Got a call from WATA about my Sealed game/ 2% surcharge/ (new to forum!)

[Gulag Joe | 582]

11 minutes ago, usmsci said:

haha I dont have a sealed Punchout but I have more games to grade including: 

Mega Man 2
Mega Man 3 (yellow stripe with no text, not sure how much rarer those are?)
Mega Man 4
Mega Man 5
Mega Man 6
Super Mario 3 (x2)
Rad Racer
Blades of Steel (Earlier version, Black Seal)
Pacman Namco
Karate Champ
Star Wars (JVC)
TMNT
TMNT 2
Superman
Life Force
Gradius

Theres more but thats some of the main ones I have. 

Sounds to me like you're gonna owe Wata $32,000

[Gulag Joe | 582]

8 minutes ago, kell said:

Agreed, that's a good point. I guess I would argue if that scenario arose, at least to a value close to the original estimated date. 

Maybe I'll send them a request for lost stock market gains (18.6%) on the my money they've had for over five months. 

Good point to bring up about the market. This current practice is a sure fire way to end up getting regulated sooner than later.

[Bearcat-Doug | 5,104]

I wonder if anyone has had to consign their games directly to Heritage because they couldn't afford the grading fees? I think the $660k SMB was found in a desk drawer or something, so there's no guarantee the person submitting a game like that could afford a 2% grading fee.

[usmsci | 34]

22 minutes ago, avoin said:

Just to clarify I was making a joke from the most recent wata appearance on pawn stars ha, with the way the Mario markets shaking up I could probably afford a 1.5 cib last production. Wild stuff. 
 

pretty solid list though been recently going through my stuff and sending it off. 

I also have various other non-games items sealed. I have about 5 or 6 Sealed M.U.S.C.L.E men garbage cans, about 5 or 6 of the hangtab versions sealed, a whole box of 15th Series Garbage Pail kids, every package sealed (gum and all). Those arent going to go for astronomical numbers but I've been thinking about parting with them.

Edited April 14, 2021 by usmsci

[avoin | 24]

7 minutes ago, usmsci said:

I also have various other non-games items sealed. I have about 5 or 6 Sealed M.U.S.C.L.E men garbage cans, about 5 or 6 of the hangtab versions sealed, a whole box of 15th Series Garbage Pail kids, every package sealed (gum and all). Those arent going to go for astronomical numbers but I've been thinking about parting with them.

now is probably the time for the garbage pail heard those are getting a big jump lately.

[16BitBricks | 59]

46 minutes ago, Gulag Joe said:

Even if it's a good problem to have, I already paid for these games to be graded a year ago at the values they were back then. This sudden surge in prices, and the massive delay in grading my order, should not mean that I have to suddenly pay Wata thousands of more dollars on top of the money I already paid them. This has me concerned.

Exactly! I get that they say you have to pay a 2% fee if the value is over $1,000. It should be based on the value the day you submit, not when they decide to get around to grading it (6 months past when it should have been). If it is for insurance purposes, how many games actually get lost and or damaged that the premiums are that high? I like what WATA was trying to accomplish and their product. Some of this stuff just seems shady and I really don’t like these manipulative auction prices based on weird nonsense.

Edited April 14, 2021 by 16BitBricks

[GPX | 1,369]

Here’s what I’m seeing from a vantage point of a potential WATA customer and/or HA:

- too many shonky bids in the realms of >$50,000 items, without any particular rhyme or reason.

- particularly when there are no population reports, and with some games (eg. sealed Pokemon) you can guess there’s more than meets the eye, what is the justification to just pump out $80,000 or more for games where previous recent years sold for a much smaller fraction? (20-50 times less)

- hype and advertising on the “rise of game prices” without any articles questioning on how legit they are, just take all end prices on HA as gospel. Who are the end bidders? Has there been any cancellations of a purchase?

- due to “increased market value”, there’s now a pressure to raise the insurance premium and assume potential customers to follow suit and pay an added cost. Here’s the million dollar question: what happens if the market crashes next 6 months, once I receive back my graded submission? Will I get some refund?

 

 

[Code Monkey | 2,005]

No problem. Ask them for their Fed-Ex account number and transfer Fed-Ex the money directly. I mean......Wata isn't profiting from the insurance assessment are they?

[kell | 102]

It may be for business liability insurance as well what is insured in the physical building. For example, what if an employee drops a 9.6 SMB...?

Anyone received a call/reduced fees for an overvalued game? I'm guessing the answer is no.

Edited April 14, 2021 by kell

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

3 minutes ago, Code Monkey said:

No problem. Ask them for their Fed-Ex account number and transfer Fed-Ex the money directly. I mean......Wata isn't profiting from the insurance assessment are they?

Most businesses apply a markup to any 3rd party service or product they provide. 

(and Kell makes the good point that WATA is probably using the excuse of paying for their own liability coverage as well -- though seems like an odd way to handle that)

But I highly doubt that WATA is using rigorous accounting methods to determine a legitimate/justifiable markup in this case

Edited April 14, 2021 by arch_8ngel

[MrWunderful | 2,926]

I think its a combo of charging extra just for the hassle/risk of dealing with very high dollar items, and the fact that they under priced themselves in a market they created. 
 

I mean, grading a copy of hangtab mario is the exact same as any other sealed nes game. 
 

We add “hassle” costs in construction all the time. The code word can be “means and methods” lol

[TheBiRD | 137]

2 hours ago, usmsci said:

I also have various other non-games items sealed. I have about 5 or 6 Sealed M.U.S.C.L.E men garbage cans, about 5 or 6 of the hangtab versions sealed, a whole box of 15th Series Garbage Pail kids, every package sealed (gum and all). Those arent going to go for astronomical numbers but I've been thinking about parting with them.

I've a 80+ vga M.U.S.C.L.E... I guess I'd get a call telling me they evaluate the value higher then me.. no idea the value of it these day!!

[avoin | 24]

47 minutes ago, TheBiRD said:

I've a 80+ vga M.U.S.C.L.E... I guess I'd get a call telling me they evaluate the value higher then me.. no idea the value of it these day!!

Somewhere between a cup of coffee and a yacht.

 

Spin the wheel of prices with us!

[GPX | 1,369]

This is actually interesting, how would you evaluate a game sent for grading, where you’d expect the market value to rise, but no recent precedent of graded-game that has been sold on eBay/HA?

What metric of evaluation would you then use?

[YOURTURN | 1,256]

24 minutes ago, GPX said:

This is actually interesting, how would you evaluate a game sent for grading, where you’d expect the market value to rise, but no recent precedent of graded-game that has been sold on eBay/HA?

What metric of evaluation would you then use?

Good question. I looked up what both VGA and CAS had to say. And both say that the cost is based on what the person who submitted the product thinks it is worth. With the only difference is that CAS also suggests adding cost of expenses tied to it being graded, while both agree the value should be post-grading.

Which has me feel like them doing that is a good service. Just not with their follow-up. Because it's like somebody being promised a chance to meet Ryan Reynolds, only later be told they have to pay to not be in Green Lantern.

[OptOut | 8,881]

As I said before, the "insurance liability" argument is BULL!

Insurance will pay out at the declared value of the item or lower, they aren't going to be going out of their way to inform claimants that their items are worth tens of thousands of dollars more than they declared!

WATA just wants to bilk as much money out of people as possible, and with the dollar signs in people's eyes at the moment they will blindly pay.

[tidaldreams | 654]

7 hours ago, usmsci said:

Actually that episode on pawn stars - he didnt give him a value. I believe for that game there was "no ceiling". Based on the SMB that sold for $660K which was a later run that the one on pawn stars (I think), the $1 Million that guy was asking probably isnt too far off considering its the only one sealed with that variant at near perfect condition. 

Also, Pawn Stars is scripted for the most part so all the people that are on there are for the show to make money and the sellers to get visibility. So take that for what it's worth. 

But he was asking for that price in... wait for it.... 2019! Covid wasn't even a thing back then. Now he might've upped it $10 million for all we know.

[Joyomofrobro | 207]

I know what you mean, I got a carving of some sort of monkeys in the Good Will Store. It had no price on it they let me have it for 50 cents Canadian. I'm afraid to get an evaluation on it because of any charges from a percentage of its worth. I think I could have something on my hands here of real high value if I'm lucky. Its over 300 years old that's all I found out. If its a million dollars they would make me sell to pay probably and its not for sale just want to find out its worth for curiosity!

[Dumars2001 | 164]

14 hours ago, jonebone said:

It sucks but Mario is legit worth a ton of money now. An oval seal 9.4 A sold for 150k this week. I've never crossed mine because I was worried about the declared value nonsense... and that was when the game was in 20k range.  At this point I'd pay more in grading than I originally did to buy it as a VGA copy. Mario market is crazy right now.

Wow! Every print of a sealed Super Mario Bros is on absolute fire these days!!

[OptOut | 8,881]

9 minutes ago, Dumars2001 said:

Wow! Every print of a sealed Super Mario Bros is on absolute fire these days!!

Live feed of @Dumars2001 right now:

[Dumars2001 | 164]

1 minute ago, OptOut said:

Live feed of @Dumars2001 right now:

Ha! Oh yeah, I always wanted to buy a Ferrari!!

[usmsci | 34]

20 hours ago, jonebone said:

It sucks but Mario is legit worth a ton of money now. An oval seal 9.4 A sold for 150k this week. I've never crossed mine because I was worried about the declared value nonsense... and that was when the game was in 20k range.  At this point I'd pay more in grading than I originally did to buy it as a VGA copy. Mario market is crazy right now.

 

That particular one that sold is almost the same grade as mine but 3 production runs newer. I am at a loss of what to set for mine now as a Buy It Now or reserve. 

[RH | 4,895]

20 hours ago, RH said:

I think it's highway robbery, IMHO.  A deal is a deal, so I think you owe it but I'd tell them to ship it back and give me a full refund. My personal $0.02.

I know, OP, you mentioned they only had your game for three months, but I think it's highway robbery because a lot can change in pricing in 3 months, or longer, depending on the tier you submit too.  It's not your fault if you submit a game that last went for $2,000 as a raw sealed item, and then some nut on HA buys a game, graded lower than yours for $30,000 within the 3-6 months they hold this.

To make this fair, they need to retroactively determine a reasonable price for a game.   At this point, they should be able to estimate it at time of purchase.  Even estimating a value that might be higher than the final value once the game is received is better than what they've done.

I can understand why they would want a certain % for insurance purposes, especially if they are going to ship an item that's plausibly worth $25,000-100,000.  However, there are ways they can restructure there terms or give buyers options other than re-appraising them at time to ship out and then charging them for more.

I'm willing to bet that WATA does not pay shipping insurance to the shipper.  Instead, they pocket the 2% and they book it in accounting as holding money in the case that packages are lost or damaged.  I don't blame them for that because with the volume they receive, they can make their own insurance.  I just have an issue with the way they structure the process.  We all know that Mario/Pokemon is going nuts and waiting many months to finally have a game graded and shipped can make a difference of thousands of dollars. 

If you happen to have a lucky, expensive item there's a chance you might not have the cash to cover the extra fees.  That's why I think it's important for them to just front-load the price, appraise upon immediate receipt of the game, and if the customer declared a value way off at that point, you determine whether to charge them more, or ship it back.

[fcgamer | 4,719]

On 4/15/2021 at 4:20 PM, Joyomofrobro said:

I know what you mean, I got a carving of some sort of monkeys in the Good Will Store. It had no price on it they let me have it for 50 cents Canadian. I'm afraid to get an evaluation on it because of any charges from a percentage of its worth. I think I could have something on my hands here of real high value if I'm lucky. Its over 300 years old that's all I found out. If its a million dollars they would make me sell to pay probably and its not for sale just want to find out its worth for curiosity!

I'm wearing something like that around my neck as we speak, though mine has a dragon on it. I paid $15 for it at a night market near @OptOut , and likely overpaid

[GPX | 1,369]

An added thought..

The OP states WATA contacted 3 sources for an estimation of the value of the Mario game. If they have significant knowledge, and linked with WATA, they’re more than likely to have some spare juicy sealed games in their drawers/shelves. So a hypothetical possibility, is that there might be bias in their estimation to boost the market values and therefore the values of the games they have. Particularly when the estimations are seemingly based on the end prices of HA sales. It’s a bit of a loophole going on it seems.