Heritage Auctions Thread

[inasuma | 1,203]

9 hours ago, ExplodedHamster said:

Mark Haspel did not know the first thing about sealed games when WATA started up. I can assure you he was not capable of overseeing WATA even if he wanted to lol. He was brought on as a liaison to the collectibles community. 

As for a “nondenial,” he’s been public about this for years and has never hidden it. There was never going to be a denial, and in fact he literally states right there he’s been buying, submitting, and selling. I’m not saying if it’s wrong or not, but clearly HE has been under the impression it is not because he’s been 100% open. WATA should have been more clear about his role. 

Ultimately, I think this all boils down to whether it is or is not ethical for investors in a grading company to use the service. 

 

it _helps_ that mark isn't an expert on games or a day-to-day employee, but that doesn't change his association as a "chief adviser" and therefore his using of the service and selling on the open market goes against deniz's own statements. i know you covered that already in other comments but just wanted to reiterate for reiteration's sake. it also doesn't help he's effectively distancing himself from wata in his recent statement while completely ignoring the material allegations against him.

7 hours ago, doner24 said:

Why not? I invest in many companies as a share holder and use their services, or purchase their goods. 

do you actively distance yourself from those companies or contradict the president/ceo's public statements about company policy? that's honestly what is giving mark a bad look at this point. 

5 hours ago, 16BitBricks said:

This whole ordeal is gonna make a sick movie! Wolf of Wall Street meets The Big Short meets Narcos. It just needs more hookers and blow!

probably one of the few ways to get me interested in gangster movies is to make it center around games.

Jim H. is the kingpin. He sits on his throne of CGC graded comics, PCGS graded coins, and WATA graded video games. he holds all his business partners' highest graded items hostage and if they cross him, he destroys it.

 

 

Edited September 6, 2021 by inasuma

[OptOut | 8,883]

Man, some peeps be simping WATA HARD up in here, hoo-wee! 

[inasuma | 1,203]

37 minutes ago, OptOut said:

Man, some peeps be simping WATA HARD up in here, hoo-wee! 

it probably doesn't help that some folks in here have made explosive gains (cough explodedhamster cough) so i just can't imagine why they'd be giving the benefit of the doubt /s

speaking from experience, it's been crazy to witness the (raw) sealed market basically get sucked dry due to the hype (at least for the games that are remotely desirable e.g. flag ship / first party). collecting is now a nightmare, but at the same token, the games i bought last year and early this year are worth 3-4x what i paid. so yeah, i've benefited from an "investment" perspective. i still think the whole scene is a shitshow though. there's just two games i'm after at this point and i probably won't get them at even remotely affordable prices now.

[ExplodedHamster | 404]

6 hours ago, inasuma said:

it probably doesn't help that some folks in here have made explosive gains (cough explodedhamster cough) so i just can't imagine why they'd be giving the benefit of the doubt /s

speaking from experience, it's been crazy to witness the (raw) sealed market basically get sucked dry due to the hype (at least for the games that are remotely desirable e.g. flag ship / first party). collecting is now a nightmare, but at the same token, the games i bought last year and early this year are worth 3-4x what i paid. so yeah, i've benefited from an "investment" perspective. i still think the whole scene is a shitshow though. there's just two games i'm after at this point and i probably won't get them at even remotely affordable prices now.

My stance on these issues has been consistent for years, prior to any money I made on these games. As has been stated, none of this is new info and it has been discussed ad nauseam here and on NA. I think you have a harder time defending people who get up in arms about the most basic business transactions (like HA and WATA partnering), which makes it clear for many people it’s really been about the lame and played out “true collectors” and “games are for playing” garbage that has infested the community for long before WATA became a thing. The problem is it’s basically impossible to get past the noise and focus on the real issues, because people say something like “oh he’s made money, he’s a WATA shill” and I have to waste energy on that. Tbh it’s reaching the point where it’s probably a waste of time, it’s like arguing politics lol.

I also have no problem whatsoever saying I believe in video games as collectible assets, and it was something destined to occur at some point with the younger generation shifting gears on investments. I believe in capitalism (isn’t the so-called American Dream based on it?), and I’m not going to shy away from any of that. I am also an avid gamer and collector, and have been for far longer than I started buying graded WATA or VGA games. There is, and always has been, room for both.
 

Edited September 6, 2021 by ExplodedHamster

[ExplodedHamster | 404]

11 hours ago, BriGuy82 said:

When your entire business is based on your ability to be objective and impartial, my opinion is that no employee/advisor should be partaking in the service. The optics are terrible. The fact that the people at the top of the company haven't recused themselves from getting games graded tells me they care more about making a quick buck then being taken seriously by those in the hobby that aren't just speculators or investors.

Well, I certainly think part of this is fair, particularly in terms of the optics. I don’t think there was really any particular need to showcase certain people the way they did or to use titles that left any room for the imagination. 

In terms of making money, they are first and foremost a business. With collectibles going bananas and video games riding the wave, business models were going to shift more towards catering to where the money is. It’s funny, you’ve seen new grading companies in cards start up now advertising to the “affordable for true collectors” crowd, and then once they get more business they jack prices too lol. 

 

 

Edited September 6, 2021 by ExplodedHamster

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

9 hours ago, GPX said:

Grades which are way-off would be quickly noticed by the consumers, and will make them lose confidence in the grading company, with a likely negative outcome.

You mean like A++ grades that have holes all over the seal or good grades for games that have literal insects embedded in them?

[CodysGameRoom | 2,008]

1 hour ago, ExplodedHamster said:

The problem is it’s basically impossible to get past the noise and focus on the real issues, because people say something like “oh he’s made money, he’s a WATA shill” and I have to waste energy on that. Tbh it’s reaching the point where it’s probably a waste of time, it’s like arguing politics lol.

It's not difficult actually. You can be happy you became a millionaire off of this and still recognize that shitty things are going on. If you choose to turn a blind eye and ignore the mountains of evidence being brought forward, that's on you. Of course people are going to debate you. 

[The Count | 526]

10 hours ago, Alder said:

The part of Karl's video that shows the A+ Tomb Raider with tears in the seal really stuck with me. Why is nobody talking about that?

Those types of grades are enough for me to pass on WATA as an outlet to slab. The CIB grades with missing components to boot. They simply aren't reputable. 

[Tanooki | 4,932]

Well I think that Tomb Raider needs a hard look.  Because if I were paying for their services, and I had the same game, or really any game (tough TR would be most convenient) and they rated mine less.  I'd demand satisfaction.  I'd want to know why they violated their own published grading standards on said game (or any game) where that swiss cheese piece of shit gets a high 9, and I may have a game (like my Pokemon) with the seal intact, though with some bowing to the box on a side and a light edge dent and it oculd maybe rate an 8.0-8.5 range.  There's no consistency, and if there's none of that, the entire thing is a scam.  I'd demand at that rate a refund or I'd blow it out to the press, social media, ruin their asses for blatant lying, misinformation, and scamming money from people because that ultimately is what it is if that happened.  There would be no gray area that says that Tomb Raider is worth more than this...

[inasuma | 1,203]

9 hours ago, ExplodedHamster said:

The problem is it’s basically impossible to get past the noise and focus on the real issues, because people say something like “oh he’s made money, he’s a WATA shill” and I have to waste energy on that. Tbh it’s reaching the point where it’s probably a waste of time, it’s like arguing politics lol.

Heh, you're right that I shouldn't presume on your perspective. I think my main point is that, having succeeded so massively in the market (currently the biggest success story for a non-speculator), I would think you're far more likely to view the market in a positive light and put questionable ethics aside by the big players. Truthfully I'd expect that of anyone who cashed out so well. If I'm wrong do tell me to f**k off.

[Zach | 186]

17 hours ago, inasuma said:

it probably doesn't help that some folks in here have made explosive gains (cough explodedhamster cough) so i just can't imagine why they'd be giving the benefit of the doubt /s

speaking from experience, it's been crazy to witness the (raw) sealed market basically get sucked dry due to the hype (at least for the games that are remotely desirable e.g. flag ship / first party). collecting is now a nightmare, but at the same token, the games i bought last year and early this year are worth 3-4x what i paid. so yeah, i've benefited from an "investment" perspective. i still think the whole scene is a shitshow though. there's just two games i'm after at this point and i probably won't get them at even remotely affordable prices now.

That's exactly it. I feel like I've said this 100 times already but the people who STILL continue to defend WATA all have a financial stake in it one way or another. They either buy and sell graded games themselves, or they plan on selling all, or a major portion of, their collection at some point in the future. The value of games going up in general financially benefits them either way. 

[YOURTURN | 1,256]

@ExplodedHamster I just want to repeat my problem with both Wata and HA are internal.

As a collector, I have issues with CGA (AFA and VGA), CAS, UKG, and Wata. But as a paying customer, I also know that CGA, CAS, and UKG would not ask me for more money if I was to undervalue my collectible. And with Wata... I understand why they do it, but I also wish they'd let the customer regret not paying more since it is their choice. But even then I always remind myself that I am hiring the company to grade and case my collectible, and nothing more.

But also as a long-term investor, my issue with any of them is tied to the fact they have the advantage. Not in grading because "favoritism" in this field dates back to AFA's early days. And I support any that do it as a means to finance their hobby. Otherwise I'd have to treat iamratchet (a CAS advisor) for the fact he has a CAS graded item for sale on eBay for the same reason(s) some might choose to do it to either @Bronty or @jonebone.

Long story short, I agree that those working for either business should be found guilty just because they had things graded by Wata. Which is why I am focusing on those who have either started or contributed to the manipulation. 

[Ozzy_98 | 55]

Is it time for a Wata always flows downhill joke yet?

[Tanooki | 4,932]

Well if wata were made of shata then yes, it rolls down hill.

[Ozzy_98 | 55]

On 9/4/2021 at 6:35 AM, fcgamer said:

Got some sealed Sega mark stuff, maybe I should get these fuckers graded

Honestly, more stuff like that would make me more interested in sealed gaming. I don't normally follow too may sealed gaming people on instagram, cause their collections and posts all look the same to me. Not the kind of game pics I'm really interested in. And the few times it's not nintendo games, most of the time it's some rare big hitter on some other system I've seen a million other times. 

Meanwhile, when was the last time anyone ever saw a picture of a neo geo memory card  

[Zach | 186]

[LifeGame | 760]

Here is an update of some of the Goldin Auctions with 12 days left for all the shill bidders participating out there :

All these except the Sonic have 15 bids or more…all shills of course… (since its not as clear as i thought this is sarcasm)…
 

Mario 64 9.8A++ : currently at 300k$

Mario 64 VGA 95 : 85 000$

Sonic 1 : 9.4 A : 130 000$

Smb : 9.2 A : 400k$

Smb : 7.0 B+ : 48 000$

Smb : 9.2 A+ : 42 000$

Zelda 9.0 A : 80 000$ 
 

i could go on…

Edited September 7, 2021 by LifeGame

[WalterWhiteJr. | 1,162]

4 hours ago, LifeGame said:

Here is an update of some of the Goldin Auctions with 12 days left for all the shill bidders participating out there :

All these except the Sonic have 15 bids or more…all shills of course…
 

Mario 64 9.8A++ : currently at 300k$

Mario 64 VGA 95 : 85 000$

Sonic 1 : 9.4 A : 130 000$

Smb : 9.2 A : 400k$

Smb : 7.0 B+ : 48 000$

Smb : 9.2 A+ : 42 000$

Zelda 9.0 A : 80 000$ 
 

i could go

Are they "bids" or "bidders"? Do you know how easy it is for someone to create an account with a fake bank account or credit card number and just start throwing bids up? Its laughable. I have no idea if those items at Goldin are being shilled or not, but I do know that those numbers do nothing to poke holes in the disgusting Wata/HA/Jimmy H/Jeff/etc. etc. crap.

Edited September 7, 2021 by WalterWhiteJr.

[WalterWhiteJr. | 1,162]

5 hours ago, Zach said:

That's exactly it. I feel like I've said this 100 times already but the people who STILL continue to defend WATA all have a financial stake in it one way or another. They either buy and sell graded games themselves, or they plan on selling all, or a major portion of, their collection at some point in the future. The value of games going up in general financially benefits them either way. 

That is exactly right. The only people coming out to defend the indefensible are those that are heavily invested in graded games and need the market to continue being propped up or those that have already heavily profited and need the market to appear legitimate to validate them. 

 

It is kind of sad to see so many downplay ethics and transparency. 

 

Also Karl's video blew past 1M views so hurrah!

Edited September 7, 2021 by WalterWhiteJr.

[inasuma | 1,203]

3 hours ago, Zach said:

The spider man made me chuckle. Well done.  

2 hours ago, LifeGame said:

Here is an update of some of the Goldin Auctions with 12 days left for all the shill bidders participating out there :

All these except the Sonic have 15 bids or more…all shills of course…
 

Mario 64 9.8A++ : currently at 300k$

Mario 64 VGA 95 : 85 000$

Sonic 1 : 9.4 A : 130 000$

Smb : 9.2 A : 400k$

Smb : 7.0 B+ : 48 000$

Smb : 9.2 A+ : 42 000$

Zelda 9.0 A : 80 000$ 
 

i could go on…

I know the market is a huge meme right now, but let’s not leak our frustration into claims without proof, re: shill bidding.

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

6 hours ago, WalterWhiteJr. said:

 or those that have already heavily profited and need the market to appear legitimate to validate them. 

A guy that made $2MM across two auctions and has already been paid does not really need validation at this point 

[WalterWhiteJr. | 1,162]

52 minutes ago, arch_8ngel said:

A guy that made $2MM across two auctions and has already been paid does not really need validation at this point 

Yes, not necessarily referring to him though. Referring to the wata mafia on FB and IG. Though exploded does defend it all at every turn. 

Edited September 7, 2021 by WalterWhiteJr.

[LifeGame | 760]

7 hours ago, inasuma said:

The spider man made me chuckle. Well done.  

I know the market is a huge meme right now, but let’s not leak our frustration into claims without proof, re: shill bidding.

Lol you haven’t seem my previous posts, i thought my sarcasm was obvious, Im a sealed/graded games defender

[LifeGame | 760]

7 hours ago, WalterWhiteJr. said:

 

So every bid for any sealed or graded games in the whole universe is a shill bid now ?

ive had one of my best 2 weeks selling my sealed (not graded) games so your conspiracy story just won’t change anything even if you really want it to… 

Not related to you or your post but since im posting :

as for Haspel selling his games on ebay, who gives a shit about his 500$ Atari games that he is selling, you really think WATA would jeopardize their integrity by giving him preferential grading on these silly cheap ass games nobody wants !!! Come the …. on !

[Crystalis88 | 30]

29 minutes ago, LifeGame said:

So every bid for any sealed or graded games in the whole universe is a shill bid now ?

ive had one of my best 2 weeks selling my sealed (not graded) games so your conspiracy story just won’t change anything even if you really want it to… 

Not related to you or your post but since im posting :

as for Haspel selling his games on ebay, who gives a shit about his 500$ Atari games that he is selling, you really think WATA would jeopardize their integrity by giving him preferential grading on these silly cheap ass games nobody wants !!! Come the …. on !

So you believe he only graded Atari games?