The Spreading (And Potentially Deadly) Coronavirus Epidemic....

[Tanooki | 4,930]

I've read about that.  There's this rumor that the pfizer version of the drug can sterilize women.  I've not seen that being the case for moderna.  Yet I have read that supposedly the more safe is the J&J one out earlier next year that isn't some gene tweak but a more traditional method and only requires one dose instead of two.  I could see anyone scared of going barren waiting on the J&J one.

[Strange | 1,700]

1 hour ago, BriGuy82 said:

I was talking to a mid 20s, female respiratory therapist about the vaccine. She said she isn't getting it because of fertility concerns. The current percent of young female hospital workers that I've surveyed who are getting the vaccine is ZERO. It's all guys and older women getting the vaccine. 

Is there any proof of that, found in any case studies? Or is it another conspiracy we can add to the pile?

I have many, many young women that I went to school with who are working in the medical field right now who have already gotten it or are jumping up and down ready to get it.

Edited December 23, 2020 by The Strangest

[captmorgandrinker | 1,649]

18 minutes ago, The Strangest said:

Is there any proof of that, found in any case studies? Or is it another conspiracy we can add to the pile?

Whichever it is, I've also heard that cited as a reason some do not currently want to receive it.

[BriGuy82 | 762]

1 hour ago, The Strangest said:

Is there any proof of that, found in any case studies? Or is it another conspiracy we can add to the pile?

I have many, many young women that I went to school with who are working in the medical field right now who have already gotten it or are jumping up and down ready to get it.

There isn't any proof that I'm aware of. But I just bring this up because I find it very interesting that such skepticism exists! Especially among people in healthcare. I don't buy into any conspiracy theories myself. But I haven't talked to a single female coworker of prime child bearing age who is getting the vaccine. Quite a disparity between what you and I have experienced clearly. I was taking to an middle aged oncology nurse today who got the vaccine and she was telling me that her daughter isn't getting it. She said she understood because they don't know what the long term side effects could be. 

Edited December 23, 2020 by BriGuy82

[BriGuy82 | 762]

Old school double post!

Edited December 23, 2020 by BriGuy82

[Strange | 1,700]

1 hour ago, captmorgandrinker said:

Whichever it is, I've also heard that cited as a reason some do not currently want to receive it.

I mean, causing autism is widely cited as a reason people don’t vaccinate their kids but it’s still a disproven conspiracy theory.

 

55 minutes ago, BriGuy82 said:

There isn't any proof that I'm aware of. But I just bring this up because I find it very interesting that such skepticism exists! Especially among people in healthcare. I don't buy into any conspiracy theories myself. But I haven't talked to a single female coworker of prime child bearing age who is getting the vaccine. Quite a disparity between what you and I have experienced clearly. I was taking to an middle aged oncology nurse today who got the vaccine and she was telling me that her daughter isn't getting it. She said she understood because they don't know what the long term side effects could be. 

I would ask to see where they read/heard that. Also ask them which vaccine is causing it, the Pfizer or the Moderna one? Is the other safe? What’s the rate at which this occurs? By what mechanism does it achieve this?

One of the reasons it’s shooting up red flags for me (besides the fact that there doesn’t appear to be any firsthand professional documentation of such a side effect) is that it ticks off some of the major modern day conspiracy theory checkboxes:

Big pharma/modern medicine is the bad guy and up to some dastardly scheme? Check.

The ultimate goal being to stop child bearing? Check.

(Seriously, take a look at modern conspiracy theories and see how many are crafted as a plot to end child bearing/the traditional family. Soy products feminizing men, GMOs being used to sterilize humans, 5G being implemented as a way to sterilize humans, etc. All of these have one common theme/end goal.)

Edited December 23, 2020 by The Strangest

[BriGuy82 | 762]

58 minutes ago, The Strangest said:

I mean, causing autism is widely cited as a reason people don’t vaccinate their kids but it’s still a disproven conspiracy theory.

 

I would ask to see where they read/heard that. Also ask them which vaccine is causing it, the Pfizer or the Moderna one? Is the other safe? What’s the rate at which this occurs? By what mechanism does it achieve this?

One of the reasons it’s shooting up red flags for me (besides the fact that there doesn’t appear to be any firsthand professional documentation of such a side effect) is that it ticks off some of the major modern day conspiracy theory checkboxes:

Big pharma/modern medicine is the bad guy and up to some dastardly scheme? Check.

The ultimate goal being to stop child bearing? Check.

(Seriously, take a look at modern conspiracy theories and see how many are crafted as a plot to end child bearing/the traditional family. Soy products feminizing men, GMOs being used to sterilize humans, 5G being implemented as a way to sterilize humans, etc. All of these have one common theme/end goal.)

I think it is all about the disinformation spread through social media. That generation buys into all that bullshit. That meme I posted a few pages back was sent to me from a nurse. I thought it was so stupid, it was funny. But she actually thought that picture supported her argument to not get vaccinated. She also kept showing me the video of  the nurse fainting on tv after getting the shot. Which you could clearly tell was a vasovagal response. But some people really are that dumb and easily influenced by nonsense.

[Strange | 1,700]

45 minutes ago, BriGuy82 said:

I think it is all about the disinformation spread through social media. That generation buys into all that bullshit. That meme I posted a few pages back was sent to me from a nurse. I thought it was so stupid, it was funny. But she actually thought that picture supported her argument to not get vaccinated. She also kept showing me the video of  the nurse fainting on tv after getting the shot. Which you could clearly tell was a vasovagal response. But some people really are that dumb and easily influenced by nonsense.

Disinformation is a huge, huge issue. A friend of mine I played music with in undergrad is from a rural part of west Tennessee. His uncle was in the hospital with it and he died because he refused treatment, citing that COVID is a hoax. You know he heard that from social media, or someone else who heard it from social media. But then you’ve also got public figures from celebrities to politicians saying these things. At what point do you step in? I know, freedom of speech. But you can’t yell “fire” in a movie theater because of the harm to others it can cause. At what point do we start to see blatant misinformation the same way? It’s the same reason platforms like Google and Facebook remove wack health pages like Natural News, because they spread misinformation that isn’t just wrong, but actually harmful to others on those platforms.

[BriGuy82 | 762]

43 minutes ago, The Strangest said:

Disinformation is a huge, huge issue. A friend of mine I played music with in undergrad is from a rural part of west Tennessee. His uncle was in the hospital with it and he died because he refused treatment, citing that COVID is a hoax. You know he heard that from social media, or someone else who heard it from social media. But then you’ve also got public figures from celebrities to politicians saying these things. At what point do you step in? I know, freedom of speech. But you can’t yell “fire” in a movie theater because of the harm to others it can cause. At what point do we start to see blatant misinformation the same way? It’s the same reason platforms like Google and Facebook remove wack health pages like Natural News, because they spread misinformation that isn’t just wrong, but actually harmful to others on those platforms.

Yeah that shit is crazy. I might sound naive and or sarcastic, but I never realized how many educated people buy into such dumb bullshit. That's why I find it so fascinating and have asked so many people I work with if they are getting the vaccine. I'm genuinely surprised by the responses I've received. You find out alot about people. 

[YOURTURN | 1,256]

1 hour ago, BriGuy82 said:

I think it is all about the disinformation spread through social media. That generation buys into all that bullshit. That meme I posted a few pages back was sent to me from a nurse. I thought it was so stupid, it was funny. But she actually thought that picture supported her argument to not get vaccinated. She also kept showing me the video of  the nurse fainting on tv after getting the shot. Which you could clearly tell was a vasovagal response. But some people really are that dumb and easily influenced by nonsense.

I know what you mean. VGS has its own share of moments where people either create, or even promote, misinformation. Something I can get into but won't because it is almost X'mas. So all I will say is "Always ask first, assume last."

But yeah... What you are talking about is why I tend to be glad that I am Autistic. I am 100% aware of my own anxieties, and fact-check anything that bothers me. Where as that nurse might not be aware that her reluctance to get a shot is based on her own anxieties. Which some small chance she will deny it because not many know what that is.

Then again... I do not know which of the two vaccines will work best for me. So instead of worrying about that I am going to look into what I want to collect once I complete the game end of my Dragon Quest collection.

[avatar! | 1,807]

6 hours ago, The Strangest said:

Is there any proof of that, found in any case studies? Or is it another conspiracy we can add to the pile?

I have many, many young women that I went to school with who are working in the medical field right now who have already gotten it or are jumping up and down ready to get it.

There's currently no evidence that the covid vaccine has negative effects on birth or someone's reproductive system, etc.

That said, there of course has been basically no such studies done. Most healthcare workers would urge people, including those that are pregnant, to get the vaccine. If you're pregnant and get covid, not only could you die, but who knows what it might do to the fetus. The lying faction of anti-vaxxers are already spreading so many lies it's... well, honestly it's not surprising. Sad, but not surprising.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/12/campaign-against-vaccines-already-under-way/617443/

 

[captmorgandrinker | 1,649]

20 hours ago, The Strangest said:

I mean, causing autism is widely cited as a reason people don’t vaccinate their kids but it’s still a disproven conspiracy theory.

I agree that they need to get the good information out there in front of this thing before Jenny McCarthy does.  I'm just pointing out that the sterilization theory already has significant legs.

[RegularGuyGamer | 2,011]

7% of people think chocolate milk comes from brown cows. All of those people plus the 7% of people who are slightly less stupid or more stupid than them make up the 15% of people who don't trust vaccines.

These are the same people who think the queen of England is a lizard and politicans had a sex ring in the basement of a pizza place.

Needless to say, antivaxxers by in large don't have the capacity to used any sort of inductive reasoning. I would go so far to say most of these types dont have a fully developed frontal cortex or have oppositional defiant disorder or even fall victim to proportionality bias. 

Either way, someone's response to things like should you wear a mask in a pandemic or get a vaccine for a virus that is more deadly than the flu but 3-7x more contagious is a big tell into how their brain grapples problems based in reality. 

[RegularGuyGamer | 2,011]

16 hours ago, avatar! said:

Is there any proof of that, found in any case studies? Or is it another conspiracy we can add to the pile?

There was a great rebuttal that went around a few years ago that found no correlation with vaccinations, in or out of the womb, and autism. But what the researcher found was the correlation between high cortisol levels in the pregnant mother, and low serotonin levels. They suggested that stress and sadness had a decent enough impact that or warranted further studies to focus solely on those as factors for things like autism, and others. 

I found it interesting that in debunking the vaccine nonsense that there was insight to something that potentially did contribute to the development of autism and instead of latching onto that, the antivaxx squad turned a blind eye.

So they actually don't care what might contribute to autism or research to help mother's prevent it, they just hate vaccines... 

Interestingly enough, they sell TONS of oils and droppers and supplements of their own and are backed by huge companies that profit from holistic medicine

[avatar! | 1,807]

@RegularGuyGameryou're misquoting The Strangest and I... but at any rate, it's no surprise that anti-vaxxers are all about "nature/God/etc". I would be interested to know what companies support these phoney-baloney

[RegularGuyGamer | 2,011]

1 hour ago, avatar! said:

@RegularGuyGameryou're misquoting The Strangest and I... but at any rate, it's no surprise that anti-vaxxers are all about "nature/God/etc". I would be interested to know what companies support these phoney-baloney

I wasn't trying to misrepresent what you guys were talking about, just add to the antivaxx bashing lol

[BriGuy82 | 762]

We got the PAPR units today. I liked wearing one. Definitely felt much better protected than the face shield. I had a covid+ patient with altered mental status take his mask off and get right up in my grill. So I guess it was good timing to have one on. 

 

[GPX | 1,369]

On 12/24/2020 at 8:38 AM, BriGuy82 said:

There isn't any proof that I'm aware of. But I just bring this up because I find it very interesting that such skepticism exists! Especially among people in healthcare. I don't buy into any conspiracy theories myself. But I haven't talked to a single female coworker of prime child bearing age who is getting the vaccine. Quite a disparity between what you and I have experienced clearly. I was taking to an middle aged oncology nurse today who got the vaccine and she was telling me that her daughter isn't getting it. She said she understood because they don't know what the long term side effects could be. 

The problem is that some side-effects of medications/vaccines may need several years of study, with significant sample trials to determine the actual risks. Meanwhile the rush for a vaccine puts more seeds of doubt on people’s minds regarding potential longterm side-effects.

Personally I look forward to getting it when it eventually comes out in Australia. However, I can understand in some cases where some might opt to not receive it for varying reasons. 

I think there are 2 groups of vaccine objectors:

1. Misinformed idiots (eg. those who rather hear advice through friends than their doctor).

2. Informed people weighing up their individual risks and benefits. 

 

[Tulpa | 3,488]

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=4133657223329922&set=pcb.4133659786662999

[Psychobear85 | 141]

I don’t understand why some people cannot take this seriously, a few days ago a coworker or mine showed up to work knowing she was exposed to COVID was showing symptoms and took a test the previous day, while working with us they called her with the results which where positive and was refusing to leave, To make it worse our job decided not to quarantine us and told us to go back to work. 

[avatar! | 1,807]

6 hours ago, Psychobear85 said:

I don’t understand why some people cannot take this seriously, a few days ago a coworker or mine showed up to work knowing she was exposed to COVID was showing symptoms and took a test the previous day, while working with us they called her with the results which where positive and was refusing to leave, To make it worse our job decided not to quarantine us and told us to go back to work. 

If you get sick, sue. Seriously, take them to court. You'll win.

[Californication | 1,477]

1 minute ago, avatar! said:

If you get sick, sue. Seriously, take them to court. You'll win.

Who would you sue?

 

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

15 minutes ago, Californication said:

Who would you sue?

 

Three separate parties.

1. The employee for refusing to leave.
2. The company itself for refusing to take action after being informed of an actual threat.
3. The person in charge who made the call to keep people there and not force her to leave.

Bleed them dry. No one has the right to knowingly expose you to a highly infectious disease ... well unless you’re in California and it’s an STD

Employers have a duty to keep their employees health safe at work as well.

Edited December 26, 2020 by ThePhleo

[Californication | 1,477]

2 hours ago, ThePhleo said:

Three separate parties.

1. The employee for refusing to leave.
2. The company itself for refusing to take action after being informed of an actual threat.
3. The person in charge who made the call to keep people there and not force her to leave.

Bleed them dry. No one has the right to knowingly expose you to a highly infectious disease ... well unless you’re in California and it’s an STD

Employers have a duty to keep their employees health safe at work as well.

The main problem is suing people is expensive. If you sue the employee and win, they may not have any money to pay you. You have a better chance of suing the company, but even then it isn't always a great idea. My company has a half of a floor with lawyers that work full time. Even if a company is at fault they can ask questions like, how do you know you got covid at work? Or they can drag it out for such a long time that even if they pay you off the expense is terrible. 

It will be interesting to see what happens going forward because I am expecting to see a lot of court cases.

[captmorgandrinker | 1,649]

7 minutes ago, Californication said:

The main problem is suing people is expensive. If you sue the employee and win, they may not have any money to pay you. You have a better chance of suing the company, but even then it isn't always a great idea. My company has a half of a floor with lawyers that work full time. Even if a company is at fault they can ask questions like, how do you know you got covid at work? Or they can drag it out for such a long time that even if they pay you off the expense is terrible. 

Exactly.  Pretty sure the approach for most companies is that if they're going to lose they make damn sure you're not going to "win".