Prestige Collections

[koko | 65]

I'm assuming the OP is talking about collections that have been named because of the number of sealed games they contain i.e. Indiana, Hawaii, Atwood etc. They talk about these collections in this article

https://www.watagames.com/learn/blog/post/the-atwood-collection/

Wata seemed to even name the collection the sealed, slabbed games came from in their grading.

Edited December 2, 2020 by koko

[Hammerfestus | 3,836]

Before Atwood made his grand entrance no one had any idea he was sitting on a case of SE or any of the other stuff he has.  Except maybe Minusworlds.  Don’t know what that dude knows or knew or whatever.  Point being, I’d avoid making those assumptions.

[Gulag Joe | 582]

SE is an example of game that didn't have demand. World Class Track Meet was not a game people lined up to get. This point circles back to my original question- which is prestigious collections containing cases of games that were in high demand. Even if some do have cases of circle seal Zelda- 6-12 sealed games isn't very many games for a hobby that could potentially have a collector base of over a million people within the next 10 years. Video game collecting has always been a niche hobby with a small collecting base. Its exploded over the last 2 years. The thought of video game grading 8 years ago was not well received within the community. Now there are 2 companies, and one of them is on TV and in the news often. Get your Non Rev-A Double Dribble carts now while they're still under $10!

[fcgamer | 4,723]

I wouldn't trust any popular reports coming out of Wata, similarly the new folks coming into the market are investors primarily, not collectors, and there's not a lot of overlap imo.

The stuff they care about is not going to entirely be the same games we care about.

[O.G. CIB | 415]

20 minutes ago, Gulag Joe said:

SE is an example of game that didn't have demand. World Class Track Meet was not a game people lined up to get. This point circles back to my original question- which is prestigious collections containing cases of games that were in high demand. Even if some do have cases of circle seal Zelda- 6-12 sealed games isn't very many games for a hobby that could potentially have a collector base of over a million people within the next 10 years. Video game collecting has always been a niche hobby with a small collecting base. Its exploded over the last 2 years. The thought of video game grading 8 years ago was not well received within the community. Now there are 2 companies, and one of them is on TV and in the news often. Get your Non Rev-A Double Dribble carts now while they're still under $10!

More than you anticipate or even know.... the people who really have the stuff don’t post regularly in Facebook groups nor on Instagram nor hang out on forums on a regular basis. 
 

What changed? WATA? Do you really think WATA has over 1,000 regular clients at this point? It’s maybe 100-200 people pushing these prices that trickled over from comics trying to jump in early. WATA/Hertiage partnership maybe made sealed games take off but barley has made collecting games desirable. That’s years and years of gaming moving into the main stream. I would venture to say more people got into gaming with the pandemic and not grading games.
 

I use to say for years games were under valued as a collectible but herd mentality and good marketing made a bunch of people want to collect graded games. The ones who made a boat load money off the boom in grading are the ones who help orchestrate and market it. Make no mistake about it if you’ve been around long enough it’s easy to see what happen. 

 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Mr. CIB

[Gulag Joe | 582]

3 hours ago, Amermoe said:

Like the "Left Bros" Super Mario 3 that just sold for $156k or the 2nd print PS2 God of War that sold for $3k, or yet the Atari 2600 Spiderman that sold for a record $9k? I think your above statement couldn't be further from the truth.

Long-time collectors do have an idea of what's out there, what's common, what's not and what's desirable. New collectors entering the hobby have no clue what they're doing and are propping up the market to unprecedented highs. Of all the records broken since the last 2 years, only a handful of games are truly rare, and merit their record prices. The sticker sealed Super Mario that went for $100k, and the Dr. Wright Mega Man that went for ~$84k, come to mind. 

Like someone else said, the true grail pieces are locked up, mostly in VGA cases, and long-time collectors are not selling. Mostly because they're collectors first, and not investors or speculators. 

If you're looking to sell, you should do it sooner than later, before prices start to correct after speculators start to realize how much of this stuff is out there. I do think prices will continue to rise in the short term, but the long term future isn't up.

I disagree with almost all of that, considering I've been watching my collection closely for nearly 2 decades and see maybe one or two games a year surface. Sure, there are a lot of Left Bros out there, but how many are sealed and in 9.2 or better condition?

[O.G. CIB | 415]

4 minutes ago, Mr. CIB said:

 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Mr. CIB

[Californication | 1,477]

 

1 hour ago, Gulag Joe said:

I disagree with almost all of that, considering I've been watching my collection closely for nearly 2 decades and see maybe one or two games a year surface. Sure, there are a lot of Left Bros out there, but how many are sealed and in 9.2 or better condition?

I think there is someone trying to sell one one here. You should pick it up.

Edited December 2, 2020 by Californication

[RpgCollector | 900]

I am picking my own collection name as stated in another thread. My 8,000 CIB game collection is “That Assholes Collection”  Once again, every last game has been rubbed on my genitals (some more than once!) It is the trade mark of my collection. Now to share the news with Wata!

[Dr. Morbis | 2,088]

2 hours ago, Gulag Joe said:

I disagree with almost all of that, considering I've been watching my collection closely for nearly 2 decades and see maybe one or two games a year surface. Sure, there are a lot of Left Bros out there, but how many are sealed and in 9.2 or better condition?

You've been collecting for 2 decades?  I've never seen you before, and your profile says you joined a couple of months ago.  Now, this part is a stretch, but imagine if you were not the only person alive who had amassed a ton of video games over the decades but didn't have much of an online presence...

[PII | 1,884]

Ain't like it were but it do.  Ah tojas it were a bad ideer to let a AI loose in da Matrix...

[Amermoe | 150]

2 hours ago, Gulag Joe said:

I disagree with almost all of that, considering I've been watching my collection closely for nearly 2 decades and see maybe one or two games a year surface. Sure, there are a lot of Left Bros out there, but how many are sealed and in 9.2 or better condition?

Perhaps then you need to be more specific with your question. If you're asking how many "Key" titles among the NES library exist in sealed mint condition, compared to say the number of CIB copies, then the answer is not a whole lot but it's much more than what people are seeing. It obviously depends on which title and the print, whether it was a first, second, or third printing. And by "Key" I assume you mean popular titles. Are there cases available of popular titles? The answer is yes. Is there photo evidence available? Yes. Were there cases available 10 years ago, that were opened and graded by VGA? Yes. Are there collectors that keep their hobby private, don't offer their games for sale, and don't show off their collections to the world? YES.

If you're asking the same question for SNES/Genesis/PS1, then the answer is similar. PS1 specifically, I am very familiar with, and sealed product for most tiles, popular or unpopular exists in the thousands (with few exceptions).

The bigger question is what is the demand vs. the current supply, and how long will that demand extend into the future. Collectibles as a whole are experiencing an unprecedented level of boom. It's not just video games, everything is inflated, sports cards, MTG, Pokémon, even comics and coins. I'd be careful about drawing conclusions from current market trends and applying it as an indicator of future direction. Volatility is extremely high due to the pandemic and current world economy. At some point the market is bound to correct. The only problem is nobody knows when.

Edited December 2, 2020 by Amermoe

[Gloves | 11,776]

I have a small but growing collection of copies of The Prestige on DVD. 

[ThePhleo | 2,184]

It’s foolish to believe there aren’t more Tim Atwood’s out there when people like Dov/Dovaleh exist. Dude regularly found pallets upon pallets upon WAREHOUSES full of sealed NES games.

...

If there are a pair of surviving ROB M1 series displays, I promise that there are more Tim Atwood’s and Dov’s.

I also remember seeing a VGA 80+ sticker sealed SMB somewhere, but I completely lost the photo. Anyone have a picture of it?

[Gulag Joe | 582]

6 hours ago, Dr. Morbis said:

You've been collecting for 2 decades?  I've never seen you before, and your profile says you joined a couple of months ago.  Now, this part is a stretch, but imagine if you were not the only person alive who had amassed a ton of video games over the decades but didn't have much of an online presence...

"More than you anticipate or even know.... the people who really have the stuff don’t post regularly in Facebook groups nor on Instagram nor hang out on forums on a regular basis."

And then sealed video games suddenly started selling for 6 figures.

[Gulag Joe | 582]

Some of these speculative replies are merely that- speculation. Are there cases of popular titles? Of course, but using that speculation as an end result to conclude its stupid for people to spend 6 figures on a certain title is arrogant. There are also cases upon cases of 1986 fleer basketball out there that have still yet to be opened. If those surface and get broke open, does that mean Michael Jordan's rookie card will become worthless? No. Back in the 80s the Mickey Mantle rookie card was a few thousand dollars. A guy known as Mr. Mint had a "warehouse find" of close to 50 mint condition Mickey Mantle rookies. Did that make the value go down? Nope- it actually did the exact opposite. The media attention attracted troves of new collectors to the hobby. Many of you are under-speculating the amount of interest in video game collecting.

[tbone3969 | 304]

5 minutes ago, Gulag Joe said:

Some of these speculative replies are merely that- speculation. Are there cases of popular titles? Of course, but using that speculation as an end result to conclude its stupid for people to spend 6 figures on a certain title is arrogant. There are also cases upon cases of 1986 fleer basketball out there that have still yet to be opened. If those surface and get broke open, does that mean Michael Jordan's rookie card will become worthless? No. Back in the 80s the Mickey Mantle rookie card was a few thousand dollars. A guy known as Mr. Mint had a "warehouse find" of close to 50 mint condition Mickey Mantle rookies. Did that make the value go down? Nope- it actually did the exact opposite. The media attention attracted troves of new collectors to the hobby. Many of you are under-speculating the amount of interest in video game collecting.

So it seems like you have your mind made up already so why even start this thread?  It seems like your itching to sell but yet make an argument that you shouldn't as these will only go up b/c no collectors are sitting on cases of sealed games....  I'm confused.

[RegularGuyGamer | 2,012]

54 minutes ago, Gulag Joe said:

Many of you are under-speculating the amount of interest in video game collecting.

Will prices go up? Dunno. Will prices go down? Dunno?

I do know that prices are as high as they've ever been. So judging solely on the current market value its a good the best time to sell.

Also, is a time value of money situation. Let's say we're not at the peak, but the peak isn't much more expensive than the current prices, say 5-10% across the board. Is it worth waiting another couple decades to take the cow to market or better to take the cash now knowing that you sold at the best time historically. 

I honestly don't see the dilemma especially if you bought these games with the sole intent of making a profit. Until they're sold, you haven't made a profit. Get em sold and cash out or enjoy them on the shelf like the rest of us. You need to do one. You can't have both...

Edited December 2, 2020 by RegularGuyGamer

[RH | 4,903]

2 hours ago, RegularGuyGamer said:

Will prices go up? Dunno. Will prices go down? Dunno?

I do know that prices are as high as they've ever been. So judging solely on the current market value its a good the best time to sell.

Also, is a time value of money situation. Let's say we're not at the peak, but the peak isn't much more expensive than the current prices, say 5-10% across the board. Is it worth waiting another couple decades to take the cow to market or better to take the cash now knowing that you sold at the best time historically. 

I honestly don't see the dilemma especially if you bought these games with the sole intent of making a profit. Until they're sold, you haven't made a profit. Get em sold and cash out or enjoy them on the shelf like the rest of us. You need to do one. You can't have both...

This is why I personally have to walk a balance. I never got into this hobby to make money, but I certainly don't mind looking for deals and speculating.  That may sound contradictory, but in practice, this means I only buy stuff I have at least some passing interest in (unless it's a really rare game I know is worth a bit of money, and someone want's 10% the value of it) and some of that stuff I have a minor interest in, I either don't mind holding in my collection perpetually or, if it spikes in value then great!  I'll either leverage it for a trade for stuff I desire much more, or I'll go on a sell-off bender so I can buy Christmas gifts for my wife!

I think anyone who gets into any collecting market for investing isn't investing correctly.  I'm sorry, that may sound harsh and there is definitely money to be made, especially if you're smart, but if you want to invest than with solid research, there are so many other avenues of investment that you can get into that have less risk and greater pay off.

Who knows what tomorrow will look like.  I think the big-money will slowly seep into the lower valued stuff. The CIBs and such will increase, but you never know when that peak in value will happen.  My gut is that prices will continue to trend up until we have a real recession.  Granted, we kind of are coming out of a small one, but when people got COVID bucks and were locked up in their homes, they really seemed to move towards video games plus all the hype from these 6-figure sales has piqued peoples interest, so this recession only helped the prices, it didn't suppress them.  In another 2-5 years, if we have a recession, I think we'll see a "crash". 

Overall, I think the trend is going to be up, even after a crash (or should I call it, a major correction) but yes, I think we are due for a correction.  I think the only thing that will tip that scale will be a mass contraction of workers and funds, and people still needing to be mobile in society, without free money coming from the government.

Edited December 2, 2020 by RH

[Estil | 1,264]

19 hours ago, Gulag Joe said:

Pardon me for not using the word pedigree. I take it the answer to my question is likely no. No key games, just a bunch of random "rArE" games that need a power pad to play.

You know, when I was much younger I thought a "pedigree" was like a "degree" that dogs get for graduating obedience school!!  

[Hammerfestus | 3,836]

Uh huh huh.  “Key titles”. I wonder where he got that terminology from Beavis.

[SilverspoonGaming | 332]

The definition of a prestigious gaming collection just got filed away with the day that the bubble will burst on the hobby in my brain.

[GPX | 1,369]

On 12/2/2020 at 11:29 PM, Gulag Joe said:

"More than you anticipate or even know.... the people who really have the stuff don’t post regularly in Facebook groups nor on Instagram nor hang out on forums on a regular basis."

And then sealed video games suddenly started selling for 6 figures.

I think you’re making one big massive assumption here. You are associating the 6 figures rise in games and the increased demand among “collectors”. What it’s more likely is from the increased attention with a few speculators/market manipulators going bananas over each other, trying to raise the profile of video games. Granted, I’m also making an assumption but from these 2 main general observations:

1. Games have been gaining traction for the past 10-15 years in the collecting realm, with the popularity increasing yearly. From all past observations, prices previously increased 2-3 times whenever there is a boom. What we’re seeing at the moment, is a 20-30 times jump overnight. “Collectors” don’t normally involve in these kind of patterns since...ever.

2. If so many “collectors” are jumping in to bid on high end games, why are so many veteran collectors on this particular forum having a neutral or negative stance about the current prices (particularly the more common games going to 5-to-6-figures or above)?

 

[Gulag Joe | 582]

3 hours ago, GPX said:

I think you’re making one big massive assumption here. You are associating the 6 figures rise in games and the increased demand among “collectors”. What it’s more likely is from the increased attention with a few speculators/market manipulators going bananas over each other, trying to raise the profile of video games. Granted, I’m also making an assumption but from these 2 main general observations:

1. Games have been gaining traction for the past 10-15 years in the collecting realm, with the popularity increasing yearly. From all past observations, prices previously increased 2-3 times whenever there is a boom. What we’re seeing at the moment, is a 20-30 times jump overnight. “Collectors” don’t normally involve in these kind of patterns since...ever.

2. If so many “collectors” are jumping in to bid on high end games, why are so many veteran collectors on this particular forum having a neutral or negative stance about the current prices (particularly the more common games going to 5-to-6-figures or above)?

 

I want it to be clear that I believe this rise in price is attributed to a mass influx in new collectors entering the market coupled with deep pocketed new speculators  with disposable income entering the market as a result of the media attention this hobby has been getting.

PS5 has a digital console. The future of games will live in a cloud and there will be no physical copies. A certain nostalgia in gaming will be lost. Some people are recognizing this. The other part is some of these people know the scarcity of some of these vintage factory sealed games in mint condition. 2020!

[RegularGuyGamer | 2,012]

22 minutes ago, Gulag Joe said:

PS5 has a digital console. The future of games will live in a cloud and there will be no physical copies. A certain nostalgia in gaming will be lost. Some people are recognizing this. The other part is some of these people know the scarcity of some of these vintage factory sealed games in mint condition. 2020!

Man this is just not an conjecture based on evidence. The Switch and PS4 have had more physical support than possibly any console before them. The idea that all games will be digital is being blind to what is actually happening in the gaming world. To assume that would stop bc a disc drive when away is ludacris. It doesn't support the trend in the market that is MORE physical media not less.

Sony and Microsoft making digital only consoles are catering to their bottom line, not a trend in gamer's preferences. To suggest otherwise shows the disconnect from the current market. Which is probably the same thought people have who are paying 100k for a Mario game. 

Nintendo literally just sold an empty box and a fake FE cart for $50 for a $6 game on the VC that sold out instantly. Not only is physical media desirable, it's desirability is at an all time high. See LRG, SRG, iam8bit.