100% open. WATA should have been more clear about his role. Ultimately, I think this all boils down to whether it is or is not ethical for investors in a grading company to use the service.

No mention of the 300k Halo yet? It’s almost like some people here got tired and decided to sleep .

I think ComicLink does? And also doesn’t show it until checkout. I could be wrong, but that is my recollection. It’s on the smaller side, though.

@ShmupAdded! Oh, just saw your new post now lemme know if you wanna delete it

The Jeff thing was in an old NA thread and Mark Haspel has not exactly been secret about anything he’s been doing, as he’s been buying and selling under his name in public in person and on Ebay. I don’t want to speak for anyone, but I believe neither had anything to do with day to day operations or were traditional employees in that sense. However, I am not sure if they were paid for other roles. Jeff seems to indicate the latter, Mark not sure. Not trying to make judgments about these things one way or another, btw, just addressing what’s new. Though I suppose that is relative.

People will soon realize this is a collectibles-wide issue. CGC’s comics are wayyyy behind, too.

Quickly? It’s all been public for like 3 years lol. There was a thread on NA in early 2019. I don’t think anything being “reported” has been hidden.

Edit - Prob better info for another thread

There is a Moonwalker prototype that was discovered years ago at a flea market near his home that had all sorts of cool differences, including sound track and a completely different final level, that is rumored to have come from there. This person sold it to someone else, and that other person made a video, but has since removed it. My guess is he might have sold it himself and the new owner asked for removal or something? Just a guess on that, though.

There are websites like 130 point that can nail down final price, but given like 25% of sales on Ebay end up not being paid or a nightmare, people generally avoid them for large sales. Happens on other forums as well, just nowhere near the level of Ebay. And there are better guarantees and safety measures elsewhere.