AAA Games -- are they becoming more and more irrelevant?

[YOURTURN | 1,257]

I'll just say this before I sign off, go silent for obvious reasons, and wait until Sega announces either a Saturn or Dreamcast mini. That, or until I get the games I had put on my wish list shortly after I had joined NintendoAge. 

My time at Tokyo Game Show 2023 had me see far less AAA games be promoted than I was hoping. With me only hearing anything about a fraction of those games whenever a "controversy" (i.e. Final Fantasy VII Rebirth's revelation only makes sense to hardcore Doctor Who fans) pops up or Uniqlo begins to do a cross-promotion.

Which I am fine with since the last real talk I had resulted in me agree with a video game store owner that even collecting newer AAA games stopped being relevant a few years ago. With the owner saying that more care about self-appeasement than enjoying the story, those who work on said games, and other things that used to matter.

Then again, all of this is fine because I have seen many "fans" turn an otherwise fun fandom into a dumpster fire one. 

[Reed Rothchild | 9,675]

On 5/10/2023 at 11:12 PM, Sumez said:

Funny thing is, I'm not really "into indies" at all. Of course it pretty much goes into what you were already saying, but I'm just into video games, and there are a lot more indie video games nowadays than there were in the past - and a lot of them are really good, just like a lot of them are most likely awful trash. I just try to play what looks fun.

My sentiments exactly.  A game's background and pedigree are irrelevant to me, I just wanna play the best of the best.  This year I still have to get to the likes of God of War Ragnarok and Pentiment.  I have equally high hopes for the both of them.

A game I have on the way?  Lies of P.  Is that a AAA? Is it a AA? An Indie?  Don't know, and it doesn't matter.

[Tanooki | 4,968]

Seeing far less AAA games being promoted under the ancient and bastardized system of what AAA means now is a good thing.  If they're slowly and painfully learning a hard lesson, to walk it back some on team size, team budget, team expectation, budget vs intake of assumed sales that's a massively good thing.

And yeah...obviously Nintendo isn't in this run yet, they largely know how to manage their wallet well, masters of stinginess.  They make AAA level games and B and A tier stuff too that's cheap and fun, they shoot reasonable, they shoot wide, so if a game or two isn't some blockbuster in sales it's hardly a blip on their wallet. The third party industry on large for game development should have been taking notes for years, not mocking them while being a-holes angry that their games sold better than the stuff they pumped out.  Nintendo was competition because they had standards, far higher ones while not living on a knifes edge, and we see where ignoring that got those game maker behemoths -- mergers, downsizing, and chapter 13.

[Rhuno | 128]

It's hard to say if they've actually become less relevant or if I'm just not really a part of the target demographic these days.

Outside of Nintendo, which is still awesome, I can't really recall the last time I purchased a "AAA" game. I'm not buying much in the way of modern indie games either though; the vast majority of my purchases are NES era up to 360.

It's undeniable though that more and more games are being created by smaller teams as popular engines have made development much more accessible than it was previously.

[RH | 5,054]

2 hours ago, Reed Rothchild said:

My sentiments exactly.  A game's background and pedigree are irrelevant to me, I just wanna play the best of the best.  This year I still have to get to the likes of God of War Ragnarok and Pentiment.  I have equally high hopes for the both of them.

A game I have on the way?  Lies of P.  Is that a AAA? Is it a AA? An Indie?  Don't know, and it doesn't matter.

I had to check the tracking  on that one since I sent it to you.  Hmm, seems like the USPS is taking there sweet little time on that one.  Sorry.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,675]

7 minutes ago, RH said:

I had to check the tracking  on that one since I sent it to you.  Hmm, seems like the USPS is taking there sweet little time on that one.  Sorry.

No worries, LRG takes 12 months, and my backlog is scheduled out until at least October at this rate.  Pinocchioborne will have to wait either way 

[inasuma | 1,215]

On 5/10/2024 at 2:03 PM, fox said:

No thread here for Animal Well or any other indie releases, but Nintendo slaps a couple old roms on a disc and everyone here loses their dang mind

Seriously. One of the best indie games of the year. Perhaps the best - but we’ll see how the year shakes out.

[inasuma | 1,215]

Other indie games that come to mind in the “challenging AAA dominance” category:

- hyper light drifter

- hades

- deaths door

- FEZ

- TUNIC

- journey

- FTL: faster than light

and more!

in my mind these are so much more memorable than any AAA game in the last 15 years. Another point too, there are so many indie games now, that there are easily a dozen more engaging indie games for every AAA game.

[Tanooki | 4,968]

I would think Dead Cells would qualify, and just a year ago they got the feather int he cap with the Return to Castlevania bringing all that goodness in themselves not relying on flaky Konami and it seems super popular.  I just grabbed it due to a bundle sale, soon as I can I'll install and try it around work.

The use of the Lodoss War franchise with that indie of Deedlit in the Wonder Labyrinth is a real stunner, right in there with Metroid 3/SOTN( and sequel variants) in top notch level of greatness and on that track due to IGA Bloodstained as well.

[Sumez | 3,035]

I'll talk about Animal Well here when the game actually comes out physically. It's an LRG release, so I'm assuming in about two years time. It's a bit early for it now.

Edited May 15 by Sumez

[Reed Rothchild | 9,675]

Indies for days.  Remember that debate thread I just did where 3 people had played Obra Dinn? 

[wongojack | 236]

18 hours ago, inasuma said:

Other indie games that come to mind in the “challenging AAA dominance” category:

- hyper light drifter

- hades

- deaths door

- FEZ

- TUNIC

- journey

- FTL: faster than light

and more!

in my mind these are so much more memorable than any AAA game in the last 15 years. Another point too, there are so many indie games now, that there are easily a dozen more engaging indie games for every AAA game.

I'd say Braid fits in nicely with the list you posted.  Super Meat Boy to complete those from that documentary and then add Celeste and Axiom Verge.

But there's so many others now.  I've seen "Wasteland 2" categorized as Indie.

[avatar! | 1,854]

3 hours ago, Reed Rothchild said:

Indies for days.  Remember that debate thread I just did where 3 people had played Obra Dinn? 

I so wanted to love Obra Dinn, but I just did not. It's a high-quality game for sure, with amazing graphics and cool everything... just not for me. Great soundtrack too

[avatar! | 1,854]

Success Can't Save Your Favorite Game Studios Anymore

https://www.ign.com/articles/success-cant-save-your-favorite-game-studios-anymore

If success cannot save your studio, what can?

With the upcoming release of Hellblade II: Senua’s Sacrifice, it is not difficult to imagine that a successful launch would not shield Ninja Theory from Microsoft’s ever-floating evaluations. Now those talented developers who have spent years toiling away on their game across multiple changes in their parent company’s focus have an ominous pall hanging over their head. It is not just enough to make a good game, nor make a game that critics and audiences both like, but you have to hope that a C-Suite executive’s nebulous plans forward include taking your studio along for the ride.

We have long assumed that corporate ownership by one of the richest companies in the industry would inoculate studios from tragic closures, but we were wrong. We thought that putting out a game with a modest budget would be protection, but we were wrong there too. And now we have learned that putting out a critically acclaimed title that said richest companies openly brag about succeeding will not protect anyone. There truly is no more shelter to hide under in the gaming industry and developers and consumers both suffer from it.

It is also unclear at this point what players can do to support games they love anymore.

If you're "old enough" you would never have assumed that a rich company would ever shield any studio. In fact, you know it's the opposite. Evil Arts has long destroyed numerous studios -- Nothing is new under the Sun, apparently the younger generation of developers/gamers is just learning this. What can you do? As a consumer you can support Limited Run Games and other indie publishers and developers. Honestly, most of the onus is on the studio. If the studio is sold to a large company, that's pretty much it. Years ago I spoke to a former developer at Origin Systems, he told me the day they were acquired by EA, everyone attended a "party" with a large bonfire where they made certain sacrifices (or curses) and they all knew it was over. It was. That's how it always has been in entertainment. Disney and other film studios also have done the same thing, they would purchase and destroy the films of competitors. In some instances, those films are now sadly lost. While studios no longer do that obviously, the purchasing and closing of studios is neither new and will continue for the foreseeable future.

[RH | 5,054]

Are we facing the second gaming crash?  Looks like it, and I mean it's possible.  I definitely think that gamers in the 80s were not burnt out from video games.  The industry over-saturated itself and then imploded.

If this is happening to hyper-budget, AAA titles that result in mediocre experiences, I'm all for it.  I think there is a middle ground of what' amazing with indie studios and the big-budget titles from mega companies.  If they can learn that, maybe they can start focusing on great game design and then make games that are 2-5x larger than a typical indie game, rather than 20-30x, maybe we can find a great balance of stellar technology pairing with amazing gaming experiences.

[avatar! | 1,854]

In an era of 100GB games, breakout Metroidvania hit Animal Well is only 34MB

https://www.gamesradar.com/games/platformer/in-an-era-of-100gb-games-breakout-metroidvania-hit-animal-well-is-only-34mb-so-small-that-its-4k-ps5-background-is-likely-larger-than-the-game/

The game's a fair bit bigger on consoles, particularly PS5, where it takes up 101MB. Basso attributes that to the 4K image that appears as the background in the console UI when you hover over the game icon. According to Basso, that background "is likely larger than the game."

The game is of course an indie

In fact, it's the first game published by a husband and wife duo who founded Bigmode

https://bigmode.com/

We love and deeply care about games, as well as artists and creatives in general. Bigmode is our way to foster and support those who are putting the effort and love into their projects to create the best they can— to give them the spotlight they deserve and see more of what we love in gaming.

[inasuma | 1,215]

12 hours ago, wongojack said:

I'd say Braid fits in nicely with the list you posted.  Super Meat Boy to complete those from that documentary and then add Celeste and Axiom Verge.

But there's so many others now.  I've seen "Wasteland 2" categorized as Indie.

All of those absolutely. Can’t believe I forgot Celeste and axiom verge!

[Tanooki | 4,968]

My laugh at the 100GB post is about the bigger picture.  Good on them, but when a 34MB game has a larger impact, is more profitable vs cost, has more love thrown at it than shade turns out doing better than the 100GB going to still kill us AAA industry -- hahahah let it burn.  Like RH said in a few words again -- let it burn.  The sooner those who refuse to learn die off, the better off everyone will be on both side (dev and play.)

[RH | 5,054]

37 minutes ago, Tanooki said:

My laugh at the 100GB post is about the bigger picture.  Good on them, but when a 34MB game has a larger impact, is more profitable vs cost, has more love thrown at it than shade turns out doing better than the 100GB going to still kill us AAA industry -- hahahah let it burn.  Like RH said in a few words again -- let it burn.  The sooner those who refuse to learn die off, the better off everyone will be on both side (dev and play.)

Yeah, but I'm afraid that Square-Enix might be one that dies out from this, considering they chose to refocus on strictly a select few AAA titles, as opposed to a wide array of A, AA and AAA titles.  Octopath Traveler as a series is probably dead, and now there's zero-chance that I'll get a proper Xenogears remake.

[Reed Rothchild | 9,675]

As a dunkey fan, I've had my eye on Animal Well for awhile, and I'm happy to see it do well.

...but that doesn't mean I don't want followups - in whatever form they take - to games like Tears of the Kingdom and Elden Ring.  Big AAA has it's place, if done right.

And I really, really hope the first big Mario game on Switch 2 is a big expensive Mario Odyssey kinda thing, and not yet another 2D "New/Wonder" kinda deal.

[xelement5x | 77]

2 hours ago, RH said:

Yeah, but I'm afraid that Square-Enix might be one that dies out from this, considering they chose to refocus on strictly a select few AAA titles, as opposed to a wide array of A, AA and AAA titles.  Octopath Traveler as a series is probably dead, and now there's zero-chance that I'll get a proper Xenogears remake.

Square needs to get their head of the blockchain bucket as well, it just seems like a huge time and money sink for them.  Their mobile game offerings have also been pretty profitable, but you're right they don't seem to have much spread between cheap mobile and expensive AAA games anymore.  

[Gloves | 11,978]

54 minutes ago, Reed Rothchild said:

As a dunkey fan, I've had my eye on Animal Well for awhile, and I'm happy to see it do well.

...but that doesn't mean I don't want followups - in whatever form they take - to games like Tears of the Kingdom and Elden Ring.  Big AAA has it's place, if done right.

And I really, really hope the first big Mario game on Switch 2 is a big expensive Mario Odyssey kinda thing, and not yet another 2D "New/Wonder" kinda deal.

I hope it's not too expensive!

[wongojack | 236]

Would not have heard of Animal Well without this thread.  Thank you - added to wishlist

[inasuma | 1,215]

18 hours ago, avatar! said:

In an era of 100GB games, breakout Metroidvania hit Animal Well is only 34MB

https://www.gamesradar.com/games/platformer/in-an-era-of-100gb-games-breakout-metroidvania-hit-animal-well-is-only-34mb-so-small-that-its-4k-ps5-background-is-likely-larger-than-the-game/

The game's a fair bit bigger on consoles, particularly PS5, where it takes up 101MB. Basso attributes that to the 4K image that appears as the background in the console UI when you hover over the game icon. According to Basso, that background "is likely larger than the game."

The game is of course an indie

In fact, it's the first game published by a husband and wife duo who founded Bigmode

https://bigmode.com/

We love and deeply care about games, as well as artists and creatives in general. Bigmode is our way to foster and support those who are putting the effort and love into their projects to create the best they can— to give them the spotlight they deserve and see more of what we love in gaming.

I’m sorry but what? Why does its size matter? It’s as if someone put “write an entire article upselling animal well purely due to its 34mb size” into chat gpt

Edited May 16 by inasuma

[avatar! | 1,854]

23 minutes ago, inasuma said:

I’m sorry but what? Why does its size matter? It’s as if someone put “write an entire article upselling animal well purely due to its 34mb size” into chat gpt

The way I look at it is like this --

Look, I'm a realist, I know that Unicorn Overlord, Baldur's Gate, etc. are not games that an indie developer could create. They need a large team and lots of money. As I said, there will always be a need for AAA-games. What I feel Animal Well brings to the table is that big-budget does NOT mean better quality. When an indie game like Animal Well, which was developed by one individual, gets much more acclaim than the majority of AAA games, AND the size of the entire game is so tiny that it's not much more than a few pictures on your camera, well that says a lot about the state of the industry.