NesQuest | 93 Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 Re: Goonies 5 screw... Considering the wear to the spine/front label, does it appear to anyone else the back label sticker was removed? Looks like there’s evidence on the upper right side where the label should be....(but that’s just my opinion!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PII | 1,884 Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 I think we might need some yet more and better photos here at some point. Maybe in the next day or two I'll be able to get to it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_Brink_ | 48 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 On 8/30/2020 at 5:33 PM, PII said: I've wondered about this just a bit and figured that if they were released as some kind of demo/kiosk item then it might make sense for them to turn up predominantly around the largest urban areas ie. New York, Chicago, L.A. as those would be the first choices to demo something in order for it to reach the most possible consumers. On that note one of the 5-Screws that I've acquired came from someone in the Chicago area, for whatever that's worth... Things may be about to get a bit "through the looking glass" here. I have something like that and once again I'm not going to make any claims. This copy of Goonies II 5-Screw w/no back label, security screws and White Oval Seal on the front turned up on Ebay in early 2019. It was from a seller called "mouseman140" and I think it was originally posted for $150 w/"factory mismatch" in the title. I thought it looked suspect and certainly wasn't going to dive in. I remember a couple of price drops like 120 and 100 maybe and then I kind of forgot about it for awhile. When I randomly checked again one day the price was down to a song and dance so I figured what the heck and grabbed it. This was in early March 2019. Shortly thereafter I noticed that some folks on NA were talking about this very item, most of whom seemed to find it suspect, mostly due to the state of the front label. I thought there was a possibility that it could be legit as someone having torn the label by starting at the top would then have had to remove what was left starting again from the bottom. The problem I see is that the "remaining torn portion" (white part) would have had to have gone through removal and reapplication without getting so much as a wrinkle in it. It is quite thin and would have been especially supple during removal. To give an idea, upon close up inspection there are apparent grey blotches on the white torn portion that are actually just spots where the grey shell casing can be seen through it. There is another point to be made for possible legitimacy that I noticed upon further inspection of the cartridge, but I'd rather not mention it in a public forum as I'd hate to give the wrong person any nefarious inspiration. At any rate I still regard this one as highly suspect for the one simple reason that it is a singular anomaly within an anomaly. On a related note I occasionally wonder if R.C. Pro-Am might prove to be the key to all of this at some point as it too is an anomaly within an anomaly, however it is not singular and is a well established occurrence. Recently, somewhere online I saw a photo of a 5-Screw R.C. Pro-Am that had a back label. I'm not sure if I have a snap shot of it or not, I'd have to sort through some folders. At one time I thought maybe that one could possibly have been a "normal" 5-screw as it came out in early 1988, is not Konami/Ultra; and the fact that I used to recurringly happen onto someone commenting online that they own a 5-Screw R.C. Pro-Am that they'd had since childhood. The last anomaly within this particular anomaly-field that I know of is that copy of Track & Field II 5-Screw that has a circular black seal on it and was originally documented on NA. Yes, I am the owner of the 5 screw Track & Field II. It is in near perfect condition and has a the back sticker with no "Rev A" and is stamped with a "12". Purchased this from Laketown two years ago. Pics below: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PII | 1,884 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 45 minutes ago, _Brink_ said: Yes, I am the owner of the 5 screw Track & Field II. It is in near perfect condition and has a the back sticker with no "Rev A" and is stamped with a "12". Purchased this from Laketown two years ago. Pics below: @_Brink_ You seem to have the first Track & Field game pictured, rather than Track & Field II. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Divingninja | 47 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 23 minutes ago, PII said: @_Brink_ You seem to have the first Track & Field game pictured, rather than Track & Field II. I also have a highly suspect track and field 2 oddly enough also from laketown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdStrongestMole | 430 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 10 hours ago, Divingninja said: I also have a highly suspect track and field 2 oddly enough also from laketown. More details? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 16 hours ago, PII said: I think we might need some yet more and better photos here at some point. Maybe in the next day or two I'll be able to get to it... Get the date codes. I think all the 5 screw Goonies II have the same chip date codes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferris Bueller | 495 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 Interesting. Both the Goonies I have sitting out have back labels. I have two Track and Field II's, I found both in the wild personally, one has a back label, the other does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PII | 1,884 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 44 minutes ago, Ferris Bueller said: Interesting. Both the Goonies I have sitting out have back labels. I have two Track and Field II's, I found both in the wild personally, one has a back label, the other does not. Do your Track & Field II's have White/Oval Seals or Black/Circle ??? ...Security Screws or Flatheads ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferris Bueller | 495 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 1 hour ago, PII said: Do your Track & Field II's have White/Oval Seals or Black/Circle ??? ...Security Screws or Flatheads ?? Both are White/Oval seals, the one with a label is flathead screws and the one without a back label is security. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdStrongestMole | 430 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 On 8/31/2020 at 5:03 PM, NesQuest said: Re: Goonies 5 screw... Considering the wear to the spine/front label, does it appear to anyone else the back label sticker was removed? Looks like there’s evidence on the upper right side where the label should be....(but that’s just my opinion!) Could be, but as a seller (assuming they've done their research, if they were trying to fake something) why peel the back label? There are a number of these floating around and I think most have the back label, so it'd be surprising if they took the extra step to do something that doesn't legitimize it more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NesQuest | 93 Posted September 2, 2020 Share Posted September 2, 2020 1 hour ago, 3rdStrongestMole said: Could be, but as a seller (assuming they've done their research, if they were trying to fake something) why peel the back label? There are a number of these floating around and I think most have the back label, so it'd be surprising if they took the extra step to do something that doesn't legitimize it more. I’m not saying the seller or anyone else is faking it. This could’ve come thru 10-15 different people and a rental store before it hit that seller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdStrongestMole | 430 Posted September 2, 2020 Share Posted September 2, 2020 2 hours ago, NesQuest said: I’m not saying the seller or anyone else is faking it. This could’ve come thru 10-15 different people and a rental store before it hit that seller. So like, maybe someone tore the back one off, then got started on the front and gave up? I guess that'd make sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyansas | 131 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 (edited) One tool in solving the Konami/Ultra 5 screw dilemma would be chip dates, I think. If the chip dates are spread out, that probably indicates something like them being refurbs, and if they're bunched together, that probably indicates that they were made at the same time for some reason. I have two 5 screw Silent Services with identical PRG and CHR chip dates. I have two TMNT IIs with dates one week apart. I have used to have two Castlevania IIs, and they have dates 3 months apart. So according to these dates, the data is..... inconclusive. Don't know what Castlevania II's dates being so spread out means. Edited September 3, 2020 by wyansas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid | 424 Posted September 3, 2020 Author Share Posted September 3, 2020 26 minutes ago, wyansas said: One tool in solving the Konami/Ultra 5 screw dilemma would be chip dates, I think. If the chip dates are spread out, that probably indicates something like them being refurbs, and if they're bunched together, that probably indicates that they were made at the same time for some reason. I have two 5 screw Silent Services with identical PRG and CHR chip dates. I have two TMNT IIs with dates one week apart. I have used to have two Castlevania IIs, and they have dates 3 months apart. So according to these dates, the data is..... inconclusive. Don't know what Castlevania II's dates being so spread out means. Maybe because your sample size is too small. Those who owns them can you post chip dates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyansas | 131 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 (edited) I made a document recently with all my rare variants' chip dates, and I documented the date on every chip. Which date(s) should we post? Posting our 3 screw versions' dates could be helpful, too, I think. Also, another thought I had was that the fact that a lot of these rare 5 screw Konamis have messed up labels seems like it would suggest that they weren't refurbs. A game that was sent in to get fixed would be a lot less likely to get messed up again. Why would somebody care enough to put it in a box and send it off to get it fixed and then be careless enough to mess the label up again? Might be subsequent owners messing up the label again, but you would still think that if they were refurbs that these labels would be nicer on average than the average NES game, but they're not really. And the Castlevania II I recently traded away was a CIB, which suggests something other than them being refurbs. I don't think the guy I got it from knows its origin. Edited September 3, 2020 by wyansas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 This is what I had. It should be formatted evenly, but if you put it in a txt file it should line up. No reason to hoard this info anymore. 5Sc 3Sc rarer Oct 18, 85 10-Yard Fight Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Baseball Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Clu Clu Land Yes No NA NA Duck Hunt Yes Yes 1 3 Screw Excitebike Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Golf Yes Yes 1 3 Screw Gyromite Yes Yes 9 3 Screw 8705 (5 screw, 8726 3 screw) Hogan's Alley Yes Yes 4 3 Screw Ice Climber Yes Yes 6 3 Screw (8739 3 screw) Kung Fu Yes Yes 1 3 Screw Pinball Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Stack-Up Yes No NA NA Super Mario Bro Yes Yes 2 5 Screw Tennis Yes Yes 7 3 Screw (8807 3 screw) Wild Gunman Yes Yes 6 3 Screw (8923 3 screw) Wrecking Crew Yes Yes 6 3 Screw June 86 Donkey Kong Yes Yes 8 3 screw 8622 (late 87 3 screw) Donkey Kong Jr. Yes Yes 9 3 Screw 8625 (late 87 3 screw) Donkey Kong 3 Yes Yes 6 3 Screw 8714 (8747 3 screw) Mario Bros Yes Yes 7 3 Screw 8649 (8948) Popeye Yes Yes 3 3 Screw Aug 86 Balloon Fight Yes Yes 7 3 Screw 8651 (5 screw, 8924 3 screw) Gumshoe Yes No NA NA Mach Rider Yes Yes 3 3 Screw Urban Champion Yes Yes 8 3 Screw 8720 (8947 3 screw) Oct 86 Tag Team Wrest Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Chubby Cherub Yes No NA NA M.U.S.C.L.E. Yes No NA NA Ninja Kid Yes Yes 8 3 Screw 8651 (5 screw, 8818 3 screw) Nov 86 1942 Yes Yes 4 3 Screw Commando Yes Yes 3 5 Screw Ghosts Goblins Yes Yes 4 5 Screw Karate Champ Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Dec 86 Gradius Yes Yes 5 5 Screw Feb 87 Trojan Yes Yes 3 3 Screw March 87 Pro Wrestling Yes Yes 2 3 Screw Slalom Yes Yes 6 3 Screw Volleyball Yes Yes 9 3 Screw 8709 (5 screw, 8741 3 screw) Soccer Yes Yes 10 3 Screw 8716 (5 screw, 3 ?) Donkey K Math Yes Yes 10 3 Screw 8712 (5 screw, 3 ?) April 87 Rush'n Attack Yes Yes 5 5 Screw Track & Field Yes Yes 4 5 Screw May 87 BurgerTime Yes Yes 5 5 Screw Castlevania Yes Yes 4 5 Screw Ikari Warriors Yes Yes 2 5 Screw June 87 Athletic World Yes Yes 3 5 Screw July 87 Kid Icarus Yes Yes 4 5 Screw Mighty Bomb Yes Yes 5 3 Screw Rygar Yes Yes 2 5 Screw Section-Z Yes Yes 5 3 Screw Solomon's Key Yes Yes 5 3 Screw Aug 87 Arkanoid Yes Yes 3 3 Screw Athena Yes Yes 4 3 Screw Elevator Action Yes Yes 4 5 Screw Legend of Kage Yes Yes 2 5 Screw Metroid Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8729 (5 screw) Legend of Zelda Yes Yes 6 5 Screw 8722 (5 screw ZL-0, 8742 3 screw ZL-0) Sept 87 3-D Battle Yes Yes 3 3 Screw 8731 (5 screw, 8748 3 screw) Deadly Towers Yes Yes 4 5 Screw 8730 (5 screw, 8740 3 screw) Double Dribble Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8737 (5 screw) Lode Runner Yes Yes 7 3 Screw 8729 (5 screw, 8739 3 screw) Raid on Bung. Yes Yes 4 3 Screw 8730 (5 screw, 8747 3 screw) Ring King Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8737 (5 screw) Sky Kid Yes Yes 6 3 Screw 8736 (5 screw, 8739 3 screw) Spelunker Yes Yes 5 3 Screw 8730 (5 screw, 8747 3 screw) Spy Hunter Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8734 (5 screw, 8737 3 screw) Sqoon Yes No NA NA 8733 Stadium Events Yes Yes 10 5 Screw 8737 (3 screw / 5 screw) Star Voyager Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8742 (5 screw) Stinger Yes Yes 10 3 Screw 8734 only (5 screw, 3 screw 8734) Tiger-Heli Yes Yes 6 5 Screw 8738 (5 screw, 8742 3 screw) Winter Games Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8738 (5 screw) Oct 87 Rad Racer Yes Yes 5 5 Screw 8742 (5 screw) Alpha Mission Yes Yes 7 5 Screw 8740 (5 screw / 3 screw) Lunar Pool Yes Yes 6 5 Screw 8738 (5 screw, 8739 3 screw) Mike Tyson Yes Yes 10 5 Screw ? (5 screw PT-0, 8750 3 screw PT-0) Zanac Yes Yes 4 5 Screw 8738 (5 screw / 3 screw) Nov 87 Breakthru Yes Yes 4 5 Screw 8741 (5 screw) Goonies II, The Yes Yes 8 5 Screw 8743 (5 screw, 8744 3 screw) Gotcha Yes Yes 9 5 Screw 8748 (8748 3 screw) Jaws Yes Yes 9 5 Screw (11-5-87, 3 screw ?) Kid Niki: Yes Yes 6 5 Screw 8742 (5 screw) Star Force Yes Yes 10 5 Screw 8744 (5 Screw) Super Pitfall Yes Yes 8 5 Screw 8742 (5 screw) Top Gun Yes Yes 4 5 Screw 8742 (8746 5 screw) SIDE POCKET? ? KARATE KID? 8746 Dec 87 Mega Man Yes Yes 10 5 Screw 8748 (3 screw) Wizard Warriors Yes Yes 6 5 Screw 8749 (5 screw WW-0, 8751 3 screw WW-0) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 Just looking quickly at the list, I should note that these dates arent the be all end all. My 5 screw MM1 is I think 8752 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyansas | 131 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 Which chip are these dates pulled from? Some Konami games don't have CHRs and no particular chip consistently has the latest date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 1 hour ago, wyansas said: Which chip are these dates pulled from? Some Konami games don't have CHRs and no particular chip consistently has the latest date. Always the PRG. Sometimes there is a difference within a week of PRG/CHR (like F2). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyansas | 131 Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 Track and Field II - 8952 I think Castlevania II - 8929 Castlevania II - 8916 Metal Gear - 8912 Snake's Revenge - 9011 Q*bert - 8852 Silent Service - 8935 Silent Service - 8935 Jackal - 8928 TMNT - 9024 TMNT II - 9038 TMNT II - 9037 Adventures of Bayou Billy - 8935 Skate or Die - April 89, I think Quite a few new ones to add to the list, I'll get pics later. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 (edited) Well I dont count those Konami 5 screws as 'official'. But it would be nice to have them on file and reference them to the date codes when they were first printed. Freaking bootgod is down but we can use the wayback machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20200127112840/http://bootgod.dyndns.org:7777/ For example TMNT II has its earliest date code as 9108, way earlier than what you have. BUT those date codes are printed similar to the famicom release (9044). Again leading me to believe this are 'internal' copies that somehow got out. Does the code on the PRG say NES or HVC? I'll also note your TMNT 1 has a date code of mid 90 which is about a year after the game was official released in the US AND Japan. Edited September 4, 2020 by guitarzombie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdStrongestMole | 430 Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 2 hours ago, guitarzombie said: Well I dont count those Konami 5 screws as 'official'. But it would be nice to have them on file and reference them to the date codes when they were first printed. Freaking bootgod is down but we can use the wayback machine. https://web.archive.org/web/20200127112840/http://bootgod.dyndns.org:7777/ For example TMNT II has its earliest date code as 9108, way earlier than what you have. BUT those date codes are printed similar to the famicom release (9044). Again leading me to believe this are 'internal' copies that somehow got out. Does the code on the PRG say NES or HVC? I'll also note your TMNT 1 has a date code of mid 90 which is about a year after the game was official released in the US AND Japan. I think the date code gathering was to shed more light on the konami/ultra no-back-label oddities, just so we could narrow down why this might be happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarzombie | 924 Posted September 4, 2020 Share Posted September 4, 2020 8 hours ago, 3rdStrongestMole said: I think the date code gathering was to shed more light on the konami/ultra no-back-label oddities, just so we could narrow down why this might be happening. It certainly helps. Id have to go thru it but 2 out of the 3 I checked had dates earlier than its normal production. TMNT 1 is the only one that seems strange that its about a year after its real release. Silent Service I checked and is also earlier than the US release but a week or so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormarov.45 | 32 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) So I picked up these this week and noticed some seal misprints. (It's really the gold color stencil shift error) . Edited September 18, 2020 by Stormarov.45 extra pics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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