Vote Here for the Indie NES Game Hall of Fame!

[Ankos | 452]

59 minutes ago, Gloves said:

I play a LOT of homebrews. I also play a LOT of shmups. 

Making a GOOD shmup is not that easy especially on the NES with sprite flickering and slow down, both of which are almost non existent in the game which is basically a miracle. 

There's not a ton of shmups coming out and those that do aren't great. The other one on my nominations is the exception - Astro Ninja Man is excellent, it's just not my favourite type of shmup. 

Again, you alluded to there being games out of Japan which are better. Name some. 

Haven't played this one, but I saw HaraForce on a blog post by Scrobins, and it looked pretty cool

 

[fcgamer | 4,736]

Also another question for @Seth : it's not clear, are we supposed to be voting on our favorite indie games or our favorite homebrew games? Or we can vote on either?

[Gloves | 11,801]

18 minutes ago, Ankos said:

Haven't played this one, but I saw HaraForce on a blog post by Scrobins, and it looked pretty cool

 

HaraForce is cool, but it and others like it lack a certain nuance. There's no mystery. Scoring lacks discovery and strategy. A good shoot em up is challenging, looks nice, and is fun to play. A GREAT shoot em up IMO has a fairly low barrier to entry but a high skill ceiling, rewarding daring plays, patience, strategy, and memorization.

Games like HaraForce and other shmups I've seen over the years on retro consoles for the most part lack what makes a truly GREAT shmup. Blade Buster rewards players for patience - orange ball enemies can be killed immediately, but if you wait for them to open you get bonus points. Big round enemies which enter the screen in 4 parts which come together can be destroyed prior to their joining for huge points. Early on in the game they show you that destroying two large orb enemies at the same time (they turn orange shortly before their deaths) will also grant a huge point bonus. Later on in the game this knowledge comes in handy as two of them come in staggered, and you have to partially damage them into orange (i.e. close to death) but not finish them until they're both on screen which takes a little bit to happen, all while dealing with other enemies, and when they converge on screen for that point bonus it's *chef's kiss*.

Most shmups could be played for high score - do better, kill more enemies, and often just farm popcorn during infinite boss fights, and you'll get a huge score or even max it out. Blade Buster gives you a time limit and challenges you to master your knowledge of the game and that just takes the experience to a whole nother level that others don't seem to be bothering to replicate or work to go beyond. The closest imitators mostly just ask the question "how much shit can I toss at the player at once on the NES?", with some going way overboard and creating a miserable experience. Over Obj is a recent example of this - I found that miserable to play and I love bullet hells. People need to respect the platform and its limitations and work within it.

[Seth | 172]

2 hours ago, Gloves said:

How is seeing Blade Buster sad? It's fucking phenomenal. Show me a better shmup on the NES. 

I like Blade Buster! But there are definitely shooters that are as good or better, from Astro Ninja Man to HaraForce to HaraTyler to Haradius Zero to Over Obj to Star Keeper. And those who like quirky games will say GunTneR or Oratorio.

[Seth | 172]

28 minutes ago, fcgamer said:

Also another question for @Seth : it's not clear, are we supposed to be voting on our favorite indie games or our favorite homebrew games? Or we can vote on either?

Either! 

[Seth | 172]

2 hours ago, AverageOliver98 said:

Little Medusa

A great and too-little recognized game, IMO!

[JamesRobot | 5,808]

My top 10 no particular order:

• Larry
• Nebs 'n Debs
• Blade Buster
• Both Battle Kids; Battle Kid 2 gun to my head 
• Star Evil
• Arlington Apple
• Lizard
• Streemerz
• Spook-o-Tron
• 8 BIT XMAS 2018
• Full Quiet
• Super Russian Roulette 

[doner24 | 1,197]

Any list of votes without Battlekid is unserious. It’s a Hall of Fame, not which recent game do you like the best. 

[Gloves | 11,801]

25 minutes ago, Seth said:

I like Blade Buster! But there are definitely shooters that are as good or better, from Astro Ninja Man to HaraForce to HaraTyler to Haradius Zero to Over Obj to Star Keeper. And those who like quirky games will say GunTneR or Oratorio.

See my statement above - I've played all those you've listed and would consider them all to be inferior, personally. GunTneR was horrible and the dev didn't really honor my purchase - I got the "put something in the game" tier and he was entirely unresponsive and didn't implement anything at all that I proposed. Oratorio is a rail-shooter, completely different genre.

I don't wanna be the snobby jerk in the room, but I play a lot of shmups and I play them at a very high skill level with a very deep understanding of the genre. The games you listed aside from maybe Astro Ninja Man aren't in the same ballpark as Blade Buster, and I'd personally once again place the two in separate categories. The spaceship shooter with full mobility and the Space Invaders style are both valid and these two games are high caliber examples of each, but I'd not necessarily compare the two beyond surface level aesthetics.

[Gloves | 11,801]

4 minutes ago, doner24 said:

Any list of votes without Battlekid is unserious. It’s a Hall of Fame, not which recent game do you like the best. 

I didn't like Battle Kid personally, but agreed - when the game came out is irrelevant. If other newer games can't keep up then that's tough noogies. Can anybody name a homebrew that's a better NES platformer than SMB3? 

[Seth | 172]

4 minutes ago, Gloves said:

I don't wanna be the snobby jerk in the room, but I play a lot of shmups and I play them at a very high skill level with a very deep understanding of the genre.

Fair enough! I hear you. As I said, I think Blade Buster is great. I have it ranked (would have to check) second or third among all NES homebrew shooters ever. And I personally dislike GunTneR.

Edited April 25 by Seth

[Seth | 172]

8 minutes ago, doner24 said:

Any list of votes without Battlekid is unserious.

You gotta like Nintendo Hard, tho.

[fcgamer | 4,736]

2 minutes ago, Gloves said:

I didn't like Battle Kid personally, but agreed - when the game came out is irrelevant. If other newer games can't keep up then that's tough noogies. Can anybody name a homebrew that's a better NES platformer than SMB3? 

Can anyone name any game that is better than NES Super Mario Bros. 3? Nope. 

[Gloves | 11,801]

Just now, Seth said:

You gotta like Nintendo Hard, tho.

I just don't like Mega Man style games. 

[fcgamer | 4,736]

Here's my list of indie and homebrew game picks, in no particular order.

A Hole New World
Abbaye des Morts
Gruniozerca 3
Huang Di
Lin Baned the Opium
Master Chu & the Drunkard Hu
Skate Cat
Thunder Warrior
Thunderbolt II
Trophy

[Seth | 172]

1 minute ago, fcgamer said:

Here's my list of indie and homebrew game picks, in no particular order.

A Hole New World
Abbaye des Morts
Gruniozerca 3
Huang Di
Lin Baned the Opium
Master Chu & the Drunkard Hu
Skate Cat
Thunder Warrior
Thunderbolt II
Trophy

Ah, I see now that I misunderstood your question. It *does* have to be aftermarket (released 1996 or after), so I think at least MC&DH would be ineligible?

[JamesRobot | 5,808]

8 minutes ago, Gloves said:

I just don't like Mega Man style games. 

I'd argue that it's a little more of a Metroid style game.  A Megatroidvania as it were. 

[Gloves | 11,801]

2 minutes ago, JamesRobot said:

I'd argue that it's a little more of a Metroid style game.  A Megatroidvania as it were. 

That's totally fair, and I'll follow up with that I also don't like Metroid games lol. The first Castlevania was good though, and I've not played the rest of those. When I first played Battle Kid I was expecting (and was told to expect...) another I Wanna Be The Guy (which I loved), and was disappointed.

[JamesRobot | 5,808]

20 minutes ago, Gloves said:

would consider them all to be inferior

I can't agree more.  Blade Buster is exceptional.  The only criticism is probably its length, but that is certainly part of the charm for me.  

[fcgamer | 4,736]

15 minutes ago, JamesRobot said:

I can't agree more.  Blade Buster is exceptional.  The only criticism is probably its length, but that is certainly part of the charm for me.  

Wasn't Blade Buster designed to be a caravan shooter though? Basically it's like a NWC cartridge, only as a shooter. 

When reading Glove's assessment of the game compared to the other recent shmups coming out, I immediately thought to myself that some of the criticisms were likely because he was comparing his preference for caravan shooters to regular shooters. I mean, if I prefer the setup of the NWC cartridge, Super Mario or Rad Racer by themselves would pale in comparison...

[fcgamer | 4,736]

30 minutes ago, Seth said:

Ah, I see now that I misunderstood your question. It *does* have to be aftermarket (released 1996 or after), so I think at least MC&DH would be ineligible?

Ah I see, I guess some of the earlier homebrew that was done using Family Basic also wouldn't count then. I saw the vast majority of people voting on games released over a decade ago so I didn't realize that there would be a timeline cutoff point. I mean, neither indie nor homebrew have anything to do with the term "aftermarket" in terms of their meaning.

[Murray | 2,449]

[JamesRobot | 5,808]

15 minutes ago, fcgamer said:

Wasn't Blade Buster designed to be a caravan shooter though? Basically it's like a NWC cartridge, only as a shooter. 

When reading Glove's assessment of the game compared to the other recent shmups coming out, I immediately thought to myself that some of the criticisms were likely because he was comparing his preference for caravan shooters to regular shooters. I mean, if I prefer the setup of the NWC cartridge, Super Mario or Rad Racer by themselves would pale in comparison...

The fact that its a competition caravan shooter doesn't diminish the quality of the game.  I'd put in on the level of Super Bat Puncher.  It's not a full length LP.  More of an EP.

 

...I'll throw in a vote for Super Bat Puncher while I'm at it. 

[fcgamer | 4,736]

1 minute ago, JamesRobot said:

The fact that its a competition caravan shooter doesn't diminish the quality of the game.  I'd put in on the level of Super Bat Puncher.  It's not a full length LP.  More of an EP.

 

...I'll throw in a vote for Super Bat Puncher while I'm at it. 

Oh I never said that being a caravan shooter would diminish the quality of the game, rather my point was that it's like comparing guavas, pomelos, and oranges. They're all quite lovely fruit, but they're just quite different things. As such, Gloves might find pomelos and oranges to be inferior to guavas, if his personal preference isn't as keen towards citrus fruit, but that doesn't mean that pomelos and oranges are shit by any means, or should be seen as inferior, as they're kick ass in their own way.

[fcgamer | 4,736]

1 hour ago, Gloves said:

Blade Buster gives you a time limit and challenges you to master your knowledge of the game and that just takes the experience to a whole nother level that others don't seem to be bothering to replicate or work to go beyond.

That's because the game was designed as a caravan shooter. Were the others designed to be caravan shooters too or were they just designed to be technically and graphically impressive shooters?