A little help from anyone that knows their capacitors? (FIXED after 4 years)

[Nes Freak | 584]

the extra caps on the buffer chips fixed it.  after some further testing it will be sold off   because i have two m82 and i dont want to hord them lol.  i also recapped the original power supply and reinstalled that too.

 

Quick update: console5 returned my message and said check the back side of the caps.  so i did and there all 103 caps.  and for any one that has a power supply or m82 that needs recapping for the m82 they believe it or not have cap kits for the m82 XD  and these guy ive used them before they sel highl quality Japanese caps.  i recapped my game gear and genesis m1 va3 and had no issues so far

 

I'm not familiar with the number on these ceramic capacitors so i dont know know how to find them or where to look for quality ones.  these are on certain models on the buffer chips of the nes m82 demo unit. i currently have two of these units but one doesn't have these extra caps despite being identical  i have a theory that if these are put in place it will fix that issue ive been trying to fix for the past 4 years with the graphical artifacts on the certain games on the last 4 slots. all the chips have been replaced and its been worked on by two professionals (volder and ben heck) so this is my last shot.  if this fixes the problem  then any one with a  earlier version of the m82 can do that same to fix their units too.  i know mine isnt the only one with the issue as ive seen this issue with other users that have m82 machines on the last 4 slots.

so some help would be appreciated!

thanks!

Edited December 4, 2020 by Nes Freak

[Tabonga | 2,313]

I did find this:

https://www.dummies.com/programming/electronics/components/electronics-components-how-to-read-capacitance-values-on-a-capacitor/

If there are any electronic supply houses (if they even exist anymore) near you they should be able to help you.

[Nes Freak | 584]

4 hours ago, Tabonga said:

I did find this:

https://www.dummies.com/programming/electronics/components/electronics-components-how-to-read-capacitance-values-on-a-capacitor/

If there are any electronic supply houses (if they even exist anymore) near you they should be able to help you.

yeah i looked at that already the problem is these capacitors have weird values.  i even found a calculator but it only recognized the 103 one.

[Tabonga | 2,313]

Did you try emaiing Nintendo - they may have the schematics lying about - maybe a long shot but you never know.

[arch_8ngel | 1,597]

I'm surprised that M82 doesn't have a "cap kit" that someone has put together that covers all of the capacitors that may need replacement.  (with arcade monitor boards, for example, once you've taken it apart to do the work, you might as well replace all of the capacitors at once)

[SNESNESCUBE64 | 532]

So I doubt that it is a ceramic capacitor issue, however, I just did a repair on a donkey kong arcade board where that helped with an issue in which adding a capacitor helped with a flakey signal:

However, the three numbers on the capacitor is a code of the value. For example, 103 is 10nF. The "025" for example however doesn't seem to follow the standard however as typically they don't start with a 0. If they are between a signal and ground and I had to make a wild guess, they are values in the picofarad range because once you get too high, it will probably stop doing what it's supposed to be doing. Bear in mind this is just a guess on my part, good luck on the project!

Edited November 27, 2020 by SNESNESCUBE64

[Abelardo | 154]

Maybe ask here for help identifying those, it's an arcade help repair group, lots of knowledgeable folks there: 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1677337495815647

 

Also what is the exact model of the buffer chips? By looking at the pinout and where these caps were soldered it could be easier to deduce what they were trying to fix.

Edited November 27, 2020 by Abelardo

[Nes Freak | 584]

6 hours ago, arch_8ngel said:

I'm surprised that M82 doesn't have a "cap kit" that someone has put together that covers all of the capacitors that may need replacement.  (with arcade monitor boards, for example, once you've taken it apart to do the work, you might as well replace all of the capacitors at once)

that would be an absolute nightmare lol  there around 50 ceramic based caps on the board.  a cap kit would be nice though.  maybe i can contact console5 since they specialize in quality cap kits.  tbh im not replacing any caps but adding to it.  like i said some version of this m82 have these extra caps.  and considering they are on the buffer chips i was hoping adding these extra caps would fix it.  im a stubborn person and im not willing to give up on this lol.

[Nes Freak | 584]

6 hours ago, SNESNESCUBE64 said:

So I doubt that it is a ceramic capacitor issue, however, I just did a repair on a donkey kong arcade board where that helped with an issue in which adding a capacitor helped with a flakey signal:

However, the three numbers on the capacitor is a code of the value. For example, 103 is 10nF. The "025" for example however doesn't seem to follow the standard however as typically they don't start with a 0. If they are between a signal and ground and I had to make a wild guess, they are values in the picofarad range because once you get too high, it will probably stop doing what it's supposed to be doing. Bear in mind this is just a guess on my part, good luck on the project!

i had a friend look at them thats currently in collage to become a electronic engineer.

1 milli Ferad

10 nano ferad

200 nano ferad

where the answers he came up with.  however he said he think his answer was correct but he said he wasnt 100% sure.

[Nes Freak | 584]

5 hours ago, Abelardo said:

Maybe ask here for help identifying those, it's an arcade help repair group, lots of knowledgeable folks there: 
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1677337495815647

 

Also what is the exact model of the buffer chips? By looking at the pinout and where these caps were soldered it could be easier to deduce what they were trying to fix.

these are the buffer chips.

 

sn74als251n  (019 103)

cd74hct139e  (025)

 

[Abelardo | 154]

Following the 3 digit notation, first and second digit are the value, and the 3rd is the multiplier, it's odd to have zeroes at the beginning but I believe these would be equivalent:

019 = 108

025 = 204

http://kiloohm.info/3-digit-capacitor/019

http://kiloohm.info/3-digit-capacitor/025

 

[Nes Freak | 584]

1 hour ago, Abelardo said:

Following the 3 digit notation, first and second digit are the value, and the 3rd is the multiplier, it's odd to have zeroes at the beginning but I believe these would be equivalent:

019 = 108

025 = 204

http://kiloohm.info/3-digit-capacitor/019

http://kiloohm.info/3-digit-capacitor/025

thank you i will look in to it.  is there a way to find out the values using some kind of device?

 

[Abelardo | 154]

10 minutes ago, Nes Freak said:

thank you i will look in to it.  is there a way to find out the values using some kind of device?

 

Yeah there are some high end multimeters that can read caps, you'd have to desolder them as well so no other components interfere with the reading. I just thought about something, why you don't swap these caps to the other board that is failing? Just to see if this will solve the problem.

[Nes Freak | 584]

2 minutes ago, Abelardo said:

Yeah there are some high end multimeters that can read caps, you'd have to desolder them as well so no other components interfere with the reading. I just thought about something, why you don't swap these caps to the other board that is failing? Just to see if this will solve the problem.

ah ok.  and yes i would but considering i cant fine these i dont want to risk breaking them.

[Nes Freak | 584]

quick update: console5 returned my message and said check the back side of the caps.  so i did and there all 103 caps.  and for any one that has a power supply that needs recapping for the m82 they believe it or not have cap kits for the m82 XD

[SNESNESCUBE64 | 532]

Very nice. Hopefully that fixes your issue.

[Nes Freak | 584]

On 11/30/2020 at 5:11 AM, SNESNESCUBE64 said:

Very nice. Hopefully that fixes your issue.

it did   i wish i had known that 5000 dollars earlier

Edited December 4, 2020 by Nes Freak

[darkchylde28 | 1,546]

Wasn't yours one of the systems that Ben Heck was supposed to have fixed, but didn't actually resolve the issue you sent it in for?  Might want to give him a heads up as to what was going on.

[Nes Freak | 584]

1 hour ago, darkchylde28 said:

Wasn't yours one of the systems that Ben Heck was supposed to have fixed, but didn't actually resolve the issue you sent it in for?  Might want to give him a heads up as to what was going on.

ben heck and voutar's mod shop both worked on it.  neither found the issue and yes i did alert ben heck that it didnt fix the issue.  in fact thwe issues in the video were caused by him re flowing the connection and shorting a connection by bridging by accident.  he claimed to not have seen that issue.  and i havent had any responces back from him.  im not sure if hes busy or just ignoring me.  it doesn't matter any more  its fixed and thats all i care about.  it would have been nice it i didnt need to spend so much finding out the issue though

[darkchylde28 | 1,546]

14 minutes ago, Nes Freak said:

ben heck and voutar's mod shop both worked on it.  neither found the issue and yes i did alert ben heck that it didnt fix the issue.  in fact thwe issues in the video were caused by him re flowing the connection and shorting a connection by bridging by accident.  he claimed to not have seen that issue.  and i havent had any responces back from him.  im not sure if hes busy or just ignoring me.  it doesn't matter any more  its fixed and thats all i care about.  it would have been nice it i didnt need to spend so much finding out the issue though

Sadly, I'm inclined to believe the latter, seeing as he's no longer working for an outside company, so him creating more problems on a rare, classic piece of hardware than existed when it reached him would not help him with maintaining or increasing the name and reputation that he trades on.  I seem to recall in one of the two videos he discovered that he'd shorted something together due to reflowing a ton of solder joints and not checking for bridging, but don't know whether that one was yours or not.  I don't recall all the specifics of your issue at this moment but it was fresh in my mind at the time I saw his videos and was shaking my head at him either ignoring the issues you'd specifically pointed out or simply not paying enough attention to realize that he wasn't truly getting to the heart of the matter.

As for Voultar, the less said from me about him the better.  He may do a lot of stuff, but generally all I see him do is fairly basic fixes (which admittedly do take a careful hand) while heavily criticizing anyone else in the trade, as if he's God's gift to the iron.  Not terribly shocked that it returned with a bill but not repaired.

Either way, at least it's fixed.  Good on you for being able to catch the differences between multiple units upon having seen them when two revered internet personaliities failed to do so.

[Nes Freak | 584]

2 hours ago, darkchylde28 said:

Sadly, I'm inclined to believe the latter, seeing as he's no longer working for an outside company, so him creating more problems on a rare, classic piece of hardware than existed when it reached him would not help him with maintaining or increasing the name and reputation that he trades on.  I seem to recall in one of the two videos he discovered that he'd shorted something together due to reflowing a ton of solder joints and not checking for bridging, but don't know whether that one was yours or not.  I don't recall all the specifics of your issue at this moment but it was fresh in my mind at the time I saw his videos and was shaking my head at him either ignoring the issues you'd specifically pointed out or simply not paying enough attention to realize that he wasn't truly getting to the heart of the matter.

As for Voultar, the less said from me about him the better.  He may do a lot of stuff, but generally all I see him do is fairly basic fixes (which admittedly do take a careful hand) while heavily criticizing anyone else in the trade, as if he's God's gift to the iron.  Not terribly shocked that it returned with a bill but not repaired.

Either way, at least it's fixed.  Good on you for being able to catch the differences between multiple units upon having seen them when two revered internet personaliities failed to do so.

when i worked with voultar 4 years ago he was decent but he had an under lying attitude.  he send it back with missing screws claiming they were striped (which i know they wernt. i think he lost them) and getting piss off at me criticizing him for not fixing the issue and naturally wanting a refund.

there were alot of things done off camera with ben heck.  when i sent it to him it only had the issue with the last 4 slots having some artifacting with certain games.  the issues in the video i have no idea where those came from.  he personally told me he made that mistake on the solder bridge.  i was very surprised when it came back with the same issue.  i asked him about the capacitors first he said send him a picture but i never got a reply.  he also sad if need be he would refund me.  but again he stopped replying so honestly  i dont know what to think of ben heck.

 

when i got it back it had further issues but i was able to fix them.

[darkchylde28 | 1,546]

Wow, I'm honestly amazed that Ben Heck charged you to get his hands on a rare machine to be able to make content for his channel.  Yikes.  Re: Voultar, yeah, his attitude turned me off of his stuff completely.  He's not figuring out any of the science, he's just following instructions and having a steady hand with a lot of practice--stuff anybody can do with patience and persistence.  I can see criticizing stuff that's obviously been butchered, but no need to act like you're the only person capable of doing something.

[Nes Freak | 584]

On 12/4/2020 at 8:09 PM, darkchylde28 said:

Wow, I'm honestly amazed that Ben Heck charged you to get his hands on a rare machine to be able to make content for his channel.  Yikes.  Re: Voultar, yeah, his attitude turned me off of his stuff completely.  He's not figuring out any of the science, he's just following instructions and having a steady hand with a lot of practice--stuff anybody can do with patience and persistence.  I can see criticizing stuff that's obviously been butchered, but no need to act like you're the only person capable of doing something.

well i mean isnt it normal to charge for a service?  but considering it wasnt fixed then i agree.  but its too late to go back on him now 6 months is up for paypal

[darkchylde28 | 1,546]

1 hour ago, Nes Freak said:

well i mean isnt it normal to charge for a service?  but considering it wasnt fixed then i agree.  but its too late to go back on him now 6 months is up for paypal

It is if it's purely for service, but in the case of something like an M82 or a one- or few-off prototype, most YouTubers help folks out with that stuff purely so they get the exposure doing it.  I could see perhaps charging for the materials involved (if it were something expensive, anyway, most components are literal pennies), but the labor?  When you're filming it specifically to get paid for traffic to your video?  Nah, not a chance.  Guess times are tough for internet celebrities.