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Has the N64 aged worse than the NES?


Nintegageo

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I have the UltraHDMI mod, it's entirely worth it to have the system finally work properly on a HDTV without having weird AA issues, light and shadow in games being broken, and other screwball garbage.  I got my day one console chopped for it, wasn't entirely comfortable with the thought, but now that it's done, it's amazing.

That said though, it still even there shows the system hasn't aged as well as HD is more clear than SD, yet having that boost helps the games be a bit nicer, crisper, cleaner, clearer too so it's a trade off.  But I mean that is just like if you got one of those flashback HD boxes for 2600, they're still 2600 games and now are sharper and more obvious are the faults too.

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Agreed. I have played 007 and super smash bros recently. Both are really bad when compared to the newer versions of those games, whereas stuff like super Mario Bros 3, Zelda, and mega man on the NES still hold up today and are still better than some of the newer versions. Ever OOT is better on the 3DS and GameCube. Star fox 64 is also better on the 3DS. As others have said, the N64's controller certainly doesn't help it. 

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On 11/29/2020 at 8:56 AM, LeatherRebel5150 said:

What does being newer or better technology have to do with it? Kids back in the day were lucky to have a computer at all let alone something that would play games like your talking about. Also since when has the latest and greatest ever been the most favored thing? The SMS was more technologically advanced then the NES, but it sold like crap, the Atari Lynx and Game Gear way more advanced then the Gameboy, they sold like crap. People generally don't care that there are better technologies out there as long as what they do have is fun. This is just a PC master race argument, and the kinda thing that actually pushed me away from playing on PC

By the time the N64 came out, plenty of people had computers in their homes.  Sure, individual kids would be lucky to have their own, but seeing as the release of Windows 95 greatly inspired people who'd never owned a computer before to run out and pick one up, I'd have been hard pressed to name more than a literal handful of people in my high school who didn't have a computer in their home.  And no, my parents weren't wealthy and I didn't attend a school in a wealthy area--quite the opposite.  If people have fun, sure, more power to them, but the N64 really prided itself on being a 3D game machine, which it was already outshone on by PCs of the day.

This isn't at all a "PC master race" argument, and trying to label it as such to discount the points made is either not understanding what's been said or not being able to stand up against the argument.  I love my NES and to lesser degrees my SNES, Genesis, 2600, etc., but have never had really any love to give to the N64 since its tech was outdated when it launched (in general, not necessarily in the console market) and its controller made it absolutely abysmal for anyone who wasn't into it to try to change that.  If this were all about PCs above consoles, I'd be in every debate talking about how PCs always whipped the snot out of consoles (which is true off and on through the years, starting back with the Apple ][ and proceeding forward).  But I'm clearly not.  As for SMS versus NES, I like the SMS and what it's capable of, but it lost out software-wise in a big way.  Unfortunately for the N64, it lost out to PCs of the general era (not necessarily brand new when the N64 was) on both the software and technology fronts.  If you loved it, good for you, but I still don't get all the love for it (beyond the power of nostalgia) and probably never will.

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The only reason to 'love' the N64 was due to the games, nothing more or less, given that Nintendo prided themselves in their work and third second party partners which kept a good number of titles stuck and still stuck on the hardware outside of illicit ways.  Third parties to a point are lumped in there too with only more recent years cracking that old egg such as Doom 64, the couple of Turok games, etc.  It had little to do with the hardware, a lot to do with the games, and yes even the controller that suited quite a few of them exceptionally well.  (I so tire of the mindless unfounded bitching about the controller as it did what it was designed to very well keeping in mind Sony didn't even bother until later with sticks at all, let alone the pair on the late coming dual shock.)

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Oh mah God, this thread is STILL going?

You guys need to play some damn N64 if you know what's good for ya, seriously!

Play Blast Corps. Great game, amazing fun! Easily as good as most of the good NES games. Winback is a great game too, loads of fun, you gonna have a great time! You can play a bit of Worms Armageddon, yeah, it'll be sweet! And you can play some Turok 2 or 3, or even rage wars! Very good games right there!

I would definitely recommend playing a bit of space station silicon valley, some Rocket Robot on Wheels, and even Gex 3 Deep Cover Geko, fantastic games!

You could play some Diddy Kong Racing, of course but why not a bit of Jet Force Gemini? Play some Shadowman, sure, grand old time. I mean, tetrisphere is always fun on the side... Actually it's pretty damn sweet!

I like to play tonic trouble sometimes, because it's really good, and I like Quake and Doom 64, and Duke Nukem 64 and Zero Hour are all good times to have. I think the N64 is neat.

But no, maybe you guys are right, maybe the graphics are teh suck... Shame. For shame. I probably only like N64 because I hate myself or something is deeply wrong with me.

I could muster a stronger rebuttal, depending on how seriously longer this thread trundles on! I guess it doesn't matter if other people agree with me that the N64 is good, but it sure feels like a shame that so many other people haven't experienced the same joy from the system as I have!

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16 hours ago, Makar said:

Agreed. I have played 007 and super smash bros recently. Both are really bad when compared to the newer versions of those games...

If only Smash Bros 64 (hey what else are you going to retroactively call it?) had thought of doing trophies back then...it would've made for a neat tech demo/history of Nintendo sort of deal like Melee was.  But for both of those games I don't reckon there's much to offer for a single player only sort of deal right?

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I love both systems. BUT

The NES has aged so much better than the N64. To explain what i mean by aged, i just mean to this day NES games are still incredibly fun, easy to pick up and play, and look just fine because of their 2D nature. 

The N64 has so many things about it that just aged badly, especially after being spoiled with modern gaming. To be fair this isn't the N64's fault, for the time it was pretty amazing IMO and was pretty ambitious. But the beginning of 3D games was just an awkward era, especially for the N64.

-Terrible camera systems 
-Horrible fog in most games
-Movement and controls were awkward in a lot of games
-Contoller was awkward
-And it just overall doesn't look too great

You didn't have to really worry about fog, muddy graphics, and terrible camera systems in 2D games. So it honestly isn't too fair of a fight. But if they are in the ring, the NES aged far better, hands down. 

Side note: I think the SNES will go down as possibly the best aged system ever made.

 

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3 hours ago, OptOut said:

Oh mah God, this thread is STILL going?

You guys need to play some damn N64 if you know what's good for ya, seriously!

Play Blast Corps. Great game, amazing fun! Easily as good as most of the good NES games. Winback is a great game too, loads of fun, you gonna have a great time! You can play a bit of Worms Armageddon, yeah, it'll be sweet! And you can play some Turok 2 or 3, or even rage wars! Very good games right there!

I would definitely recommend playing a bit of space station silicon valley, some Rocket Robot on Wheels, and even Gex 3 Deep Cover Geko, fantastic games!

You could play some Diddy Kong Racing, of course but why not a bit of Jet Force Gemini? Play some Shadowman, sure, grand old time. I mean, tetrisphere is always fun on the side... Actually it's pretty damn sweet!

I like to play tonic trouble sometimes, because it's really good, and I like Quake and Doom 64, and Duke Nukem 64 and Zero Hour are all good times to have. I think the N64 is neat.

But no, maybe you guys are right, maybe the graphics are teh suck... Shame. For shame. I probably only like N64 because I hate myself or something is deeply wrong with me.

I could muster a stronger rebuttal, depending on how seriously longer this thread trundles on! I guess it doesn't matter if other people agree with me that the N64 is good, but it sure feels like a shame that so many other people haven't experienced the same joy from the system as I have!

Sorry opty, didn't mean to rain on your parade. The N64 isn't necessarily bad, there's just other stuff I'd rather play. I think it's time you make a hidden N64 gems thread. Get us all excited for the system again

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3 hours ago, Estil said:

If only Smash Bros 64 (hey what else are you going to retroactively call it?) had thought of doing trophies back then...it would've made for a neat tech demo/history of Nintendo sort of deal like Melee was.  But for both of those games I don't reckon there's much to offer for a single player only sort of deal right?

Yea that would've been cool. The trophy system and different modes in melee and the tournament mode were all really cool and a big step up from smash 64. The first smash you could play through the campaign a bunch but that's about it. As for 007, I'm not sure. I haven't touched the campaign in like 20 years

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I think the NES games have aged wonderfully. They are still as much fun as they were all those years ago. I even still enjoy the graphics, the colors, spritework, music, etc. Also the challenge in many of the games is great. 

the N64 aged terribly in my view. I had both consoles back in the day, so I don’t consider myself biased. It’s just that the games are slow, feel empty and the controls and camera systems are absolutely terrible. I was playing Mario 64 on the 3D All Stars Collection the other day and even though it’s a nice game in many ways, I stopped playing because it become way too frustrating. Also the graphics are just off putting for me. I see the N64 and PS1 as the Atari of their days. Both were pretty fun when they were current and better alternatives were not available yet, but they were not great, and were not advanced enough to age well. 

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2 hours ago, Maartenvdz said:

It’s just that the games are slow, feel empty and the controls and camera systems are absolutely terrible.

Man, I forgot about this issue.  Coming from the NES and SNES, I was used to dealing with enemies in games like every couple of seconds; you were always on your toes!  But the first time I played Mario 64 I was like where are the enemies? Okay, so they're in the levels behind the paintings.... wait, that's it?!?  ...a couple of goombas who only come after me when I get in a certain range?  It's like I have to get in their way if I want to fight them?  Then Zelda 64 comes out and I remember wandering through that middle open field part (after you defeat the tree dungeon and get to leave the town for the first time) and I was like: where the fuck are all the enemies?  You could walk from one end of that field to the other without facing a single enemy during the day...

Anyway, I do own an N64 and have a bunch of games I still go back to, so it's not like I hate the system, but comparing it to the NES?  Comparing the N64 to the GOAT?  C'Mon, Man!!! What kind of responses could any sane gamer expect...?

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Editorials Team · Posted

NES wins, but since I love the N64, I'll toss it a bone. Yeah, those 3D games look bad compared to today's 3D. Of course they do. It takes a special flavor of nostalgia to think (like me) that there's something endearing about those blocky, polygonal characters. But it's been said already, I like it because I played it as a kid.

NES games aged well because for the most part, the graphics weren't trying to look like actual things. Look at first-person racing games on NES. Does anyone have anything positive to say about those? How the track tries to simulate the look of a turn coming up, and it jerks toward you, little by little? Or how the orientation of the car never seems to line up with the direction it's supposed to be going? They look terrible and they didn't age well. Most NES games are so far removed from real-looking things that they still look as abstract as ever, and that's great!

It's like how Wind Waker took heat for looking like a cartoon, but now it has a "timeless" look, because it... still looks like a cartoon!

Look at N64 games that aren't 3D platformers. Paper Mario looks fine. 2D puzzle games like Dr. Mario and Mickey's Tetris hardly age at all. Mischief Makers and Yoshi's Story are... passable. But 95% of N64 games took advantage of the processing power to attempt an open 3D game using polygonal characters, and so they all pale in comparison to modern games that also do that. Even when I was in high school, people would say "they should make a side-scrolling Mario like Mario World, but fill the whole cartridge with that! That would be a huge game!" But we all know it would have been blasted for looking too old or something. And years later it would be regarded as one of the better N64 games.

So yeah, NES wins the aging contest and that's ok. A lot of NES fans think that Atari 2600 games don't look good and aren't worth playing. N64 is the Atari 2600 of 3D graphics.

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15 hours ago, Dr. Morbis said:

Comparing the N64 to the GOAT?  C'Mon, Man!!! What kind of responses could any sane gamer expect...?

To hear a lot of these people talk, they seem to think the N64 IS the goat...the original definition of a "goat" in the sports world...

peanuts.gif

 

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Events Helper · Posted
7 minutes ago, Estil said:

To hear a lot of these people talk, they seem to think the N64 IS the goat...the original definition of a "goat" in the sports world...

peanuts.gif

 

Not true, I just get tired of hearing how bad it is.......I respect everyones opinion except when it comes to the N64 😉  jk, jk

But it isn't by far the worst system out there.

Granted its not for everyone, i get it, but still it was a decent system, and I am so glad to have played it, and still have the opportunity to explore the library, no matter how big or small it is.

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While objectively, I think the N64 has aged more poorly than NES (for reasons stated in this thread), personally, if given a choice between NES and N64, I'd go with N64. I just can't let go of Goldeneye, WWF No Mercy, and Pilotwings. (Also Perfect Dark and OOT, even though they've been remastered on newer systems)

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Guests · Posted

I'm a big fan of the N64 and still have my original console from 1997. I don't think it has aged worse than the NES, it depends on the game. I still play F-Zero X and Mario Kart 64 regularly on my console.

I recently bought an RGB modded console and a RAD2X cable (using it with smoothing on) and the image quality on my 4K TV is quite nice. This combined with an EverDrive64 and a Retro Fighters controller is awesome, although I really don't have any issues with the original controller.

 

 

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Graphics Team · Posted

I'd say the NES has escaped "aging" visually because its graphics have become an aesthetic of their own (especially in the indie-game scene and 80s/90s nostalgia-driven media).

Where the NES shows its age is in game mechanics, like unforgiving continue-systems and an emphasis on mastering a game to make any significant progress at all (the kind of stuff that reinforces the idea of "NES-hard" today).

N64 visuals haven't really formed into an aesthetic that pays homage to early 3D yet. It could only be a matter of time, though, considering the "Windows 95" look got a huge revival a few years back with stuff like vaporwave music. But the barrier for blocky polygon graphics getting that same treatment is the difficulty in replicating them. It's easy to visually recreate pixel art and early computer interfaces, but 3D modeling and texturing, even at a low-poly level, isn't so straightforward.

I don't have much experience playing N64 games, but I'd actually guess that their game mechanics are less dated than those of most NES games. Maybe someone with more experience in modern gaming can weigh in on that...

-CasualCart

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On 12/3/2020 at 2:23 AM, Homer said:

Another vote for the NES.  It's library is amazing. So many awesome 80s arcade ports. 

Speaking of which I can't believe for whatever reason the ports of Dig Dug and (my wife's all time favorite) Space Invaders never made it to the US.

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