Tanooki | 4,930 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 8 hours ago, fcgamer said: Sure. Khan's Leisure Suit Larry Khan's Frogger Sintax's Pokemon Leaf Sachen's Rockman X Tengen Tetris Boot boot boot boot unlicensed game recalled over a court loss, but not a bootleg. They went in with good faith on Tetris thinking they had the rights, then Nintendo bitchslapped them with a reality check unfortunately given it's the better game. Why boot boot boot boot? #1 and #2 Licensed IP, sure as hell didn't have permission from Sierra or Konami. #3 yeah Pokemon IP used, bootleg and #4 Rockman IP used so yeah both bootlegs, pirate carts entirely. There is no gray area on that anymore than some of the goofy pokemon frauds I have on a couple GB multicarts I got recently, one a wholly new game, another just a hack. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fcgamer | 4,719 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 1 minute ago, Tanooki said: Boot boot boot boot unlicensed game recalled over a court loss, but not a bootleg. They went in with good faith on Tetris thinking they had the rights, then Nintendo bitchslapped them with a reality check unfortunately given it's the better game. Why boot boot boot boot? #1 and #2 Licensed IP, sure as hell didn't have permission from Sierra or Konami. #3 yeah Pokemon IP used, bootleg and #4 Rockman IP used so yeah both bootlegs, pirate carts entirely. There is no gray area on that anymore than some of the goofy pokemon frauds I have on a couple GB multicarts I got recently, one a wholly new game, another just a hack. Thanks, I'd honestly agree with your assessment of these without arguments. It feels refreshing to see someone look at things and apply the rules equally to each case, rather than just using knee-jerk reactions or playing favourites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 4,930 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 (edited) That's fine, I have no stake in it really as I don't care, I'll buy whatever I like either legit or bs, and if it is bs, maybe I want it loose and obvious like a multi, or I want one as dead pan accurate as possible. My mood shifts depending. But what I don't shift on is what I know it right and wrong as far as games like that go. I've lightly kept up with Sintax stuff, find it a bit interesting, Sachen being an utter nightmare not so much. I'd love to own some, they have some really unique garbage, and decent stuff that could be dismissed as much. Problem is, they pop up thin, so that thin margin who want that junk get shitty about it on ebay so it's pointless. Not going to pay like $50 or $500 for some sintax and sachen scrap. It would be neat to get some sachen repurposed stuff that went to that Supervision though. I liked this space for sintax info: https://hhug.me/ This guy covers some crazy stuff. Edited February 3, 2021 by Tanooki 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray | 2,447 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 2 hours ago, CasualCart said: I've always wanted to know what the succulent meant! (And I actually left a blank label above the door so this could intentionally be meme-ified haha) -CasualCart 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 4,930 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 By the way @fcgamerthat hhug site I linked before, if you didn't use it already you may be interested. The stuff it covers is quite in depth and pretty educational and interesting. They're even developing an emulator that handles the sachen mappers uniquely made for Gameboy which I found worth mentioning due to your interest in that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OptOut | 8,881 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 2 hours ago, Murray said: I miss that lil guy... Seems forever I gave him up for adoption... Is he doing well in school @Richardhead? Does he ever... does he ever ask about me... 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sumez | 2,933 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 7 hours ago, Tanooki said: unfortunately given it's the better game. Haha that's definitely a unique take that's probably worthy of a dedicated thread 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkTone | 984 Posted February 3, 2021 Share Posted February 3, 2021 9 hours ago, CasualCart said: Thank you for saving this thread. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegHead | 127 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 I don't mind bootlegs of old stuff. Once a system is abandoned by a developer, the market essentially disappears for it. Nintendo isn't making money on any of that stuff, and this niche market certainly doesn't seem to be hurting them when they release things like the NES Classic. Legally, of course, bootlegs of any kind are illegal, but most people here seem to be making moral arguments around the stuff, so that's what I'm addressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 4,930 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 You mean Nintendo isn't making money off a majority of it, not 'any of it' as a very fast poke around the eShop or the Nintendo Switch NES and SNES freebie with subscription apps say otherwise. And of course you nailed the other, the NES (and SNES) Classic too. The market doesn't so much disappear, it just minimizes very largely and a bit of that even is self imposed in this day when you can emulate, remake, or remaster this and that legitimately as a game publisher on all sorts of formats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegHead | 127 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 9 hours ago, Tanooki said: You mean Nintendo isn't making money off a majority of it. Let me clarify: Nintendo has abandoned its old products. The NES/SNES Classics are new products, in the sense that they don't interface in any way with the old products (the original systems). The same goes for the Sub service, in that, it's a new product. Nintendo has done an amazing job creating a reasonable facsimile of the experiences, and I utilize the sub service myself. That said, I am making the argument that the people who continue to utilize Nintendo's old products after the company itself has abandoned them aren't affecting the market for the new products because those new products are weighed on their own merits. The new products will create their own experiences, different than someone using one of the old products. Even if Nintendo can make it very close, it could never be identical. From that sense, I would further suggest that once a company decides it no longer wants to make money off a product, the public should be free to do what they will with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeaglePuss | 80 Posted February 4, 2021 Share Posted February 4, 2021 You wonder why I stick to voting in music polls. Also, how about some Elvis Costello? Big, big fan. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron92 | 0 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 On 2/2/2021 at 9:22 AM, attakid101 said: Missed you too, champ. How’s things? I saw that you have a super Nintendo kiosk. Does it happen to be for sale? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanooki | 4,930 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 14 hours ago, VegHead said: Let me clarify: Nintendo has abandoned its old products. From that sense, I would further suggest that once a company decides it no longer wants to make money off a product, the public should be free to do what they will with it. Fair enough...and... I don't agree. And neither would their lawyers. Because you feel that sub-service, or the CE consoles aren't identical, they don't care, nor do their third parties. They re-published/re-licensed them for sale and they're making money on the things, so the market has some impact as it's another way to access the stuff. Just because they don't care to directly make money on the actual NES, SNES, Gameboy, etc hardware still (or SNK, Sega or Sony stuff...) doesn't mean they can't re-release the games to run correctly so they can be enjoyed and profited on again and again. So no, the public shouldn't be free to do as they wish, it's called piracy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegHead | 127 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 10 hours ago, Tanooki said: Fair enough...and... I don't agree. And neither would their lawyers. Because you feel that sub-service, or the CE consoles aren't identical, they don't care, nor do their third parties. They re-published/re-licensed them for sale and they're making money on the things, so the market has some impact as it's another way to access the stuff. Just because they don't care to directly make money on the actual NES, SNES, Gameboy, etc hardware still (or SNK, Sega or Sony stuff...) doesn't mean they can't re-release the games to run correctly so they can be enjoyed and profited on again and again. So no, the public shouldn't be free to do as they wish, it's called piracy. Sorry, mate, but I already said in the post previous that it was obviously illegal. You've spent a lot of time here refuting a point I readily concede. I was specifically talking about the moral/ethical argument because morality and legality don't always coincide. In this case, and in my opinion only, the moral argument is that companies made their money on the original products, continue to make money on re-releases, but that the public is being bilked out of their due because of draconian copyright laws. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phart010 | 1,705 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) 35 minutes ago, VegHead said: Sorry, mate, but I already said in the post previous that it was obviously illegal. You've spent a lot of time here refuting a point I readily concede. I was specifically talking about the moral/ethical argument because morality and legality don't always coincide. In this case, and in my opinion only, the moral argument is that companies made their money on the original products, continue to make money on re-releases, but that the public is being bilked out of their due because of draconian copyright laws. Im not for or against pirating, can’t say I’m completely innocent, but I do always buy original stuff to support publishers whenever it is possible. But just to play devil’s advocate, they could have plans to re-release something old but we are just unaware of it. In that case you’d be taking away their thunder by pirating it. Part of the marketing hype of rereleasing something that has been inaccessible for a long time is the fact that it’s been inaccessible for a long time. Nintendo or other developers may want to capitalize on that inaccessibility by re-releasing it. If people pirate the software making it accessible, then when it does get a re-release people will be less likely to spend money on the re-release since they’ve already gotten their fix in the interim. Edited February 5, 2021 by phart010 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BortLicensePlate | 652 Graphics Team · Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 This is now a conversation about the ethics of piracy? I dunno, most of the time the people who pirate stuff were never interested in paying money for it anyway. What does this have to do with a counterfeit NWC? Also I agree with the veg guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloves | 11,761 Administrator · Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 6 minutes ago, BortLicensePlate said: This is now a conversation about the ethics of piracy? I dunno, most of the time the people who pirate stuff were never interested in paying money for it anyway. What does this have to do with a counterfeit NWC? Also I agree with the veg guy. Actually piracy has been shown numerous times to increase likelihood of purchase where games are concerned. A lot of people pirate games specifically to demo them, where a demo is not provided by the developer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BortLicensePlate | 652 Graphics Team · Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 1 minute ago, Gloves said: Actually piracy has been shown numerous times to increase likelihood of purchase where games are concerned. A lot of people pirate games specifically to demo them, where a demo is not provided by the developer. Actually thats a great point. I've done that myself with old games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefaultGen | 5,400 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 3 minutes ago, Gloves said: Actually piracy has been shown numerous times to increase likelihood of purchase where games are concerned. A lot of people pirate games specifically to demo them, where a demo is not provided by the developer. But demos don’t exist anymore because they decrease sales Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloves | 11,761 Administrator · Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 3 minutes ago, DefaultGen said: But demos don’t exist anymore because they decrease sales Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegHead | 127 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 1 hour ago, phart010 said: Im not for or against pirating, can’t say I’m completely innocent, but I do always buy original stuff to support publishers whenever it is possible. But just to play devil’s advocate, they could have plans to re-release something old but we are just unaware of it. In that case you’d be taking away their thunder by pirating it. Part of the marketing hype of rereleasing something that has been inaccessible for a long time is the fact that it’s been inaccessible for a long time. Nintendo or other developers may want to capitalize on that inaccessibility by re-releasing it. If people pirate the software making it accessible, then when it does get a re-release people will be less likely to spend money on the re-release since they’ve already gotten their fix in the interim. This is more than a hypothetical. Capcom, Disney, and others have re-released physical SNES carts in the last few years. I cannot speak to their sales numbers, but they've done well enough in these limited cases that there were subsequent re-releases. There have also been fresh releases of foreign games that never got a legal, local release. It would seem decades of bootlegs didn't erase the market for the real deal when it came around. I think when it comes down to it, if there's a desire in the market, and the owner/company cannot or will not satisfy that demand, you will invariably end up with bootlegs to bridge the gap. I believe this is the case in almost every aspect of commerce, although I don't think a universal ethic can be applied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePhleo | 2,184 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) Ah, this thread reeks of NintendoAge. Remember how threads used to get so de-railed that the conversation sort of used to loop around back onto itself? Edited February 5, 2021 by ThePhleo 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferris Bueller | 495 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a3quit4s | 4,092 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 How does this thread have 11 pages of responses lol 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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